A question about 100 volt power

[Machiyalily]

Hi,
I live in Japan and am planning to equip my shop with Festool.  After lurking and watching far too many youtube videos I'm ready to take the plunge.  My plan was to buy the tools in the US and directly import them to Japan because they are significantly cheaper there and I will already have a container of supplies for building the shop for shipping so that cost won't matter.  Some of the answers to another question I asked on this forum got me to thinking about the voltage, we're on a 100 volt system here.  I contacted Festool to ask what difference this would make and they said that it would be fine except that I could expect 10 to 20 percent less power.  My question is if anyone has experience working with these tools on a 100 volt system or insight into whether the power loss would be a significant issue for me.  I've included a list of the tools I hope to buy:

TS75 or 55 I haven't decided which one yet.
CT36
Rotex 150
Domino 500
ETS 125

Thanks for any help,

Mark

 

[Holmz]

1/2 of Japan is on 50Hz and 1/2 on 60 Hz. You will have more issue wih frquency than voltage. I am not sure if he motors are "Universal", if they do not say universal then they are probably not.
I think you would be better off with japanese 200v outlets and gettng the 230v tools from Europe.
The only tool that is unique is the Domino. So you may wish to consider using a Makita track saw and sanders and a vacuum that is known to work on Japanese power?

 

[Machiyalily]

Holmz,

Thanks for your reply.  I forgot to add that.  I'm on 60 hz.  I could also have 200 volt power 60 hz without trouble.  I was considering buying the European 230 models and runnning them on 200 as well.  My problem, among others, is I have absolutely no understanding of electricity. 

I've thought of the Makita option and it dominates this market.  Over the last two years I've spent a decent amount of time on construction sites here and every single power tool is Makita.  They've even got special blades for the circular saws that reproduce some of the traditional Japanese joinery. 

I've got a year to decide and I may end up doing that but I'm a hobbyist, not a talented one, and a big part of the enjoyment I expect to get from the shop has somehow been perverted into Festool lust.  Maybe reason will prevail.

 

[SoonerFan]

Not sure on power but I would suggest you consider the same size sander for the Rotex and ETS to share abrasives. 

 

[peter halle]

Regardless about your power requirements, buying a Festool product elsewhere and then bringing it to you may / probably cause some service issues if there is a problem with a tool.

I am not saying that I agree with that philosophy but that is the way it is now.

Peter

 

[AlexThePalex]

Not sure it would be worth the hassle, but you must decide that for yourself. Obviously the Domino is a unique tool so that might be worth it, and considering what it does I doubt the reduced power would be of much consequence.

But with the other tools I think you'd be better off getting a Makita equivalent that's optimised for your 100v country. 

Reportedly the 120v tools already have a bit less power than their 220v counterparts, take another 20% off and you might end up spending a lot of money for not such a great experience after all.

And Peter makes a very valid point, of course.

 

[TealaG]

FYI...I have the Makita track saw and I really enjoy it.  I looked at a Festool after I realized that I loved having a tracksaw...I use it every time I'm in the workshop.  I really wanted the Festool riving knife and splinterguard.  But I finally realized that I was better off with a lighter, more powerful Makita and hey...I already had it.  I'm having difficulty with super heavy tools and more cutting power is better, isn't it?    I use my Makita with Festool rails and accessories for Festool rails so I don't miss out on any of the "fun". 

 

[Holmz]

...
  My problem, among others, is I have absolutely no understanding of electricity. 
...

I do not know what "sparkie" translates to in Japanese, but you need one.
Then they can put a 220v outlet in.
This assumes that the there are plugit cords with that type of end, which I doubt.
I doubt that a Euro outlet is allowed, but that would be ideal.

So an 'all Makita' set up, and a Domino if you really need it, may be best.
And the Makita is not bad stuff.

 

[DonL]

I'm in the same boat but in the Tokyo area which is 50 hz. There is a dealer here but they are charging more than double the cost. They do however sell 100 v. Not sure where they have sourced them.

I'm in the process of remodeling/rebuilding a house and would like to add a work area with the idea of using Festool. I ordered a 110 v plunge saw from the UK. I guess I will find out very soon if it was a mistake. I'm not electrical savvy either.    [blink]

 

[Holmz]

Having a sparkie put in a euro 230v outlet with the double 100v inputs would make a 200v. Then you could import your tools straight from Europe.

(Assuming the UK is not in the Eu)

 

[DonL]

Thanks Holmz. We haven`t installed any wiring yet (still using the old wiring) so I will ask the electrician if he can add a couple euro 230v outlets with double 100v inputs. I think that would solve any potential problems. My plunge saw has cleared customs so I should be able to test it out this weekend. 

 

[yetihunter]

US and Japan should be interchangeable, less a ground prong.
I never had any problems running Japanese stuff (although, no motors). 
I just checked with a friend living in Japan to confirm and he concurred.
I do believe the US festool stuff is 50/60hz (no issue there) and anything 110/120 ought to run from 100v-130v. 
Your amp draw should be about 17% more than in the US. 

 

[Zebt]

There is a bit more to this than meets the eye. When dealing with AC motors your main concern is current draw, a 110vac motor if run at 100vac will draw around 10% more current, probably ok so long as you don't thrash your tools. The cabling will be rated for the nominated current but should have enough tolerance for the increase. Your best solution would be good size isolating transformer (110vac to 110vac which will cope with the 100vac input), calculate your max current draw (VA rating)for the shop tools at 100vac, this will ensure your transformer will handle the load, it will output 110vac and your tools will not know the difference, this way your transformer primary is taking the 100vac as an additional load with higher current but it won't be a problem. The beauty of Festool is the motor soft start feature of the tools radically reduces inrush currents and therefore reduces the peak loads on the motor windings improving the lifespan and reliability. It's a huge subject!

 

[Kev]

[member=59964]Machiyalily[/member]

Have a look at these guys ...
http://www.tortech.com.au/category/stepup-jap

They seem to specialise in 100V to 240V, so you could source from Europe or Oz

However you go, obviously go for cordless tools when possible and practical.

 

[Holmz]

[member=54871]Zebt[/member] and [member=13058]Kev[/member] hit it at the same time...
A 100-230v transformer will allow you to bring in Euro tools.

It seems plausible & likely that the FT motors are "universal" and take 50 or 60Hz. The Mafell are for sure.

 

[Zebt]

This is a good articlehttp://www.50hz60hz.com/60hz-motor-running-on-50hz-power-supply.html

In my experience of mainly very large motors on merchant ships the frequency becomes critical due to iron losses in the motor at high power and current loads or tight tolerance motors.

I believe as Festool use electronic speed/torque control for the motors it may not make any difference at all, not sure on this.

In large power systems the generated AC power is converted to DC, manipulated/controlled, then converted back to AC, this enables much finer and precise control over the system.

 

[Holmz]

There is a bit more to this than meets the eye.
...
The beauty of Festool is the motor soft start feature of the tools radically reduces inrush currents and therefore reduces the peak loads on the motor windings improving the lifespan and reliability. It's a huge subject!

^This^ does not explain Kapex motor issues...  But in general should be true and making sense.

This is a good articlehttp://www.50hz60hz.com/60hz-motor-running-on-50hz-power-supply.html
...
In large power systems the generated AC power is converted to DC, manipulated/controlled, then converted back to AC, this enables much finer and precise control over the system.

I think that the new DC brushless is the AC->DC, and that solves any issues with frequency as DC is by definition 0-Hz.
The tractive motors are pretty neat, but I think most if the new powertools are headed towards DC, which would make Tesla cringe.

 

[DonL]

I went ahead and ordered a dust extractor too. I wasn't sure if it was good idea, but really needed one since the renovation is producing so much dust. The plunge saw and extractor arrived last night. I went to Viva Home (DIY center) after work today and purchased a new plug. Replaced the huge yellow UK 110v and started up the extractor. No blown fuses and it seems to run fine. I'm not an electrian so only time will tell if it will work in the long run. [blink]

Kev, I opened that link you provided and their transformers would probably work. I'm going to work on the house this weekend and see how things go first.

 

[DonL]

2017 Update

I ordered a Festool CLEANTEC CTL 26 E Mobile Dust Extractor, TS 55R EBQ-Plus Plunge Saw in 2016, changed the plugs and have not had any problems using them on 100 volts. I just purchased a 400 EBQ-Plus Router and there seem to be no problems with it either.

I used the TS 55 to cut through some 30mm birch plywood and have to go slow but the cuts are perfect. I will be ordering a Kapex soon.

The only thing that is a bit strange is when I use the TS 55 and dust extractor together cutting through 30mm; the dust extractor will cycle. I don`t know if that is normal or not. Overall I`m very happy with the Festool tools that I have purchased through Axminster.

I decided against having the electrician wire in 230 volt outlets.