Table Top

[Tinker]

I am building a trestle table for a relative.  So far, I have the frame all constructed with a couple of coats of finish applied.

[attachimg=1]

The top is going to be+/- 34" x 76" by 5/4.  It will be maple with a cherry border inc he breadboard ends.  The table will reside n the dining room most of the time.  They throw at least two or three outdoor parties during the summers (They live elsewhere except for about three months of the summer.  They want to be able to break the table down to be moved out side for their lawn parties. 

The bottom leg assembly has been little problem and is easily collapsed and reassembled.  Together, the parts are quite heavy, but the three pieces are reasonably light weight when disassembled for moving.

The top will be a different story.  The individual boards are quite heavy.  Once glued together, the weight will be more than some of us will be comfortable carrying.  Probably none it the immediate crowd will be able to carry alone (We are all around 39  :)  I am thinking of splitting the top into two pieces, split in the middle.  I have not used my Domino 500 yet, but will be spending some time in practice this afternoon and tomorrow. 

My question: I have the assortment of Dominos for the 500.  Will the largest (is it 10mm?) Domino be strong enough to allow the top to be picked up and carried if held flat.  I cannot expect everybody to think to turn it on edge to carry except to go thru doorways (two doorways between DR and outside lawn.  Should I put two rows (a top row and a bottom row)of dominos? or will one row do?

You may notice several kinds of trees are being used on the table.  There is a reason with a long story involved.  Maybe for later when table has been installed.

Tinker

 

[mike_aa]

My question: I have the assortment of Dominos for the 500.  Will the largest (is it 10mm?) Domino be strong enough to allow the top to be picked up and carried if held flat.  I cannot expect everybody to think to turn it on edge to carry except to go thru doorways (two doorways between DR and outside lawn.  Should I put two rows (a top row and a bottom row)of dominos? or will one row do?

I would think most of the strength will be in the glue joint, but I'm sure others with more experience will chime in.

You may notice several kinds of trees are being used on the table.  There is a reason with a long story involved.  Maybe for later when table has been installed.

Can't wait.  Your stories are a fun read!

Mike A.

 

[rvieceli]

Here's my suggestion about what I think you want to do. If you want to make the top in two sections split down the middle the long way, I'd leave an actual small space or butt he middle edge together and round over or chamfer the edge. When it comes time to move just loosen the top from the base and remove the two sections.

As for the glued joints in the top, the reality is that the dominoes aren't actually adding that much strength. The biggest contribution is in alignment, which you can also get from using cauls in the glue up. With modern glues the surrounding wood would probably break before the actual joint line.

 

[Tinker]

Thanks for the info.

I have made lots of trays and lazy susans with no types of splines.  A few of those have held together for 20 years and more with no separations.  I have never done anything as big as a table top. 
Tinker

 

[Sparktrician]

I'm with [member=3192]rvieceli[/member] on splitting the top lengthwise because you have no center support for the top.  Further, I'd use the dominoes for alignment (glued on one side only, and with the unglued side of the dominoes sanded lightly to aid in assembly/disassembly) and use metallic plates underneath to hold the sides together when in use. 

 

[Cheese]

I'm with [member=3192]rvieceli[/member] on splitting the top lengthwise because you have no center support for the top.  Further, I'd use the dominoes for alignment (glued on one side only, and with the unglued side of the dominoes sanded lightly to aid in assembly/disassembly) and use metallic plates underneath to hold the sides together when in use. 

Possibly like this:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=40033&cat=3,43586,43588&ap=1

Or this:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=40032&cat=3,43586,43588&ap=1

 

[Sparktrician]

I'm with [member=3192]rvieceli[/member] on splitting the top lengthwise because you have no center support for the top.  Further, I'd use the dominoes for alignment (glued on one side only, and with the unglued side of the dominoes sanded lightly to aid in assembly/disassembly) and use metallic plates underneath to hold the sides together when in use. 

Possibly like this:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/Wood/page.aspx?p=40033&cat=3,43586,43588&ap=1

Or this:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=40032&cat=3,43586,43588&ap=1

That cast round table latch (second link) is even better than what I was thinking.  Good find, Cheese!!! 

 

[Tinker]

@ Cheese,
I have been thinking of something like those @ Lee Valley.  I like the round ones best. They will not only pull the center together, but will help to align the two pieces to a level plane.
A great find.  Thanks

@ Sparktrician,
The legs sections are only 4' apart.  Each half of the top will be 3 boards +/-5/4" thick.  I am planing down rough lumber that is mostly straight grained but with a few dings along the edges.  I don't want to get too complicated, not only to work within my supposed capabilities  :, but to simplify the breaking down and reassembling in use.

The top supports are doubled up Walnut and i have been trying to think of a way to hold both sections of the top together but easy to breakdown and reassemble.  I had first thought of using table clips, the type that is sort of "Z" shaped to hold the top to the side skirts but allows movement when shrinkage or expansion occurs.  Then I thought of a heavy Domino at each corner at top of the leg platforms. (Excuse my terminology.  A cabinet maker I ain't) That would be four dominos.  Maybe double them up with space for expansion at the two outer Dominos.  All that would be need for break down and reassembly would be to just pick the top up and then set it back down.  With those round locks in the center, there would be no chance for either section to tip with too many elbows levering suds at the same time.  Just gotta think of such hazards [unsure] [embarassed] [big grin]

While planing the boards a week ago with my Grand Son's assistance, my old 20 year +/- old DW 734 planer bit the dust.  It was the old two blade.  I thought about getting it fixed.  I used to do such repairs myself, but two minutes of bending over iron and i can not straighten up for two days.  I decided to get a new 3 blader of same model.  If I'm going to end up all bent over, I much prefer to have it happen doing something I enjoy. I just finished planing all of the maple. WOW!!!!! what a difference.  Those boards are coming thru glass smooth and NO SNIPE.  I am thrilled. 

I am working to a deadline (mostly self imposed)  I was worried I might not make it, but all seems well today.  By tomorrow, I will be dimensioning the edges.

thanks again for all of the ideas.
Tinker

 

[rmwarren]

You may notice several kinds of trees are being used on the table.  There is a reason with a long story involved.  Maybe for later when table has been installed.

Tinker

A long story... from you that must truly be epic!  [poke]

RMW

 

[Sparktrician]

@ Sparktrician,
The legs sections are only 4' apart.  Each half of the top will be 3 boards +/-5/4" thick.  I am planing down rough lumber that is mostly straight grained but with a few dings along the edges.  I don't want to get too complicated, not only to work within my supposed capabilities  :, but to simplify the breaking down and reassembling in use.

The top supports are doubled up Walnut and i have been trying to think of a way to hold both sections of the top together but easy to breakdown and reassemble.  I had first thought of using table clips, the type that is sort of "Z" shaped to hold the top to the side skirts but allows movement when shrinkage or expansion occurs.  Then I thought of a heavy Domino at each corner at top of the leg platforms. (Excuse my terminology.  A cabinet maker I ain't) That would be four dominos.  Maybe double them up with space for expansion at the two outer Dominos.  All that would be need for break down and reassembly would be to just pick the top up and then set it back down.  With those round locks in the center, there would be no chance for either section to tip with too many elbows levering suds at the same time.  Just gotta think of such hazards [unsure] [embarassed] [big grin]

 

OK, so join the two sets of three of the six boards using dominoes and Titebond III.  Then set the dominoes into one side of a three-board set with glue, but sand the bare end of the exposed dominoes for ease of fitting.  You can use three of the round brass latches to join the halves together.  I like the idea of using dominoes in the top of the brackets to 1) locate the tabletop, and to 2) compensate for seasonal changes due to humidity and temperature.  I did somethng very similar with my coffee table, but that table's top is on forever.  In your case, I'd set the dominoes permanently into the top brackets as you suggested, then sand the exposed ends for ease of removal and replacement.  I'd also use the middle width setting on the Domino tool to cut the mortises in the bottom of the tabletop.  I'll attach a photo of my coffee table's base while it was under construction. 

 

[Tinker]

@ Sparktrician,
The legs sections are only 4' apart.  Each half of the top will be 3 boards +/-5/4" thick.  I am planing down rough lumber that is mostly straight grained but with a few dings along the edges.  I don't want to get too complicated, not only to work within my supposed capabilities  :, but to simplify the breaking down and reassembling in use.

The top supports are doubled up Walnut and i have been trying to think of a way to hold both sections of the top together but easy to breakdown and reassemble.  I had first thought of using table clips, the type that is sort of "Z" shaped to hold the top to the side skirts but allows movement when shrinkage or expansion occurs.  Then I thought of a heavy Domino at each corner at top of the leg platforms. (Excuse my terminology.  A cabinet maker I ain't) That would be four dominos.  Maybe double them up with space for expansion at the two outer Dominos.  All that would be need for break down and reassembly would be to just pick the top up and then set it back down.  With those round locks in the center, there would be no chance for either section to tip with too many elbows levering suds at the same time.  Just gotta think of such hazards [unsure] [embarassed] [big grin]

 

OK, so join the two sets of three of the six boards using dominoes and Titebond III.  Then set the dominoes into one side of a three-board set with glue, but sand the bare end of the exposed dominoes for ease of fitting.  You can use three of the round brass latches to join the halves together.  I like the idea of using dominoes in the top of the brackets to 1) locate the tabletop, and to 2) compensate for seasonal changes due to humidity and temperature.  I did somethng very similar with my coffee table, but that table's top is on forever.  In your case, I'd set the dominoes permanently into the top brackets as you suggested, then sand the exposed ends for ease of removal and replacement.  I'd also use the middle width setting on the Domino tool to cut the mortises in the bottom of the tabletop.  I'll attach a photo of my coffee table's base while it was under construction.

Holy Makeral,  you copied my desighn>>> almost.  [poke]
I was going to do some fluting on the Ash uprights, but with so many sno storms to move out of peoples way, i was just running out of time.  I like what you did with the three vertical pieces.  There have been a lot of ideas running around in my head about how to anchor the top. Between you and Cheese, i think you have nailed it for me.
Tinker

 

[Tinker]

You may notice several kinds of trees are being used on the table.  There is a reason with a long story involved.  Maybe for later when table has been installed.

Tinker

A long story... from you that must truly be epic!  [poke]

RMW

Richard,
It is a lifetime of story.  There is no way I can tell it all, as it is still ongoing. No way I can put half of it on The FOG.  It would blow all of the fuses.
Tinker

 

[Cheese]

[member=550]Tinker[/member]
I think you've got her nailed [thumbs up]

Between the [member=7493]Sparktrician[/member] last photo post suggestion where he blatantly copies your design  [big grin], the [member=3192]rvieceli[/member] split top  suggestion and the table parts from Lee Valley, you're good to go.

 

[Sparktrician]

@ Sparktrician,
The legs sections are only 4' apart.  Each half of the top will be 3 boards +/-5/4" thick.  I am planing down rough lumber that is mostly straight grained but with a few dings along the edges.  I don't want to get too complicated, not only to work within my supposed capabilities  :, but to simplify the breaking down and reassembling in use.

The top supports are doubled up Walnut and i have been trying to think of a way to hold both sections of the top together but easy to breakdown and reassemble.  I had first thought of using table clips, the type that is sort of "Z" shaped to hold the top to the side skirts but allows movement when shrinkage or expansion occurs.  Then I thought of a heavy Domino at each corner at top of the leg platforms. (Excuse my terminology.  A cabinet maker I ain't) That would be four dominos.  Maybe double them up with space for expansion at the two outer Dominos.  All that would be need for break down and reassembly would be to just pick the top up and then set it back down.  With those round locks in the center, there would be no chance for either section to tip with too many elbows levering suds at the same time.  Just gotta think of such hazards [unsure] [embarassed] [big grin]

 

OK, so join the two sets of three of the six boards using dominoes and Titebond III.  Then set the dominoes into one side of a three-board set with glue, but sand the bare end of the exposed dominoes for ease of fitting.  You can use three of the round brass latches to join the halves together.  I like the idea of using dominoes in the top of the brackets to 1) locate the tabletop, and to 2) compensate for seasonal changes due to humidity and temperature.  I did somethng very similar with my coffee table, but that table's top is on forever.  In your case, I'd set the dominoes permanently into the top brackets as you suggested, then sand the exposed ends for ease of removal and replacement.  I'd also use the middle width setting on the Domino tool to cut the mortises in the bottom of the tabletop.  I'll attach a photo of my coffee table's base while it was under construction.

Holy Makeral,  you copied my desighn>>> almost.  [poke]
I was going to do some fluting on the Ash uprights, but with so many sno storms to move out of peoples way, i was just running out of time.  I like what you did with the three vertical pieces.  There have been a lot of ideas running around in my head about how to anchor the top. Between you and Cheese, i think you have nailed it for me.
Tinker

DOMINOES, Tinker!!!  DOMINOES!!!  Not nails!!!  [poke]  [poke]

 

[Tinker]

Between you and Cheese, i think you have nailed it for me.
Tinker

DOMINOES, Tinker!!!  DOMINOES!!!  Not nails!!!  [poke]  [poke]

[scratch chin] [doh]

 

[rvieceli]

Tinker - I am a little concerned if top isn't actually attached to the base. The way everybody moves a table is to grab the top and pick it up, even if only to move it just a bit. If the top is just indexed to the base then grabbing and lifting it will just pop it off the base. Some sort of method for securing it to the base might be appropriate.

Ron

 

[Tinker]

Tinker - I am a little concerned if top isn't actually attached to the base. The way everybody moves a table is to grab the top and pick it up, even if only to move it just a bit. If the top is just indexed to the base then grabbing and lifting it will just pop it off the base. Some sort of method for securing it to the base might be appropriate.

Ron

Good point, Ron.  I think I have that already figured out.

When I went to the Lee Valley site to look at those round clips to pull/hold the two sides together, I also found some hold down latches.  They are a hook on one side and a lever on the mating part.  I am adding them to the order.  Two on each end of each of the two sections (four in all) will prevent lifting a corner of one section and leaving half of the section still attached with splinters in between.

Of course, it is always fun to see somebody lift something they expect to weigh a ton and find they are picking up only air.  That can lead to all kinds of excitement.  [scared] ;D
Tinker

 

[Tinker]

It is really great having such a large and spacious shop.
[attachimg=1]
Cutting, assembly and glue up area
[attachimg=2]
Sanding and finishing room
[attachimg=3]
Storage for parts and equipment.
I even have an organizer and cleaner-upper (if i treat her right  :)

 

[rmwarren]

It is really great having such a large and spacious shop.

Cutting, assembly and glue up area
[attachimg=2]
Sanding and finishing room
[attachimg=3]
Storage for parts and equipment.
I even have an organizer and cleaner-upper (if i treat her right  :)

Large. And Spacious.  [poke]

[attachimg=1]

RMW

 

[Tinker]

It is really great having such a large and spacious shop.

Cutting, assembly and glue up area
[attachimg=2]
Sanding and finishing room
[attachimg=3]
Storage for parts and equipment.
I even have an organizer and cleaner-upper (if i treat her right  :)

Large. And Spacious.  [poke]

[attachimg=1]

RMW

spacious as  ;D