Astra Coated Router Bits?

[smorgasbord]

I see quite a few people online talking about Astra coated Whiteside router bits from Bits & Bits.

Since almost all of those YTers are providing affiliate links, they're getting a kickback on the sale. That's OK, but it seems that Bits & Bits is making a real marketing push via influencers. As others have posted here, with specific engineering data or even real world comparison side-by-side tests, it's hard to take any of these claims as real.

That said, Amana sells a lot of stuff professionally, so I'd trust them more than consumer-oriented companies. Pros going through lots of bits would quickly find out if the claims were true or not.

 

[Cheese]

That said, Amana sells a lot of stuff professionally, so I'd trust them more than consumer-oriented companies. Pros going through lots of bits would quickly find out if the claims were true or not.

Maybe an email directly to Amana corporate asking if they've produced a Tech Bulletin or Engineering Study might produce some results?

 

[Crazyraceguy]

As with all tools there's cheap quality and good quality router bits. With my CNC I go through a lot of cutters, never actually wearing them out but breaking them one way or another, so I buy cheap 1 and 2 flute straight and Vee TCT cutters in large quantities.

Where I do pay for the good quality brands like Carbitool, CMT, Whiteside, etc, are for panel and large profile cutters, this is where a difference is very noticeable in use and the end result.

This will somewhat depend on what you are cutting and why you are breaking them. If it is a speeds/feeds issue, try increasing the diameter of the cutter. (in a place where you have the clearance)
A simple bump up from 1/4" to 8mm increases the stiffness/strength of the bit dramatically.
We go through quite a few compression bits on the CNC machines, in a production situation. The move to 8mm, for grooves in cabinet parts, added a lot to their life. (and reduced cut time too) What used to take 2 passes with a 1/4" bit, now happens with one, and at a faster feedrate.

Though I don't really mess with cheap bits much, I do agree totally about quality being a bigger factor, with larger cutters. Larger diameter and longer length, both depend more on balance. Even if you are not taking a significantly greater cut, they will spin much better, and leave a better finish behind, not to mention being better on the bearings.

I have used a couple of the Spektra coated Amana bits, which work fine, but I don't know if I would say significantly better. This is hand-held, or Shaper Origin though, maybe with CNC?

My favorite, as of late, has been WoodPeckers Ultra-Shear. Ever one I have used has been great. They are uncoated, but I believe ground/polished to a finer grit. (at least the spiral fluted ones feel sharper in the hand)

With metals, especially Aluminum, a coating may help in regard to "chip weld". It is particularly susceptible to that. With wood, it has to be as much about heat build-up as anything, though there are some that produce some pitch/gunk. Though I find a little cleaning is good enough for that. It's really just Cherry, since I don't mess with Pine much.
CMT blade and bit cleaner does just what I need.

 

[Tom the Remodeler]

These various coatings are common on industrial tooling and applications where you're more likely to dull the tool than have it break or otherwise be damaged.

Most of my shaper tooling has a NaDia coating, developed by TWT tools. It's challenging to produce a 1-1 comparison since, for a given tool, I have only ever used the NaDia coated inserts, but I've run hundreds (if not thousands) of lineal feet of various species, and the cutting edges remain extremely sharp, only requiring an occasional resin removal if I've been processing a lot of pine. That being said, the edges do eventually dull, but my perception is that they outperform untreated carbide.

Rangate offers Tersa knives with the NaDia treatment, but they don't have a combination which works with my 520mm cutter block. As I'm typing, I'm remembering that I need to follow up with them to see about coming up with a combination which would work. I don't know what the underlying blades are (M+, HSS, Chrome, etc....), so I don't know the hook angle and therefore how they'd perform with different species of wood. The stock Chrome and HSS Tersa knives have a 40 degree hook angle and are best suited for softwoods like Pine, Cedar, Fir, etc...., whereas the M+ and Carbide Tersa knives have a 55 degree hook angle and are better suited for hardwoods like Oak, Maple, Sapele, etc....

In terms of router bits, this strikes me as a scenario where the coatings are worthwhile on tooling that will see a lot of use on CNC machines, where you have finely controlled feed rates and stock selection, where you're less likely to break/chip/damage/overheat the tooling, and more likely to actually just wear it out.

For hand-held routers, I suspect that the coatings are overkill. I don't think they'd necessarily be a problem, but I wouldn't pay extra for the coating on a bit where I'm much more likely to chip or otherwise damage the cutting edge long before I'd begin to dull the carbide.

That being said, if you're running a router table with a power feeder where you can control chip loading, and are dulling bits without breaking them, then there's likely a case to be made for the coatings.

 

[smorgasbord]

Rangate offers Tersa knives with the NaDia treatment, .... I don't know what the underlying blades are (M+, HSS, Chrome, etc....),

I've had that page bookmarked for a while now, but haven't felt the need as a hobbyist to pull the trigger.

The page does say:

These HSS M2 blades retain their original material properties, with no extra brittleness or sensitivity.

So it would appear they start with the M2 blades (M+ ?).

 

[Tom the Remodeler]

Rangate offers Tersa knives with the NaDia treatment, .... I don't know what the underlying blades are (M+, HSS, Chrome, etc....),

I've had that page bookmarked for a while now, but haven't felt the need as a hobbyist to pull the trigger.

The page does say:

These HSS M2 blades retain their original material properties, with no extra brittleness or sensitivity.

So it would appear they start with the M2 blades (M+ ?).

Hi Smorgasbord,

Yeah, I generally get good life out of the stock M+ and HSS blades, so I haven't felt an acute need to pursue this path.

One technique that really helps to extend the life of my Tersa blades is the following:
-- I cut the ends of all of my boards prior to milling
-- I try to only use the inner/nearest 200mm of the cutter block for jointing, since this material typically is most likely to have surface contamination which might knick a blade
-- I use the same inner/nearest 200mm of the cutter block for the first thickness planer pass, since this is still going to be rough-sawn lumber, and therefore more likely to have surface contamination
-- Only after all four faces have been milled will I shift to using the outer/further 320mm of the cutter block.

Using the process listed above, any knicks/damage is usually limited to one side of the cutter block, with the other side usually left in near-pristine condition, more likely to eventually get dull than get knicked. When a knick does occur, it takes about one minute to shift the blades 1mm one way or the other.

I'm still confused by the base blade, since "HSS" and "M+" blades have different alloys, and different cutting angles. Like you say, for the time being I'm getting good results swapping between the stock HSS and M+ blades, marking them as "New", "Lightly Used", and "Heavily Used".