Why Festool Drills?

I'll give an opposing viewpoint...please don't attack me. :)

I think it depends on the type of work you do. Some of the more mainstream brands like Milwaukee, Bosch, Dewalt, etc. have a wide array of  tools for general construction or specific trades like plumbers and electricians. I'm talking battery operated reciprocating saws, metal band saws, rotary hammer drills for concrete, circular saws, impact wrenches for nuts/bolts, inspection camera. I know Milwaukee also has a battery operated vacuum, which could be useful for certain install tasks. They even have battery operated jackets with a heater for you guys in the colder climates!

Don't get me wrong, I love the Festool items I own (track saw, MFT/3, CT-26, and a couple of sanders) and have a few more on my near term wishlist (Domino, OF 1440 Router & LR-32 kit). I've never really played around with the Festool drills, but I don't see myself taking the plunge.

Respectfully,
Anthony
 
Good point. Also, if I was running a big crew I wouldn't be providing them with festool drills.
 
Given the way some of the crews that used to work for me took care of the tools we bought them, the owner and I agreed that they would NOT be getting Festool products.  It got to the point that the installers were told that if they broke or "lost" a tool or tools, we would buy them another AND deduct the cost from their pay.  It didn't stop them from abusing their tools, but cut down the shrinkage. 
 
One of the nice thing about the brushless drills (all but CXS) is that their full power is available even at the lower RPM.  i.e: you can drive screws very slowly with greater control. 

 
mrboult said:
One of the nice thing about the brushless drills (all but CXS) is that their full power is available even at the lower RPM.  i.e: you can drive screws very slowly with greater control. 

Yeah, love that. Just barely pressing the trigger and watching it just slowly turn the screw in.

I agree that it depends somewhat on the type of work being done as to whether or not the Festool drills are worth getting over other brands.

Seth
 
Heartily agree with this last point. I had no idea the power/control was so precise on the T18 until I used it regularly. Really glad I purchased it.
 
I'm building a deck and a shed in the next two months.  Which drill other than the drill/impact model would be the ideal one for the job?

Ideally i think I'd want a C12, but I'm concerned about it maybe not being powerful enough for sinking long screws into PT and into Ipe.
 
Kevin D. said:
I'm building a deck and a shed in the next two months.  Which drill other than the drill/impact model would be the ideal one for the job?

Ideally i think I'd want a C12, but I'm concerned about it maybe not being powerful enough for sinking long screws into PT and into Ipe.

Don't sweat it. I did an Ipe deck with Ipe clips into aged pt structure. It was fine. You need to pre-drill to avoid breaking off your fasteners. We also used thru-drilled posts for the railing; all c12. 900 sq. ft. All of the balusters were fastened by way of hidden screws into end grain, over 200 with two screws in each end as well. The trigger control is a great help.
 
When I started with festool gear back in 2011, I started with the CXS, MFT/3 and TS75. The CXS was really a bit of a "spoil yourself. it's your birthday" moment and I couldn't look back on it. that little beauty has saved my bacon so many times in the workshop and on location. It's so well balanced, light, yet kicks a punch. Wow. what a gem.

I became the proud owner of the T18-3 set and centrotec kit, so between the systems, it's really made a difference. to my workflow. I now use both on the bench and on location, so I'm really pleased to take these on. OK, I did consider milwaukee for a big cordless, but what sold it on the T18.3 is digital clutch. you don't have like you do on the CXS or any competitor drills the click  limit method which over time wears the clutch and gearbox out, the digital clutch really offers me some advantages in screwdriving. So, between the two, I love them to bits. I'd really recommend both these drills to anyone looking for rotary only drills.

lew
 
greg mann said:
Kevin D. said:
I'm building a deck and a shed in the next two months.  Which drill other than the drill/impact model would be the ideal one for the job?

Ideally i think I'd want a C12, but I'm concerned about it maybe not being powerful enough for sinking long screws into PT and into Ipe.

Don't sweat it. I did an Ipe deck with Ipe clips into aged pt structure. It was fine. You need to pre-drill to avoid breaking off your fasteners. We also used thru-drilled posts for the railing; all c12. 900 sq. ft. All of the balusters were fastened by way of hidden screws into end grain, over 200 with two screws in each end as well. The trigger control is a great help.

As Greg said, the C12 would still be at the top of my list.
 
You need to pre-drill to avoid breaking off your fasteners.

Soaping the fasteners also helps tremendously, even if you pre-drill and especially if you don't. If you are using positive contact heads (not Phillips), you can just have your screws in a pot of soapy water. It kind of depends on your process. If outside, any remaining soap washes right off.

There are also decking fasteners that are designed to sort of drill a pilot as you drive them.

Tom
 
Tom Bellemare said:
You need to pre-drill to avoid breaking off your fasteners.

Soaping the fasteners also helps tremendously, even if you pre-drill and especially if you don't. If you are using positive contact heads (not Phillips), you can just have your screws in a pot of soapy water. It kind of depends on your process. If outside, any remaining soap washes right off.

There are also decking fasteners that are designed to sort of drill a pilot as you drive them.

Tom

Soap can be corrosive causing screws to rust. A better option is to use wax. Screws still drive with very low friction and will not rust.
 
A plumber who i work with has that Makita set, they are pretty good....

John....
 
So, can you guys explain the centrotec bits to me? I've not seen any of their drills in person for very long so I haven't inspected them. I thought I read somewhere that I wouldn't be able to use my existing bits and bit holders with the centrotec system? If so, that seems like a deal breaker to me.
 
aptpupil said:
So, can you guys explain the centrotec bits to me? I've not seen any of their drills in person for very long so I haven't inspected them. I thought I read somewhere that I wouldn't be able to use my existing bits and bit holders with the centrotec system? If so, that seems like a deal breaker to me.

Here is a pretty good explanation of the Centrotec system.

For a more thorough overview of the Festool chucks, look here.

Tom
 
aptpupil said:
So, can you guys explain the centrotec bits to me? I've not seen any of their drills in person for very long so I haven't inspected them. I thought I read somewhere that I wouldn't be able to use my existing bits and bit holders with the centrotec system? If so, that seems like a deal breaker to me.

      As far as the bits go.... only Centrotec, or compatible, bits will work in the Centrotec chuck.  There are currently a couple non-Festool Centrotec  compatible bits that fill the void of common woodworking bits that Festool doesn't make.  I  build furniture , built-ins , and a variety of other woodworking items. I have been able to go 90+% Centrotec  with a pretty minimal purchase of bits. It is a really compact , functional quick change system.  I really like using it. I still have the Fast Fix Jacobs style chuck for the rare occasion that I don't have a centrotec bit or for an oddball bit.

Seth
 
I think I'm going to order a C-12, but first a couple of questions.

I notice that aside from the shape of the drill, the only difference between the C-12 and the traditional styled T-12 is with the battery.  The C-12 has a 1.5 Ah Lithium battery and the T-12 has a 3 Ah battery.  Both have a 70 minute battery charge time, so what is it that the higher rated battery give you?  All the torque and power specs are the same it seems.  Is it that a higher Ah rating is how long the battery can last?

I also note that the overall weight of the two drills is different.  I'm assuming this is largely related to the battery in the T-12 being larger.  The drills with battery have a .3 kilo weight difference.  I'm leaning towards the C-12 anyways, but I've never used a drill that has that style of body.  What should I expect is the difference with the C12 versus the traditionaly shaped T-12 insofar as feel in use?  I have noted already that the C-12 body does allow for use in tighter situations, which is of course a plus.

On a related note already being discussed in this thread, is about the Centrotec system and in particular I was looking at getting the Installers set.  But every time I was briefly visiting this accessory set in the past, I wondered whether it was worth it insofar as price and whether I was paying for a bunch of stuff I don't really need.  Today, I painstakingly took the time to disect what came with it and priced out almost all of the components if bought individually.  In doing so, it also allowed me to assess better what I was in fact getting in the kit and whether there in fact was a bunch of stuff that did not likely represent any value to me as I would likely never use. 

For example, here in Canada, we have Robertson square drive bits commonly sold in our hardware stores.  Phillips are actually rarely found here other than as a drywall screw in common usage.  In fact, a few years ago, I went thru all my screws, and tossed out all slotted screws I had on hand, with a few small exceptions, and also tossed out anything Phillips with the exception of drywall screws.  Further, since that time, I started to use Torx head screws.  Now I'm even shying away from using Robertsons preferring to use the Torx ones instead and is one of the reasons I have been revisiting the Centrotec system and what comes with it.

So while I do use Pozi-drive bits for fastening slides now, most of the Pozi's and Phillips in the kit are really a waste of money along with the few slotted ones that come in it.  I'm gonna safely say that there is about $100 worth of what I've mentioned that is in the kit that I have little or no use for.  The kit in Canada sells for $410, so initially I thought, this kit probably doesn't make a lot of sense to buy especially also since I don't really need a $50 systainer to hold my bits and such being a DIY guy working 90+ percent of the time in my shop travelling with my drill as far as my backyard at best.  But here was the kicker.....  I added everything up!  Holy poop!!!!  $800 is what it would cost roughly to buy what comes in that kit piecemeal, and that was with a plain #1 systainer and not the one that obviously has a Centrotec specific insert for which I have no clue what that would add to the cost.  SOLD!!!

And in regards to Festool themselves not making any Robertson or square drive bits.  Many here on the forum may recall that Atlas Tools in Toronto (a Festool retailer) started having a third party manufacturer start making Centrotec accepted bits last year.  I can get what I need from them for around $70 in those bits, and I'm still ahead of the game in my mind in justyfying this route.  Anybody out there who has bought some of those Robertson/square drive bits from Atlas, and is not satisfied with their quality/durability, please speak up.

http://www.atlas-machinery.com/listings/Centrotec-AtMac-Impact-Bits

 
Kevin D. said:
Is it that a higher Ah rating is how long the battery can last?

Yes

Kevin D. said:
I have noted already that the C-12 body does allow for use in tighter situations, which is of course a plus.

Have you considered the CXS instead?

Personally (and I think Paul-Marcel has tested this theory) the C12/T12 doesn't offer much extra over the CXS, but the CXS has a lot to offer over the C12/T12.

I went for the CXS and a T15 and am very happy with my choices. The CXS is my go to drill, and as a set, provides a great selection of chucks for most circumstances.

 
Tom Bellemare said:
You need to pre-drill to avoid breaking off your fasteners.

Soaping the fasteners also helps tremendously, even if you pre-drill and especially if you don't. If you are using positive contact heads (not Phillips), you can just have your screws in a pot of soapy water. It kind of depends on your process. If outside, any remaining soap washes right off.

There are also decking fasteners that are designed to sort of drill a pilot as you drive them.

Tom

Your'e better off with wax, soap can discolor, especially high tannin woods like oak.

Get a water closet wax ring, do not remove the plastic cover, stick your screws in the ring. Better is 50% bees wax and 50% wax from a closet ring, if you care to melt and blend your own.

Tom
 
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