Table saw vs. band saw for the Festool owner

K

Kodi Crescent

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Aug 6, 2010
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Hi.  I'm looking to add a new tool to my workshop.  I don't have either a bandsaw or a table saw (or a jointer).  I have a small area in a 2 car garage.

I have many of the Festool products.  2 MFT's, the TS 55/75, many rails, a few of the routers, sanders, 850 planer, etc.  I have a router table.  A drill press is coming soon.

I don't have a good workbench (other than the MFT's), and I'm considering a Roubo bench build.

I'm currently working on built-ins in my house.  After that, I'll move to bathroom cabinets.  During Pinewood Derby season, I'll need to make cars.

I'm thinking about either a Sawstop cabinet saw, or a Laguna LT 18 (Italian).  If I bought the Laguna, I'd get the Resaw King blade.

I'm not really sure what I should get next given my upcoming projects and limited space.  Can those of you with more experience please provide some advice?

Thanks!
 
If you are doing a Roubo, you would certainly use a joiner and perhaps a planer.  And if you are doing resawing, you'll also likely need either a planer or a wide belt sander.  I built a traditional woodworking bench years ago and the table saw was essential.

I have both a table saw and bandsaw and use them both, even with Festool's.  You can resaw with the table saw by cutting from either side of a piece and it will give you a cleaner cut than the bandsaw.

I think I'd recommend the table saw first and build your Roubo.  That will tell you a lot about whether you need additional stationary tools.

Welcome to the slippery slope.

neil
 
Bandsaw.

You can do a lot with your TS's and MFT's that you would do with a table saw ... the same can'd be said about a bandsaw, it's a fairly unique tool.

Plus I'm going to guess that the panels on those carts will have some interesting shapes!

If you do go the table saw path, consider a slider - much better material control.
 
Hi Kodi

I got rid of my big table saw over 3 years ago at the time that I got into Festool and in particular when I bought the TS and rails. I have not had a single moment when I wished it were still here.

I have a bandsaw and a planer/thicknesser as well as a CMS-TS. My bandsaw is a modest little thing yet I can resaw quite substantial pieces on it. After resawing one needs the planer/thicknesser to finish off.

For your proposed usage the TS55R and some rails will provide you with great cutting capability. Your space is limited and a big table saw will use more space than its utility deserves. Also, for the cost of a Sawstop you can easily buy a good quality (but modest) bandsaw AND a planer/thicknesser (Jet are great).

Peter
 
Kodi Crescent said:
I don't have a good workbench (other than the MFT's), and I'm considering a Roubo bench build.
Click to expand...

Why do you need one? Based on the projects, I doubt you need a Roubo bench. If however you want to build one 'cause you're like me and just like them then that's different  [big grin] What kind of wood were you thinking of using to build your bench? If you are gonna use hard maple or beech, you will need a planner or a supplier that can s4s your stock.

Kodi Crescent said:
I'm currently working on built-ins in my house.  After that, I'll move to bathroom cabinets.  During Pinewood Derby season, I'll need to make cars.

I'm thinking about either a Sawstop cabinet saw, or a Laguna LT 18 (Italian).  If I bought the Laguna, I'd get the Resaw King blade.
Click to expand...

Based on your projects, I would get a table saw first. Ya I know you can cut everything without one, but I find it to be a royal PIA to rip thin strips with a TS55/75, and for me it's just faster to use my table saw.

I wouldn't get a band saw unless your build priorities change. A good jig saw and some pattern bits on your router table goes a long way.
Tim
 
Table saw first and then a wide long bed Jointer next.  When you think about resawing, how do you imagine getting the surfaces straight and flat?  Resawing is something you probably won't do often given your limited tool set but, a table saw will be used almost every day and a jointer will be mostly appreciated when you get tired of trying to use non-straight hard wood.

Jack
 
Thanks all who have replied so far.  I forgot to add that I have a Kapex, a Makita benchtop planer, and a scroll saw.

In regards to the Roubo build, I'm looking at doing that because although the MFT's have all sorts of clamping and such, they aren't stable enough for any hand planing...unless I got a jointer and didn't need to plane...tempting, but I'm not sure I have the space for  a dedicated jointer (hence why I own an HL 850).  I have tired of using crooked wood, and have been working on my hand planing skills to get out twist and such so I can send it through the planer.  Planing on MFT's is pretty frustrating.

Ripping strips is a huge pain...I could rip them on a bandsaw, and then joint them on a router table or HL 850...or cut them on a tablesaw.  Or continue to cut them with the TS55/75 and play the rail/strip balancing game, which isn't any fun.

I don't know that I'm going to be doing any resawing as of yet.  I need to crank out the cabinet-type projects first.  These will probably all be painted, as my house is full of painted trim.

As I write this I'm starting to lean towards the tablesaw...Any info that would sway me back the other way?
 
Since you mentioned you were looking at the SawStop, just an FYI that right now SawStop is running a special where if you buy a professional cabinet saw you get either a free over-arm dust collector or free mobile base. 

I have the 3hp professional cabinet saw and love it.  If you are looking at the professional line I would highly recommend the 3hp over the 1.75 hp.  While you can re-wire the 1.75 hp for 220v there is still a big difference in the power and how smoothly the saw operates.

I have no idea how long the special is running but I do know that SawStop is a stickler for the dates and if you miss the deadline by a day or 2 you are out of luck. 
 
I have a 5hp unisaw. I prefer to work with hardwoods over plywood. So not having a table saw would be miserable for me. My main use for my track saw is straight lining boards and taper cuts. I also find the table saw easier for dadoes and rabbets. The 5hp makes a big dado/rabbet in one pass. I have a 50inch beismeyer fence and makes sizing plywood really easy.  Just chop it in half and work from the center. The cut is better with the track saw on plywood, but it doesn't matter for a drawer bottom or other hidden edges. I could actually do without my track saw before my table saw, but the I have over $4K in the table saw. If I had my old craftsman contractor the story would be different.

Kevin
 
On the band saw side, the Rikon 14inch is very impressive for it's cost. Woodcraft discounts them well very regularly. Put a 3/4 inch timber wolf in there and you can resaw some big stuff easily. I think its close to 12 inches thick. The saw has a small footprint and maneuvers easily on a mobile base. You will run into cuts you cannot make with the 14inch capacity, but a jigsaw will fill the spot.
 
As I take a really long hard look at what it is that I need to do in the house, and the time that I have, I think I'm coming to the conclusion that a table saw is necessary.

When I first got into Festools I had just sold an old Ryobi BT3100 tablesaw that didn't have wheels.  It was a real pain to store.  I got rid of it in and invested in the Festool stuff under the belief that a TS 55, an MFT, and parallel guides would replace a table saw.

Would it?  Sort of.  For a European cabinet maker, who doesn't need to make face frames it does.  Once you have to add a face frame to something and you have to rip some narrow hardwood, well, you can do it, but it isn't easy or efficient.  And if you have to make a back band to cover a gap between the face frame and the wall, you waste a lot of time.  I don't have unlimited time.  I have multiple rooms that need cabinets, bookcases, and built-ins.  Many of them have been torn apart and are in some state of being unfinished.  My wife has been patient.  I need to bite the bullet and get a table saw.

I'm not so sure I need a bandsaw any longer.  I don't make nice furniture or any crafty projects at the moment.  The table saw makes the most production sense.  Plus, I want one.
 
I have multiples of everything, 3 jointers, 3 table saws, 2 tenoners, 3 planers, couple bandsaws. 

I spend more time in front of my big 36" band saw then any other machine.  Bandsaws can be used to do almost any task you need. 

I started with a 24", then a 32" and now a 36".  If I could get a 42" machine into my shop I would in an instant. 

I vote bandsaw, the bigger the better.
 
18" bandsaw would be my limit.  I have a small area in a 2 car garage.  I have to be able to park the cars in there, too.
 
  Option 1----While I have much love and respect for a bandsaw, I'm voting for you to get a decent table saw first. It's the question of rail length on the saw since you state you don't have much room in your garage. 30 or 36" will take up less space and still allow you decent panel cutting for many cabinets.
50/52" will handle even larger panels, but those longer rails take up some room.
If you don't have decent dust collection for a machine tool, buy a 1 1/2HP to 2 HP Duct Collector with good filtering to protect yourself and keep that new table saw from leaving dust all over the place.

Option 2- You have some Festools, you CAN cut cabinet parts with them. Yes, thin rips can be a pain, but other than drawer parts, you probably won't stress while cutting sides, tops, etc since they're wider/larger.
Get the bandsaw to allow you to cut curves, resaw, work with live edges of less finished wood than 2s or 4s and use your HL850 to dress that up.  I still regret taking so long to finally buy my Bandsaw in my shop. I own one of those 14" Rikon models by the way.  The "Darcy/Warner" Cast Iron Special Bandsaws would be harder to get into my basement shop...... [embarassed].  But, still very cool if my concrete floors could support one of his monster machines.  [wink]
You have the option of getting larger wood for a heavy work bench already preworked to the size you need by way of a larger shop or supplier cutting it for you. You then could assemble that wood into your work bench and not fabricate all the wood parts unless you really want the experience of full scratch from start to finish.[ Which is really cool in its own right.. [wink]]
 
Yeah, you are not getting a 36" machine into a basement, well ok I have seen several people do just that, but they were committed. 

In all honesty, my 36" saw does not take up much more space then the 24" or 32" machine.

A 20" northfield or 18" oliver take up about the same amount of room as that 18" Rye thingy that was mentioned and could be had for less.

I know they are not for everyone, but there is something to be said about a 1000 pound saw vs. a 500 pounder of the same class. 

I still vote bandsaw.  I can make things that no one else around can do because of my machine. 

A unisaw or pm66 with a regular sized top are not space killers, easy to move about and can serve multiple purposes as well.

Besides, cars go out side a garage is for tools.
 
Within the past year, I have started to redo the way I do my work since I purchased a TS55REQ and MFT/3, 1440 router. I still have my table saw, but was going to have to replace it and really couldn't justify the $3,000 for a Sawstop not to mention figuring out how to get it down into my basement shop (space not the consideration). Since I bought the TS55, I have found that I have only used my old table saw once and could probably have found another way to do that job also with a router or even my band saw. I have found the band saw had become a much more used tool; safer than a table saw and, in many ways, more versatile. I can set it up for resawing and then, change blades when I need to do something else. This is, of course, a little more setup and time than just using the table saw, but, once you do this a few times it isn't really all that bad. If you feel you need a table saw, I'd consider a smaller one that doesn't take up a lot of space. There are some better ones out there now than there used to be and, for the small number of times I think you will use it once you convert your methods to the track saw, router, band saw, and some hand tools like chisels and planes, I think you might find the table saw to be something that doesn't play as much of a part in the work anymore. Just my opinion though after years of using a table saw and now not using one.
 
grbmds said:
Within the past year, I have started to redo the way I do my work since I purchased a TS55REQ and MFT/3, 1440 router. I still have my table saw, but was going to have to replace it and really couldn't justify the $3,000 for a Sawstop not to mention figuring out how to get it down into my basement shop (space not the consideration). Since I bought the TS55, I have found that I have only used my old table saw once and could probably have found another way to do that job also with a router or even my band saw. I have found the band saw had become a much more used tool; safer than a table saw and, in many ways, more versatile. I can set it up for resawing and then, change blades when I need to do something else. This is, of course, a little more setup and time than just using the table saw, but, once you do this a few times it isn't really all that bad. If you feel you need a table saw, I'd consider a smaller one that doesn't take up a lot of space. There are some better ones out there now than there used to be and, for the small number of times I think you will use it once you convert your methods to the track saw, router, band saw, and some hand tools like chisels and planes, I think you might find the table saw to be something that doesn't play as much of a part in the work anymore. Just my opinion though after years of using a table saw and now not using one.
Click to expand...

This is very much my experience. I do have the CMS-TS which I find invaluable for thin strips and rebate work.

As I said in my previous post, the bandsaw is brilliant for so many tasks and I do not miss my old big table saw at all.

Peter
 
WarnerConstCo. said:
Yeah, you are not getting a 36" machine into a basement, well ok I have seen several people do just that, but they were committed. 

In all honesty, my 36" saw does not take up much more space then the 24" or 32" machine.

A 20" northfield or 18" oliver take up about the same amount of room as that 18" Rye thingy that was mentioned and could be had for less.

I know they are not for everyone, but there is something to be said about a 1000 pound saw vs. a 500 pounder of the same class. 

I still vote bandsaw.  I can make things that no one else around can do because of my machine. 

A unisaw or pm66 with a regular sized top are not space killers, easy to move about and can serve multiple purposes as well.

Besides, cars go out side a garage is for tools.
Click to expand...
  Besides, cars go out side a garage is for tools.
  LOL    [big grin] [big grin] [big grin]
 
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