Weak lungs - CTM MIDI V CTM 26

[Bench]

I’ve a rubbish pair of lungs and I’m after some advice from anyone with experience.

I need an extractor for my small workshop (14m2 / 150ft2) and I’m torn between getting the CTM Midi which has a suction of 3,700 l/m or saving up and buying the CTM 26, which has a suction of 3,900 l/m.

The extractor will be used on a Kapex 60, Makita track saw, various other hand held power tools plus general workshop clean-up.

The difference in price is £200 ($265US), but would I notice a difference in suction? Like I said above I’ve a weak pair of lungs so extraction is really important, but money is also limited and paying more than £700 for an extractor in a hobbyists workshop feels extravagant.

 

[semenza]

I do not think that the difference in suction is really very much. However since it is a priority I'd go for the CT26. Also the bag capacity of the CT26 is quite a lot more than the Midi. Which mean you will maintain optimum suction for longer. And you will make up some of the price difference in some savings on bag cost.

In your situation I would avoid using a cyclone. They work well but will reduce the suction some, and could introduce more places for dust to escape.

Seth

 

[hdv]

I am in the same boat as you. My setup is a CTL26 for the hand tools. A large cyclone with a HEPA filter for the stationary machines. And a good quality air scrubber. I always have an air quality tester at hand. And I use a half mask respirator when I am making significant amounts of fine dust in the shop.

I don't think the difference between the Midi and the 26 is that important. Diligently adhering to a proper dust containment procedure will be much more important (and is hard to always do) than the difference in those machines. Both are excellent. Having a HEPA filter  (or equivalent standard) on all your DC tools is what matters most.

 

[Paul_HKI]

Asthmatic here, so I also take this stuff very seriously.

The M class filtration in this case isn’t the best option.  HEPA is where you need to be looking really.

A CTL Midi with a HEPA filter and regular bags will give the same suction as the CTM Midi, with higher level particle filtration on the exhaust side of things.  Trades in the UK and many other places go with M class as a legal requirement under occupational welfare legislation, but the bags and L/M class filters are identical.  M class gives you an audible alarm when suction drops, but in your small workshop, you will check or change your bags before that happens anyway.

Go with the CTL model and fit the HEPA filter, which is used to strip any particulates down to a smaller size than the L/M standard supplied filter.  It’s the cleanest output and the same effective suction.  You won’t have the M class suction alarm, but as a hobby woodworker you’ll buy a lot of replacement bags for the difference in price anyway.

On top of that and if your budget would have stretched to the larger model at a push, I’d suggest the Midi vs the 26, and spend the difference between those on the Record air cleaner or an equivalent.  That will greatly improve the air quality in a compact workshop space, helping remove any dust that isn’t captured by the CT at source.

 

[mino]

...
On top of that and if your budget would have stretched to the larger model at a push, I’d suggest the Midi vs the 26, and spend the difference between those on the Record air cleaner or an equivalent.  That will greatly improve the air quality in a compact workshop space, helping remove any dust that isn’t captured by the CT at source.

Second this. A vac can get you only so far as not all dust is caught. Investing in an air filter is a much better choice than a Midi versus CTL26.

Of course, ideally you want both. But an external air filter + CTL Midi will be incomparably better to a CTL 26 itself. The difference between a Midi or a CTL 26 on the other hand is pretty small.
Using a 36mm hose versus using a 27/32mm hose with your tracksaw makes a much bigger difference than a CTL Midi versus CTL 26 does. And for tasks with low air volume need there is no difference as the filters are equivalent.

 

[demographic]

Pretty sure the OP was asking about the CTM, and not the CTL.

Personally I have the CTM 26 but can't comment about the Midi cos I've never used one.
I can say that the Bluetooth remote for it is an absolute boon and means I hoover up any mess thats managed to escape.
As its so easy I use it far more often.

To be honest I assumed the M class bags were HEPA anyway?

 

[mino]

Pretty sure the OP was asking about the CTM, and not the CTL.

Personally I have the CTM 26 but can't comment about the Midi cos I've never used one.
I can say that the Bluetooth remote for it is an absolute boon and means I hoover up any mess thats managed to escape.
As its so easy I use it far more often.

To be honest I assumed the M class bags were HEPA anyway?

The only difference between a CTL and CTM (be it CT15/Mini/Midi or 26/36/48 series) is that the CTM models have a low-air-flow alarm which is mandatory for the M-Class European safety standard.

Everything else is the same including the available main filters and the bags. This means the filtration is the same too between a CTL Mini and CTM Midi or between a CTL 26 and a CTM 36 etc.

 

[FestitaMakool]

Having a CTM 26 AC (With the filter that comes with the “AC” designation)
and a CTL Midi - the 26 is remarkably quiet, not that the CT Midi is noisy - but given the size and capacity the CTM 26 AC has it’s very easy to live with in a shop.

Are there anyone else that have the same noticeable difference - 110V US versions?

Agree on the filtering, you can buy a “L”, but put in a HEPA filter and actually get slightly better filtration than “M” version. You only loose the audible beep beep beep - wich causes false alarm if one forget to adjust the hose diameter setting [big grin]. As mentioned, as long as you work as a private person in your own space - you should have all the means to exchange bags early enough, and checking the main filter regularly without needing the beep that the “M” versions have. I was advised to buy the CTL Midi by my pro dealer; the M versions main purpose is to protect workers and professionals who quickly can dig in working and forget the the whole vac in a setting until it start filling the hose..

 

[Bench]

Thanks for your reply. Do you notice much difference in suction power between the MIDI and the 26?

Having a CTM 26 AC (With the filter that comes with the “AC” designation)
and a CTL Midi - the 26 is remarkably quiet, not that the CT Midi is noisy - but given the size and capacity the CTM 26 AC has it’s very easy to live with in a shop.

Are there anyone else that have the same noticeable difference - 110V US versions?

Agree on the filtering, you can buy a “L”, but put in a HEPA filter and actually get slightly better filtration than “M” version. You only loose the audible beep beep beep - wich causes false alarm if one forget to adjust the hose diameter setting… [big grin]. As mentioned, as long as you work as a private person in your own space - you should have all the means to exchange bags early enough, and checking the main filter regularly without needing the beep that the “M” versions have. I was advised to buy the CTL Midi by my pro dealer; the M versions main purpose is to protect workers and professionals who quickly can dig in working and forget the the whole vac in a setting until it start filling the hose..

 

[Paul_HKI]

I am fortunate enough to have and use both machines together regularly.  In practice, I can’t tell any difference in performance/suction.

 

[Mini Me]

The first thing I would do is buy a good dust monitor/air monitor to assess any improvements or additions you make because that will take away any guess work. If you could add large exhaust fans in addition to your dust extraction choices that would certainly help but a filter is better than nothing. Personally I doubt any vacuum can substantially mitigate the fine dust fall out enough for you but that would have to be proven by the dust monitor. Festool vacuums do what they were meant to very well but capturing the fines from a mitre saw is an extremely hard thing to do.

 

[Mr Py]

Hi all,

As a foreword, I'd like to thank everyone for contributing to this thread on air quality. Such an important topic.

I am new to the Festool Universe. I have just bought my first Festool product, a TKS 80 EBS. I am thinking about buying a dust extractor now. Thanks to your previous replies, I consider buying the CTL 26 AC. I am an hobbyst wood worker. My needs are mostly to extract dust from the TKS and perhaps from a future Kapex. My workshop is relatively small about 16m2/172ft2.

I have read the differences between L and M grade. I will take the L one as I will install a Record power dust extractor for ambiant air.
Some of you were talking about HEPA filter. I live in France and I can't find these accessories on Festool website. Or perhaps the name is different. We only have this choice for filter : Reference 496170. Is this the HEPA filter ? If no, where can I find it ?

Thanks for your answer.

Mr Py

 

[peter halle]

I believe that the correct HEPA filter is 205412.

Peter

 

[Coen]

I believe that the correct HEPA filter is 205412.

Peter

That seems to be a 'USA / Canada / Sweden'-only product as of now.

 

[peter halle]

I believe that the correct HEPA filter is 205412.

Peter

That seems to be a 'USA / Canada / Sweden'-only product as of now.

OOPS.  I am on the Festool France site and they have one for L & M (203759) and one for H (205198).  My guess is that a phone call to the appropriate Festool location might be in order.

Peter

 

[peter halle]

Oh, 496170 which was referenced by the poster is not suitable for an AC unit.

Peter

 

[Mr Py]

Oh, 496170 which was referenced by the poster is not suitable for an AC unit.

Peter

True, the one proposed with the AC unit is this one : 203759.

Is this a HEPA filter ? I'll have a call to a Festool dealer.

 

[peter halle]

Here is a link to an article that explains the dust categories.  It appears that the finest filtration is offered by the H class.  That filter would be 205198.  BUT that one does not specify that it is for the AC models. Perhaps it can't stand up to the self cleaning process?  Calling a knowledgeable Festool dealer or Festool might get you the answers you really want.  Sorry that I haven't been overly helpful.

Maybe some of our European members can chime in on the filters.

Peter

 

[woodbutcherbower]

The dust extraction performance of everything is determined by the design of the tool it's attached to in my experience - more than a few extra % of airflow. It’s also application dependent - so a TS55, for example, will provide 95% extraction when cutting through a board, but virtually zero when trimming 3mm off the edge of it.

See here for an explanation about L, M and H-Class;
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/...-cleantec-ct-26-l-m-or-h/msg702647/#msg702647

 

[Mr Py]

Thanks a lot guys for your replies. I will take time to read your posts and especially woodbutcherbower's one on grades differences.

I also consider the CT-VA-20 in addition. But still need to see if it worth the price compared to sames products from other brand.