Bad cuts with my TS55R

[Solid]

Hi all
I´m posting here to get some suggestions. I have some problems with my 1,5 year old Ts 55 R.
I´ve tried posting pictures here but don´t get it right so here is a link to another thread here on the FOG that will show pictures.

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tool-problems/new-ts-55-req-owner-it-seems-like-there%27s-something-wrong-with-my-saw/

I sort of have the same problem. But I have resharpened my two blades ( fine tooth blade 48T ). After I got them back I´ve tried all the tips in the thread above. When that didn´t help I took the saw to my dealer who then sent the saw to Festool.

Today I got the saw back hoping to make perfect cuts again but boy was I wrong. The cuts are pretty much the same as before.
Although I changed the the splinterguards on my two guide rails after I got the blades resharpened I changed them again when I got the saw back from Festool. I followed the tips again from the thread above but no difference

The funny thing is that when I got the saw back I got some sample cuts they made at Festool. And those sample cuts were not good. 

Up until 2 months ago or so the cuts were so good that it felt like the material came from a jointer. You could just glue two rip cut pieces together without having to do anything else to surface

I guess the only thing is to go back to my dealer and send it to Festool again. But have I missed something ? Does anyone have solutions that I might have overlooked ?

 

[Administrator_JSVN]

Adding photos on behalf of the member, see attachments below.

I would suggest making sure the saw is properly calibrating to the rail by tightening the green knobs that control play on the rail.

Shane

 

[DB10]

If it was me I would just buy a new 48t blade and see what results I get before sending the saw back off to Festool again.
  What's the cost of a new Ts 55 in the USA 600 bucks and a new 48t blade 40 bucks, got to be worth a try.
  Just because you got your old blades sharpened doesn't mean they will be like new, has the company that re sharpened your blades done a good job before for you?

 

[Solid]

Adding photos on behalf of the member, see attachments below.

I would suggest making sure the saw is properly calibrating to the rail by tightening the green knobs that control play on the rail.

Shane

Hi shane
I´ve tried tightening the knobs. I´ve tried going from loose to so tightened that the saw hade trouble sliding on the rail. My concern is that if I send the saw to Festool service. and they see the oak piece I send with the saw. And when they return the saw they send three wood pieces back that look the same. I mean that feels so strange to me.

The only things i "tampered" with are tighten those knobs, change plunge depth and changing saw blade. I haven´t even made a mitred cut with saw. I only use it for straight cuts.
The saw performed perfectly until 2 months ago. And I´m trying to remember if I dropped the saw or bumped into anything but cannot recall any of that.

 

[Solid]

If it was me I would just buy a new 48t blade and see what results I get before sending the saw back off to Festool again.
  What's the cost of a new Ts 55 in the USA 600 bucks and a new 48t blade 40 bucks, got to be worth a try.
  Just because you got your old blades sharpened doesn't mean they will be like new, has the company that re sharpened your blades done a good job before for you?

Hi
My first thought was to buy a new blade. But here in Sweden a new blade cost around 90$. To resharpen is 12$. I would have thought that when I sent the saw to festool that the first thing they would try is a cut with a new blade. But there was no note in my systainer from Festool so I don´t know what they done to it. The pieces they sent back is not better then the one I sent to them.

I´m maybe dumb, but I hope that if they try a new blade and the cut is perfect ( like it was when i bought the saw ) they would tell me so I could buy a new blade, but I don´t wanna buy a new blade and then find out that there´s something wrong with the saw.

 

[Administrator_JSVN]

Please don't take this as an insult, but can you make sure the blade is installed properly, not backwards? Also, it may be worth removing and reinstalling the blade to make sure it's seated fully on the arbor.

Shane

 

[Birdhunter]

From looking at the pictures, it looks like the saw blade is oscillating as it moves through the wood.

Is it possible the blade is bent or, as Shane asked, not seated properly?

 

[hopper]

From the pics, its obvious to me that one of the teeth is not aligned with the rest (eg. not ground correctly when sharpened). Your only answer is to try a new blade or send that one back to the sharpening company and have them check it.

 

[Solid]

Ok
I talked to Festool services now. And even talked to the person who took care of my saw. He tweaked the back of the saw just a little bit. Thats all that he found on the saw.
They will send me a newer blade to try with. When they testd the saw they just tried with the blade that was on the saw at that time.

So I´ll have to wait and see.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

The main variable here is that the blade was resharpened. For the original poster and anyone else reading this thread later, it should be noted that Festool blades are low-angle ATB. Many other blades are high-angle ATB, and your saw sharpener may have ground the blades with a higher bevel angle. Both types have their benefits and drawbacks.

High-angle ATB will produce less tearout, but its drawbacks are that they don't stay sharp as long, and they can tend to cause the blade to flex as the teeth pass through fibers of varying density. An analogy would be driving down a road with deep ruts, and the car wanting to veer back and forth as the front wheels get pulled by the ruts. When this happens, the images shown above will be the result.

The low-angle ATB is less prone to flexing the blade because the bevel angle isn't as steep. This is why they produce smoother cuts on the edges of the workpiece. Driving down a road with shallow ruts, your car doesn't get pulled into them quite as easily.

Low-angle ATB is more of a long-term blade, and gives more consistent results across their whole lifespan for longer use. It won't give as good of results as the high-angle when both types are brand new, but as the blades get used, it begins to outperform the high-angle blade because it stays sharper longer.

Without naming names, there is one very, very popular saw blade brand that people rave about right out of the box. It gives incredible results...but it does so at the expense of an ultra-high-angle bevel, and those results quickly diminish after just short use. Those sharp points that do so well right out of the box, get blunted rather quickly.

[attachimg=1]

 

[Solid]

Hi again

I got the blade from Festool service guy today and made som cuts. This is the result. So now I don´t know what to do.

 

[Administrator_JSVN]

Did you send the guide rail in with the saw? If not, you'll need to make sure the knobs are tightened completely and then just slightly backed off to make sure there's no lateral movement with the saw and the rail.

Were there any notes from the service department?

 

[Solid]

Did you send the guide rail in with the saw? If not, you'll need to make sure the knobs are tightened completely and then just slightly backed off to make sure there's no lateral movement with the saw and the rail.

Were there any notes from the service department?

Hi
The knobs are tightened and there is zero movement. I did not send in the rail with the saw. Didn´t think that was necessary.

 

[semenza]

Solid,

  Could you post a face view of the cut that shows the edge as opposed to the close up of the edge?

  And maybe pictures of a different material such as a more even grained wood or some plywood or MDF?

Seth

 

[elfick]

Could the saw be rocking side to side on the track as you cut? Perhaps you can apply positive pressure on a test cut to see if that helps?

 

[Rick Christopherson]

For a saw-cut in solid oak, I don't see this as being abnormal. That is a rather fine cut, and is a definite improvement over the original pictures.

 

[Daniel]

Solid,
I had the same issue with my old TS55. Cuts were worse then yours.. The saw was send to the festool service. It came back with the new blade (maybe their internal rule?), but the cuts were still the same. I made some research on net and finally realised, that the blade wasn't parallel to the base of the saw. I just loosed two screws and corrected it.
I think it should be the same problem and believe, that there are screws for blade alignment on the ts55r as well.
Hope this helps
Daniel

Odesláno z iPadu

 

[justinh]

The main variable here is that the blade was resharpened. For the original poster and anyone else reading this thread later, it should be noted that Festool blades are low-angle ATB. Many other blades are high-angle ATB, and your saw sharpener may have ground the blades with a higher bevel angle. Both types have their benefits and drawbacks.

High-angle ATB will produce less tearout, but its drawbacks are that they don't stay sharp as long, and they can tend to cause the blade to flex as the teeth pass through fibers of varying density. An analogy would be driving down a road with deep ruts, and the car wanting to veer back and forth as the front wheels get pulled by the ruts. When this happens, the images shown above will be the result.

The low-angle ATB is less prone to flexing the blade because the bevel angle isn't as steep. This is why they produce smoother cuts on the edges of the workpiece. Driving down a road with shallow ruts, your car doesn't get pulled into them quite as easily.

Low-angle ATB is more of a long-term blade, and gives more consistent results across their whole lifespan for longer use. It won't give as good of results as the high-angle when both types are brand new, but as the blades get used, it begins to outperform the high-angle blade because it stays sharper longer.

Without naming names, there is one very, very popular saw blade brand that people rave about right out of the box. It gives incredible results...but it does so at the expense of an ultra-high-angle bevel, and those results quickly diminish after just short use. Those sharp points that do so well right out of the box, get blunted rather quickly.

[attachimg=1]

That is a very good explanation of H-ATB vs ATB.  It is also why I don't use Forrest Chopmaster blades.  The solitary lonely one that I have left has been re-ground to a 20* top bevel.  Freud tries something similar with their Fusion blades.

Rick's analogy of the road is also why dedicated rip blades have a flat top grind instead of an ATB.  There are no angles to drag them off coarse. 

H-ATB is a specialty grind is used for 2 sided melamine/laminates and tear out prone veneers.  I own them in a couple of sizes and use them when needed.  For every situation there is a correct blade.