Which Sys Air???

M

MrToolJunkie

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Jul 6, 2009
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My Delta air cleaner gave up the ghost this week. Not worth trying to repair it. Need another air scrubber and debating between the two Festool variants. Not sure I need Hepa or not and if it is worth the added hepa filter costs down the road. I do like the added CFM of the type M and more cleans per hour. Have roughly 20 x 20 x 10 shop space. This is for 85% woodworking and 15% metal with grinding welds, etc... sometimes dust too. I have even considered getting one of each to run simultaneously, but that could be overkill. I could also go for a Jet with remote.

Thoughts?

Thanks
 
I've been pondering this question myself. On a theoretical level, a HEPA filter is supposed to remove 99.99% of .1-.5 micron particulates, which are the ones we should be most concerned about. FestoolUSA says the SYS-AIR "provides over 99.9% filration"

However, when you look at the specs, there's not much stated difference. Both units seem to share the same Preliminary (1332 in2 surface material) and Main (3812 in2) filter. There is a price difference between the two replacement main filters, and the SYS-AIR HEPA has a slower cfm of 264.8 vs 423.

Sedge has been explicit in both the Festool Live featuring the SYS-AIR and in the Concord Carpenter video from JLC in Rhode Island this past weekend, that you cannot use the HEPA Main Filter in the non-HEPA SYS AIR because the unit is what controls it. Does this mean that the filters are the same but it is the airflow allowed by the SYS-AIR that makes the difference in particulate capture? Could it be that this is a case of two labelings but the same system? I don't know.

The page for the HEPA Main Filter does state that it is more efficient with 99.995% filtration. I'm interested to hear more from those who have been able to deploy them in the field. 200+cfm is pretty miniscule and in the Festool Lives, Sedge has placed the SYS-AIR next to the workpiece so that any errant dust from the sander is immediately sucked in. This may be the ideal use for the SYS-AIR since the cfm rating is pretty low. At 200+ cfm, I wonder how long it would take to truly scrub an actual woodshop.

If I were to buy one tomorrow, I'd probably get the HEPA - but mainly because I've become very concerned about maximizing air cleanliness in the shop.
 
Yeah. I don't think the filters are interchangeable as it would act like a clogged filter using Hepa on the m. Not sure why it why not work the other way around, since the m filters in theory are more porous. I just don't know if it matters all that much in real world terms between the 2 either,  but maybe. I wish Festool had more info on its website on each unit and the different use cases.
 
Just chiming in to say I am also trying to make this decision. I don't strictly need a portable solution so had also considered something like this
https://www.woodcraft.com/products/...ir-filtration-system-754-cfm-1-ph-120v-pm1250

But the idea of being able to move it around the shop to bring it close to the work is potentially appealing. I have a ~25x40 space of which about 1/3 is woodworking, 1/3 is machining, and the rest is a mix of welding, electronics, and anything else I might do that's too messy for the living room. I was planning on having some kid of proper fume extractor for the metalworking area but there could still be grinding/sanding dust. I don't know if any of these units can help with that or if it's important to actually segregate them more.
 
I think I am going to try the "M" version - I figure it is the equivalent or better than my old Delta that died and I like the faster airflow. I can always add a HEPA later for even added performance if needed. I am not in my shop 8 hours everyday and use normal CT extraction or dust extraction from my other non-HEPA dust extractor for everything else. Will see how this goes and will report back after I have put it to some use.
 
man, I hope they come out with an option to add an activated carbon filter for these like the XPOWER models have.
 
I'm new to the ins and outs (no pun intended) of air filtering systems like these SYS-AIR units but I need to get one for a small, <400 sq. ft. space. While I like the idea of a HEPA filter I do wonder what the downside is to the noticeably lower airflow rate compared to the M model. Is it simply a matter of it taking longer to filter a given space? Or is there a more important safety factor to consider when comparing airflow rates?
 
My thoughts about this are if you're primarily working in client's homes doing high-end work, the HEPA is the way to go. Even just for optics. Seeing that HEPA badge on the side is just as much brand building for you as it is practical.

If it's in your shop, I say go with the non-HEPA. My thoughts here are... like, IDK what your shop's like, but mine is by no means some hermetically sealed environment. The main bay door isn't air tight, often a window is open, etc. so what the point of filtering to HEPA levels if the ambient air is just some milder version of what's outside. At that point I'm just looking for bulk scrubbing to get most of the particulates I'm adding out of the air.
 
bwehman said:
If it's in your shop, I say go with the non-HEPA. My thoughts here are... like, IDK what your shop's like, but mine is by no means some hermetically sealed environment. The main bay door isn't air tight, often a window is open, etc. so what the point of filtering to HEPA levels if the ambient air is just some milder version of what's outside. At that point I'm just looking for bulk scrubbing to get most of the particulates I'm adding out of the air.
Click to expand...
You make an interesting point. I work in one end of my home basement which is roughly partitioned from the "normal" areas (laundry room, HVAC closet, secondary pantry etc.). But it's still a basement so apart from a door that leads upstairs none of it is tightly sealed off so fine dust can and does sometimes find its way into the common areas, though most settles in the basement, often in the places mentioned above which is what I'm trying to minimize.
 
Eko said:
You make an interesting point. I work in one end of my home basement which is roughly partitioned from the "normal" areas (laundry room, HVAC closet, secondary pantry etc.). But it's still a basement so apart from a door that leads upstairs none of it is tightly sealed off so fine dust can and does sometimes find its way into the common areas, though most settles in the basement, often in the places mentioned above which is what I'm trying to minimize.
Click to expand...

Totally. If that were my shop, I'd save the $100 and double the CFMs and be good with getting 95%. And remember, that's just what's left after presumably using DC at the tools too.
 
In my two door garage, I have built a filtration unit with a 20" box fan and Merv 13 filters that is supposed to be HEPA level. And then I use another box fan with Merv 11 filter as a near-field scrubber to position by the workpiece.

I am curious about the SYS-AIR. Festool says you cannot put the HEPA filter in the cheaper model after the fact because it will activate the red warning light. From what I've gathered, the HEPA versions CFM is half that of the non-HEPA. If the two are pretty much identical, is the non-HEPA version just set to turn on the alert light if the airflow is different?

Seems to me that if you can live with the red light being on because the non-HEPA SYS-AIR thinks that your non-HEPA filter is "clogged" because of the lower CFM throughput - and doesn't do crazy things like shut off, you could go that route and save a hundred bucks.
 
onocoffee said:
In my two door garage, I have built a filtration unit with a 20" box fan and Merv 13 filters that is supposed to be HEPA level. And then I use another box fan with Merv 11 filter as a near-field scrubber to position by the workpiece.

I am curious about the SYS-AIR. Festool says you cannot put the HEPA filter in the cheaper model after the fact because it will activate the red warning light. From what I've gathered, the HEPA versions CFM is half that of the non-HEPA. If the two are pretty much identical, is the non-HEPA version just set to turn on the alert light if the airflow is different?

Seems to me that if you can live with the red light being on because the non-HEPA SYS-AIR thinks that your non-HEPA filter is "clogged" because of the lower CFM throughput - and doesn't do crazy things like shut off, you could go that route and save a hundred bucks.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I was thinking about that possibility too but I'll leave it to someone else to test that theory. The more I think about it the additional CFM would be of more benefit to me in my space than a smidge more filtration the HEPA provides.
 
I went with the HEPA, but it is strictly for the jobsite. I have a few Jet/'wen filters in the shop. The Sys-air wins the portability contest hands down against my Buildclean or Bluedry units and takes up much less room in the van. It doesn't move as much air and I wish it's discharge was directional as it would be more effective at removing adhesive fumes.
I wish someone would give some real world information on the actual difference between the two Sys-air units. It would helpful to know what occupations would specify one over the other...
 
Laminator said:
I went with the HEPA, but it is strictly for the jobsite. I have a few Jet/'wen filters in the shop. The Sys-air wins the portability contest hands down against my Buildclean or Bluedry units and takes up much less room in the van. It doesn't move as much air and I wish it's discharge was directional as it would be more effective at removing adhesive fumes.
I wish someone would give some real world information on the actual difference between the two Sys-air units. It would helpful to know what occupations would specify one over the other...
Click to expand...
 
I too would like more real world feedback but perhaps these units are still too new. I might hold off purchasing until there's more practical hands-on experience available.
 
Well, being a healthy? guy, if this was my problem...I'd purchase the HEPA unit and run it with the non-HEPA filter. That way I'd get the high CFM air flows that I need to clean the shop and if my health suddenly takes a down turn, I can then install a HEPA filter in the unit and scrub the air to a higher level.
 
So far the non-Hepa this has been working out really well for me - I am doing lots of sanding at the moment and place the unit right next to where I am sanding and if sucks the fine particles right in the back. Nothing really floating in the air. I used a blower to blow all the loose sawdust from sawing, etc... out of my shop - the cloud disappeared in a matter of a minute or less. I am very pleased with the performance so far. It blows/sucks a lot of air - I usually keep it on 1 for quieter operation and 2 if I am really making dust grinding or whatever. I have considered adding a Hepa to the mix and running two of them, but that is my OCD kicking in. I also have a Delta ambient air cleaner hanging from the ceiling.
 
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