A Website to Check Regularly

That post was a long time ago.  The website I posted is about real recalls.  Don't worry about trash posts .

Peter
 
I know that sometimes a less expensive corded drill exists in shops, trucks, and homes.  There is a recall on certain Dewalt corded drills.  You might also want to take a few minutes and scroll thru the other pages.

I am not being an alarmist or dissing a manufacturer but rather just passing some info that popped onto one of my internet feeds:
https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls

Peter
 
Peter Halle said:
I know that sometimes a less expensive corded drill exists in shops, trucks, and homes.  There is a recall on certain Dewalt corded drills.  You might also want to take a few minutes and scroll thru the other pages.

I am not being an alarmist or dissing a manufacturer but rather just passing some info that popped onto one of my internet feeds:
https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls

Peter
Click to expand...

Thanks, I bookmarked the page so I can check now and then.

Tom
 
Ring Recalls Video Doorbells (2nd Generation) Due to Fire Hazard
https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls/2020/ring-recalls-video-doorbells-2nd-generation-due-to-fire-hazard

Name of product:
Ring Video Doorbells (2nd Generation)
Hazard:
The video doorbell’s battery can overheat when the incorrect screws are used for installation, posing fire and burn hazards.
Remedy:
New Instructions
Recall date:
November 10, 2020
Units:
About 350,000 (In addition, about 8,700 were sold in Canada)

You can check to see if your sample is affected here:
https://support.ring.com/hc/en-us/articles/360050949611

Excerpt: The video doorbell’s battery can overheat when the incorrect screws are used for installation, posing fire and burn hazards. This recall involves Ring Video Doorbell (2nd Generation), model number 5UM5E5 smart doorbell cameras. Only Ring Video Doorbell (2nd Generation) models with certain serial numbers are included.

If the doorbell is installed correctly, there is no risk to consumers or potential hazard present.
 
Wow, imagine your design being so vulnerable that the use of the wrong type of screws can mean the difference between fire and not fire. I can't wrap my head around that, seems to me you'd better avoid such a product entirely.
 
Alex said:
Wow, imagine your design being so vulnerable that the use of the wrong type of screws can mean the difference between fire and not fire. I can't wrap my head around that, seems to me you'd better avoid such a product entirely.
Click to expand...

It's not hard to see at all.  This is the very thing that the vast majority of recalls are about.  Something could be loose, something could be over tight,  something could be a bit to close, if installer does something just a hair off.  Recalls are rarely some major thing or obvious thing, it's the whole reason this happens.  Folks designing stuff can plan for a fair bit of things, but they can't plan for everything.  Plan for someone using too big of a screw, someone will find an even bigger screw.  And when any of that happens it's on the manufactures because no one will accept they installed it wrong and they are at fault, everyone runs right back to the manufacture and blames them.
 
Of course if you think an over 1 inch long wood screw should be used to secure the doorbell to the mounting bracket then you probably didn't read the installation instructions and don't have a clue as how to install anything. It would be like using a 16d nail to hang sheetrock.

I have the doorbell in question. Reading the instructions I had no trouble understanding them and using the correct screw in the correct location. The instructions clearly describe and illustrate which screw to use where.

This recall is about protecting those who refuse to read the manual from themselves.
 
Bob D. said:
This recall is about protecting those who refuse to read the manual from themselves.
Click to expand...

Ding!

Type in IKEA in the search, it's tons of this sort of thing.  Everything at IKEA is a laceration danger.  Not sure how it works elsewhere in the world, but in the US, companies have to live in constant fear of people suing them because the people refused to read/use correctly/understand physics/etc.
 
DeformedTree said:
...
Not sure how it works elsewhere in the world, but in the US, companies have to live in constant fear of people suing them because the people refused to read/use correctly/understand physics/etc.
Click to expand...

Hence instruction manuals with chainsaws have “DO NOT ATTEMPT TO STOP CHAIN WITH HANDS” only in English (American).  Once upon a time, I heard or read a comment that anywhere else in the world a person would be too embarrassed to admit to doing such.
 
The revised installation instructions for the Ring Video Doorbell (2nd Generation) are here:
https://support.ring.com/hc/en-us/articles/360040763632

The illustration showing the difference between the correct short security screws and the incorrect lengthy wood screws is funny. I will not spoil the other amusing detail.

From the dramatic conclusion:

Secure your Video Doorbell.

CAUTION!


If you use the wrong screws to secure the Video Doorbell, you could damage the battery during installation, create a fire hazard, and be seriously injured.

DO NOT USE any screw other than the included short security screws when securing your Video Doorbell to the bracket.
Use the star-shaped end of the included screwdriver to drive the two security screws into the bottom of your
 Video Doorbell.
 
interesting there is Europe and US instructions.  They are laid out different, but in the end the same.  I like how in the US it is "use a 1/4" drill bit",  in the EU it's "use the included drill bit".  So sounds like they rather include a drillbit for Europe verses ship with metric anchors?  Not like anyone ever uses included hardware for stuff like that.  I figured that was where the issue was, but no, it's the screw internal to the setup.  Why would someone not use the screw?  I'm left to assume it's an oddball screw so if someone drops/looses it, they have no idea what do and probably just grab a handy drywall screw.  Maybe time for captive hardware.
 
DeformedTree said:
interesting there is Europe and US instructions.  They are laid out different, but in the end the same.  I like how in the US it is "use a 1/4" drill bit",  in the EU it's "use the included drill bit".  So sounds like they rather include a drillbit for Europe verses ship with metric anchors?  Not like anyone ever uses included hardware for stuff like that.  I figured that was where the issue was, but no, it's the screw internal to the setup.  Why would someone not use the screw?  I'm left to assume it's an oddball screw so if someone drops/looses it, they have no idea what do and probably just grab a handy drywall screw.  Maybe time for captive hardware.
Click to expand...

If the screw that the Ring people include is a security screw, rather than a regular Torx screw, then including a security screwdriver significantly increases the number of such tools owned by the general public. I recall that years ago, buying such screwdrivers online required submitting a scan of a company letterhead.
 
DeformedTree said:
It's not hard to see at all.  This is the very thing that the vast majority of recalls are about.  Something could be loose, something could be over tight,  something could be a bit to close, if installer does something just a hair off.  Recalls are rarely some major thing or obvious thing, it's the whole reason this happens.
Click to expand...

Well, I wasn't talking about the reasons and merits of recalls in general, but about this specific case.

Which was described on that website as an OVERHEATING problem, due to using the wrong screws. And that just sounded weird in my head. User installed screws should have no bearing on the heat a battery generates or dissipates. If it does, that's a mayor design flaw.

But the real trouble here is PUNCTURING the battery. Now I understand that a battery bursting in flames due to the reaction of lithium and water can technically be called a form of overheating, but I think most people would call it PUNCTURING.  [tongue]

DeformedTree said:
Folks designing stuff can plan for a fair bit of things, but they can't plan for everything. 
Click to expand...

They could, and should have anticipated this. The volatility of lithium-ion batteries is a well known fact in the engineering world. As problems with them can lead to sincere consequences including death due to a fire, guarding the battery's safety is a top priority during the design. Which means you don't give an a-technical user who screws up the opportunity to drive a screw into the battery in the first place. A dumb mistake.

It is also a dumb mistake of the manufacturer to solve the problem with a mere amendment in the installation instructions. This will not absolve them in an American court when another doorbell bursts into flames. They should have installed a metal plate in the doorbell to protect the battery.
 
Charles959 said:
DeformedTree said:
Why would someone not use the screw?  I'm left to assume it's an oddball screw so if someone drops/looses it, they have no idea what do and probably just grab a handy drywall screw.  Maybe time for captive hardware.
Click to expand...

If the screw that the Ring people include is a security screw, rather than a regular Torx screw, then including a security screwdriver significantly increases the number of such tools owned by the general public. I recall that years ago, buying such screwdrivers online required submitting a scan of a company letterhead.
Click to expand...

"security screws" have always been a BS idea.  They just cause more screw types to be invented, more tools needed, etc. They are secure for all of the couple days till someone makes the matching tool for them so people can work on their stuff.  Apple has been bad about this for years. If someone wants to steal rings, they will just find the correct screw driver and start stealing them.

Between the potential for being lost and no easy way to have a replacement, or the possibility it's a security torx and folks don't have the tool, this just sets things up for people to find another way.

This could be a case of people may not be using the product right, but if you set it up where they have few options but to use it wrong, then it comes back on Ring.  Use a common fastener, put information in the documentation on what the screw is. If it said "use a M6x20 screw" (I have no idea the size, thus the point), then folks could find alternative screw.  This gets to a way to reduce a lot of hazards with products.  Provide good information that helps people support the products they buy.  Don't act like everything about it is special, and usage of any other part but OEM bits will cause death and destruction.  People will find a way, it's best to show them how to do it right.
 
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