Used Festool Prices?

[jacko9]

You ponder "Why are used Festool prices so high and why do people pay them? I know they are quality tools, but..." and I think you already know the answer, people buy Festool for the Quality/Value and when they sell them that same quality/value is still there by and large.  They retain their value because they are engineered and designed to last and give people the value for their money.

I would not sell my used Lexus GS300 at the same price I might sell my Ford Focus given similar years and mileage.

Why would people pay so much for Festool when they can pay a lot more for Mafell?

Supply and Demand.

Jack

 

[crazydave789]

often people don't do enough research and get carried away with the auction or they want an older more reliable model and are prepared to pay for it.

many older tools just keep going, my cdd12 had a bent shaft from a drop but still worked fine as the driver it was always used as, I got a 9.6 with two systainers charger and screwbox inserts for 30 quid the bayyeries were toast but it gave a new shaft and spare trigger switch which are prone to fail. last year my mcu15 failed after 20 years hard life so I got another identical charger, in a systainer with a faulty cdd12 and two batteries for 18 quid. the charger works fine and the drill - all that was wrong with it was some green varnish type stuff (nail polish) on the contacts cleaned it up and slapped the batteries on the charger, one was blown the other lasts all day.

result

I don't use 110v as dont do site work but picked up an ex rental atlas copco fixtec 600w jigsaw when I was working in a factory enviroment, it looked like it had been chucked in a cement mixer but I cleaned it, serviced it and straightened the base plate - I then proceeded to use it continuously for 8 months cutting mfc to 40mm, mdf, ply, timber and plasterboard. it never missed a beat and is in the garage waiting to be used or sold on. it cost me 15 quid. similar the bosch planer for the same job I paid £35 for, still works still awaiting new owners if anyone in the uk is interested.

 

[Wuffles]

Here in the uk people don't seem to take into account the sales tax (VAT) I've sold a few things on ebay always start at 99p. I recently bought a ts55r and sold my old ts55ebq on ebay I got £263 for it and the new one cost £256 plus VAT but I can reclaim the vat through my business so even after ebay and PayPal fees it only cost a few quid to upgrade to the newer r model.

I've bought other secondhand tools on ebay and rarely have they been as good as described.

What happens to the VAT on the saw you originally purchased and claimed the VAT back on? Don't you then have to sell it on as plus VAT as it hasn't been paid? Always confuses me.

 

[philphilop]

Here in the uk people don't seem to take into account the sales tax (VAT) I've sold a few things on ebay always start at 99p. I recently bought a ts55r and sold my old ts55ebq on ebay I got £263 for it and the new one cost £256 plus VAT but I can reclaim the vat through my business so even after ebay and PayPal fees it only cost a few quid to upgrade to the newer r model.

I've bought other secondhand tools on ebay and rarely have they been as good as described.

What happens to the VAT on the saw you originally purchased and claimed the VAT back on? Don't you then have to sell it on as plus VAT as it hasn't been paid? Always confuses me.

Dont let it confuse you, he fully explained his practice in an earlier subject, he claims back the Vat, claims tax credits on his tools also, cant remember exactly but a tool costing £350 end up costing him about £50 when he claims all the tax and tax credits. He then sells his tools on the internet and pockets all the money.
When i lived in the UK we called these people benefit cheats, now they call themselves business men.

 

[Deansocial]

I was gonna say you should be charging vat on the sale of the tool. You already get a deal buying new tools by saving the vat.

 

[DB10]

  When I run business in the UK, if your tools or truck or whatever, was owend by you through your company, these items were called "company assets, and each year these company assets would then depreciate until after a certain amount of years, can't remember how many maybe eight years or so, they would be basically "written off"
  as your assets would have depreciated so much they would no longer have any value and would not have to appear on the books.
Only after your accountant has written the assets off could you despose of them without Including VAT in the sale. This was called playing by the books.

A lot of people I think, get confused when buying tools through their company, you don't own the tools, the company does and if you go into receivership these tools can be sold off to pay off your debts. Might be all be diferent now.

 

[Locks14]

  When I run business in the UK, if your tools or truck or whatever, was owend by you through your company, these items were called "company assets, and each year these company assets would then depreciate until after a certain amount of years, can't remember how many maybe eight years or so, they would be basically "written off"
  as your assets would have depreciated so much they would no longer have any value and would not have to appear on the books.
Only after your accountant has written the assets off could you despose of them without Including VAT in the sale. This was called playing by the books.

A lot of people I think, get confused when buying tools through their company, you don't own the tools, the company does and if you go into receivership these tools can be sold off to pay off your debts. Might be all be diferent now.

You aren't wrong. However there is an extra layer, being that, just because one is registered for VAT doesn't mean their business is automatically a company.

In fact most smaller tradespeople are either sole traders or partnerships if more than one business owner. Very few tend to incorporate (even though it would likely be more tax efficient), so the tools in most cases do actually belong the builder, chippy, spark, spread, etc... as there's no legal separation

 

[philphilop]

  When I run business in the UK, if your tools or truck or whatever, was owend by you through your company, these items were called "company assets, and each year these company assets would then depreciate until after a certain amount of years, can't remember how many maybe eight years or so, they would be basically "written off"
  as your assets would have depreciated so much they would no longer have any value and would not have to appear on the books.
Only after your accountant has written the assets off could you despose of them without Including VAT in the sale. This was called playing by the books.

A lot of people I think, get confused when buying tools through their company, you don't own the tools, the company does and if you go into receivership these tools can be sold off to pay off your debts. Might be all be diferent now.

Capital allowance on business assets is 25 percent of the book value per annum, sometimes changes if the government wants to boost the economy, at the moment it is 100 percent in the first year, so as it is 25 percent of the book value it never disappears. You can however Wright it off at any time by either proof that it is time expired or by selling it on, however, if you gain from the Wright off, trade in value or sale value then this sum must be added back in to you asset register as profit from sale of assets, VAT can be added or must be included in the process if you are VAT registered, if not it comes under the money laundering act as non declaired income

 

[promhandicam]

The real question is why do people sell their tools which leads on to the next question why buy them in the first place

One of the advantages of Festool is that you can sell them on and recoup a significant proportion of the new price. I've sold several tools that were just out of warranty and replaced them with new and the difference was only about 15 - 20%. With most other tools you'd be luck to get 15 - 20% of the new cost after 3 years so don't knock it!

 

[philphilop]

The real question is why do people sell their tools which leads on to the next question why buy them in the first place

One of the advantages of Festool is that you can sell them on and recoup a significant proportion of the new price. I've sold several tools that were just out of warranty and replaced them with new and the difference was only about 15 - 20%. With most other tools you'd be luck to get 15 - 20% of the new cost after 3 years so don't knock it!

They must be virtually as new (unused) at three years old to get those prices, mine dont even last 3 years and are unreconisable after a couple of years.

 

[Klamp]

Another consideration is the aggregate savings over multiple purchases. Because who really stops at one?

I've bought new, used, and reconditioned and have had very few issues with any of them. So that boosts my confidence in buying used. If you can save $100 to $200 on each tool (depending on the tool) you can easily save enough to buy a whole other tool. At least that's what I tell myself...

 

[Locks14]

Another consideration is the aggregate savings over multiple purchases. Because who really stops at one?

I've bought new, used, and reconditioned and have had very few issues with any of them. So that boosts my confidence in buying used. If you can save $100 to $200 on each tool (depending on the tool) you can easily save enough to buy a whole other tool. At least that's what I tell myself...

That's true,  but there are not many $200 Festools nor do many of them sell second hand for $100.  The more likely scenario is an average of a $600 tool for $500.

So you have to ask yourself the question if you invested in 20 different Festool tools, would you rather have paid $10,000 for a stack of second hand tools or $12,000 for all brand new, with warranty, never been abused?

If it were a one time expense $2000 is a lot of money, but over the course of a few years... nah, as I've said before, show me the shiny.

 

[AlexThePalex]

That's true,  but there are not many $200 Festools nor do many of them sell second hand for $100.  The more likely scenario is an average of a $600 tool for $500.

I guess the market for used tools is different from country to country, but here in Holland where I live it is easy to find used Festools in the 30-50% range, depending on their state. I bought my RO150 for 275 while new it was 550. Was only used lightly for 3 days by a professional painter who wanted to use it for floors but came to the conclusion it wasn't really up to the task. No 15 day return policy 6 years ago so he had no other way to get some of his money back. There was not a spec of dust on it.   

And I got my CS70 for 1/3rd of new price from a retired contractor. This one was pretty well used, but still in top condition.

So for me it is worth it to buy used.