Blackberry

[joinercp]

Anyone here still using a Blackberry phone?  [cool]

I own a Blackberry passport and have yet to meet another person with the same phone  [eek]. It's a shame as the Blackberry 10 operating system is much more efficient than Android/Apple. 

 

[Sparktrician]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure. 

 

[Wuffles]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure.

Go on, I'll bite. How is Blackberry OS more secure than IOS.

 

[tazcubed]

Anyone here still using a Blackberry phone?  [cool]

I own a Blackberry passport and have yet to meet another person with the same phone  [eek]. It's a shame as the Blackberry 10 operating system is much more efficient than Android/Apple.

I've had mine since late November and have to say that straight out of the box, it's pretty good and better compared to others without any additional apps. Still wish they had kept the full keyboard (but like the touch functionality - makes editing anything a breeze), and may go for the next slider if it runs BB10. The screen is bright, clear and vibrant, call quality is top-notch and the Hub is perfect. Security is Blackberry's forte - nothing more needs to be said. Look for the "Work Wide" app - you can multitask across a couple of app functions on the same screen. Blackberry Blend is good when working on a computer.  That said, apps are certainly limited. 

 

[otis04]

I have a BB for work and an iPhone for personal use.  Short answer is I fully understand why BB is on the verge of bankruptcy.  Although it is a full keyboard model, so I know it is dated.

 

[Sparktrician]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure.

Go on, I'll bite. How is Blackberry OS more secure than IOS.

 

Take a look at the phone POTUS uses.  It's a BlackBerry.  The security folks won't let him use an iPhone.  Precisely why?  Ask them.  Just the fact that BlackBerry is the phone of choice used extensively in high security environments tells me a great deal.  Samsung fell on their rear ends with the Knox add-on.  iOs and Android are definitely improving, but BlackBerry has been there for quite some time.  You might want to look at this blog.  For sure, Android and iOs devices offer far more bells and whistles for the end user than BlackBerry, but for reliable security, right now, my money is on BlackBerry.  That may change tomorrow...

 

[Wuffles]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure.

Go on, I'll bite. How is Blackberry OS more secure than IOS.

 

Take a look at the phone POTUS uses.  It's a BlackBerry.  The security folks won't let him use an iPhone.  Precisely why?  Ask them.  Just the fact that BlackBerry is the phone of choice used extensively in high security environments tells me a great deal.  Samsung fell on their rear ends with the Knox add-on.  iOs and Android are definitely improving, but BlackBerry has been there for quite some time.  You might want to look at this blog.  For sure, Android and iOs devices offer far more bells and whistles for the end user than BlackBerry, but for reliable security, right now, my money is on BlackBerry.  That may change tomorrow...

Right, I thought that's what you probably meant, but that's a network security thing rather than an OS thing IMO. Probably why BB were banned in certain Countries that don't like that type of network security - no prying eyes.

Took me a while to figure out what POTUS was too.

 

[jeh]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure.

Go on, I'll bite. How is Blackberry OS more secure than IOS.

 

Take a look at the phone POTUS uses.  It's a BlackBerry.  The security folks won't let him use an iPhone.  Precisely why?  Ask them.  Just the fact that BlackBerry is the phone of choice used extensively in high security environments tells me a great deal.  Samsung fell on their rear ends with the Knox add-on.  iOs and Android are definitely improving, but BlackBerry has been there for quite some time.  You might want to look at this blog.  For sure, Android and iOs devices offer far more bells and whistles for the end user than BlackBerry, but for reliable security, right now, my money is on BlackBerry.  That may change tomorrow...

I would hardly use the government as a reference for security knowledge. They have been burned over and over again and it won't stop. The president's phone is not an off-the-shelf Blackberry. According to several sources it has been modified with additional software.

The latest version of the iPhone and Android offer device encryption for which there are no backdoors. The government does not like this. Of course the phone calls are over public networks, as are texts. I know that on the iPhone text messages are encrypted when going from iPhone to iPhone. I believe the same is true for Android to/from Android text messages, but I am not certain.

Another area that may be an issue is that products (including software) need to be certified by the government so that they can be used. This certification is non-trivial and in Apple's case they never have bothered to do so because their primary customers are consumers, which by the way is where the most customers are. Some of the difficulties with the certification process is that once you obtain it say for an iPhone 5 running iOS 6.0 it is only certified for that combination. If the OS changes you are back to ground zero and recertification while not impossible takes a lot of time, which is why you see the government with what is to us consumers ancient equipment. In many cases the government is multiple major versions behind what is current. Bug ridden Internet Explorer has been used by the government since it's initial release and was always several versions behind. Recently I have seen IE 7 running when IE 10 was available. The problem with this is that older versions of software and hardware products are not updated as frequently (if at all) and in some cases can't be fixed or if there is an update the product has to be re-certified to be installed. The latter is easier, but all of this means the governments products are months and more likely years behind what is current in the real world.

In the case of his Blackberry there are a lot of pieces to the puzzle that require certification: server hardware, server OS and all installed software, related networking equipment, the phone, the Blackberry Enterprise Software, and the phones operating system. Now a lot of the components are certified (there are lists of certified equipment that can be bought from, but even if that is the case you still have the have the system (sum of all components) certified and all of this takes time.

This post is way too long, but it is also worth mentioning that BlackBerry is on the ropes which presents additional concerns in terms of possibly cutting corners on development in order to push products out. The top hardware and software engineers have left for growing companies like Google, Apple, Microsoft (Nokia), Motorola etc. Why stay on a sinking ship if you are a 'head nerd'?

Blackberry is but a shadow of itself. They went from the market leader to a has been in a matter of a few years by pushing out crappy products and not taking the iPhone and later Android phones seriously. In their reality distortion field their keyboard was their differentiator and what their whole business was based on. The iPhone took them and the rest of the phone manufactures by surprise and it took years to get anything close to as good as it. That said Samsung has some great phones and are the only real competitor in terms of sales. The Windows phone does not stand much of chance because it is just too late. Microsoft knows this and has wisely double-downed by releasing apps for Android and iOS. If you can't beat them you have to join them.

 

[Sparktrician]

Poor management is one thing, and BlackBerry has had that in spades, but the technology is sound, albeit limiting (apps).  I currently am using a Sony Xperia Z3 Compact Android (5.1.1) phone, although I have an older but updated (10.3.2.2339) BlackBerry Z10 in the wings, just deactivated.  The Sony phone is a great one, but Sony's ability to support the phone with competent desktop software (for backups and the like) is abysmal.  Once it was encrypted, the encryption broke the ability of Sony's PC Companion to do regular backups to computer's hard drive.  In contrast, the older BlackBerry is fully capable of backups while completely encrypted.  To the OP's point, though, I've only seen one person using the BlackBerry Passport, and that was on TV.  It's clearly not pocketable and seems to be rather awkward in use.

 

[SurfNorway]

Blackberry was compromised by the NSA years ago, as the leaked Snowden documents show.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/how-the-nsa-spies-on-smartphones-including-the-blackberry-a-921161.html

http://www.techhive.com/article/2048415/snowden-leaks-show-uk-and-us-spies-have-cracked-blackberrys-bes-encryption.html

http://globalnews.ca/news/839976/is-blackberry-nsa-proof-dont-bet-on-it/

Your best bet today for a truly secure phone is probably the Blackphone, combined with Silent Circle apps: https://home.silentcircle.com/

And you can bet the NSA is putting all the resources they have in figuring out how to break or circumvent the encryption and protection SC uses!

 

[Sparktrician]

Blackphone is a very good, secure system - but apparently for enterprise users only at this time. 

 

[L.J]

True, but there are more pertinent apps for the Android variants and the iPhone.  I agree that the BlackBerry O/S is better and more secure.

Go on, I'll bite. How is Blackberry OS more secure than IOS.

 

Take a look at the phone POTUS uses.  It's a BlackBerry.  The security folks won't let him use an iPhone.  Precisely why?  Ask them.  Just the fact that BlackBerry is the phone of choice used extensively in high security environments tells me a great deal.  Samsung fell on their rear ends with the Knox add-on.  iOs and Android are definitely improving, but BlackBerry has been there for quite some time.  You might want to look at this blog.  For sure, Android and iOs devices offer far more bells and whistles for the end user than BlackBerry, but for reliable security, right now, my money is on BlackBerry.  That may change tomorrow...

I would hardly use the government as a reference for security knowledge. They have been burned over and over again and it won't stop. The president's phone is not an off-the-shelf Blackberry. According to several sources it has been modified with additional software.

The latest version of the iPhone and Android offer device encryption for which there are no backdoors. The government does not like this. Of course the phone calls are over public networks, as are texts. I know that on the iPhone text messages are encrypted when going from iPhone to iPhone. I believe the same is true for Android to/from Android text messages, but I am not certain.

Another area that may be an issue is that products (including software) need to be certified by the government so that they can be used. This certification is non-trivial and in Apple's case they never have bothered to do so because their primary customers are consumers, which by the way is where the most customers are. Some of the difficulties with the certification process is that once you obtain it say for an iPhone 5 running iOS 6.0 it is only certified for that combination. If the OS changes you are back to ground zero and recertification while not impossible takes a lot of time, which is why you see the government with what is to us consumers ancient equipment. In many cases the government is multiple major versions behind what is current. Bug ridden Internet Explorer has been used by the government since it's initial release and was always several versions behind. Recently I have seen IE 7 running when IE 10 was available. The problem with this is that older versions of software and hardware products are not updated as frequently (if at all) and in some cases can't be fixed or if there is an update the product has to be re-certified to be installed. The latter is easier, but all of this means the governments products are months and more likely years behind what is current in the real world.

In the case of his Blackberry there are a lot of pieces to the puzzle that require certification: server hardware, server OS and all installed software, related networking equipment, the phone, the Blackberry Enterprise Software, and the phones operating system. Now a lot of the components are certified (there are lists of certified equipment that can be bought from, but even if that is the case you still have the have the system (sum of all components) certified and all of this takes time.

This post is way too long, but it is also worth mentioning that BlackBerry is on the ropes which presents additional concerns in terms of possibly cutting corners on development in order to push products out. The top hardware and software engineers have left for growing companies like Google, Apple, Microsoft (Nokia), Motorola etc. Why stay on a sinking ship if you are a 'head nerd'?

Blackberry is but a shadow of itself. They went from the market leader to a has been in a matter of a few years by pushing out crappy products and not taking the iPhone and later Android phones seriously. In their reality distortion field their keyboard was their differentiator and what their whole business was based on. The iPhone took them and the rest of the phone manufactures by surprise and it took years to get anything close to as good as it. That said Samsung has some great phones and are the only real competitor in terms of sales. The Windows phone does not stand much of chance because it is just too late. Microsoft knows this and has wisely double-downed by releasing apps for Android and iOS. If you can't beat them you have to join them.

I think you are very much out of touch,all of those platforms are tested regularly and have failed in very high security infrastructures like our government.

 

[L.J]

Blackberry was compromised by the NSA years ago, as the leaked Snowden documents show.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/how-the-nsa-spies-on-smartphones-including-the-blackberry-a-921161.html

http://www.techhive.com/article/2048415/snowden-leaks-show-uk-and-us-spies-have-cracked-blackberrys-bes-encryption.html

http://globalnews.ca/news/839976/is-blackberry-nsa-proof-dont-bet-on-it/

Your best bet today for a truly secure phone is probably the Blackphone, combined with Silent Circle apps: https://home.silentcircle.com/

And you can bet the NSA is putting all the resources they have in figuring out how to break or circumvent the encryption and protection SC uses!

Blackberry servers have never been hacked if so they wouldn't be used by top officials like our president !!!

 

[L.J]

Anyone here still using a Blackberry phone?  [cool]

I own a Blackberry passport and have yet to meet another person with the same phone  [eek]. It's a shame as the Blackberry 10 operating system is much more efficient than Android/Apple.

I have a Passport which I have setup for also running Google apps. I have an iPhone 6 which is mostly used for music in my cars. To date the Passport is the best phone I've owned from the company.

 

[CrazyLarry]

Security in any case has two fronts: data flowing from A to B is it encrypted at all and is the encryption strong enough that you can't get in quickly enough for the data to be useful, secondly static data can a system that's just sitting there be broken into whether thats the phone, the or a server the phone talks to. ALL phones systems right now have flaws in both to varying degrees.
Except perhaps SC.

Just listing exploits isn't the whole picture, more important is whether they get patched and how, is this an aberation or a systemic problem swept under the carpet. A one off hole, that's difficult to replicate and extremely difficult to exploit that's patched and never seen again doesn't indicate much at all, other than humans make mistakes. An OS that has a dozen patches a week for 10 years or claims to have none... might be a different story!!!

[member=652]JimH2[/member] It's an interesting thought but it's nothing to do with government really, they aren't the driver and never have been, they always fight encryption and security with the right hand while trying to utilise it with the left. In some ways it's understandable but it's also abused for political and power purposes. I suspect they will be using Blackberrys because their spooks can get into all of the alternatives, and probably have a fix for the holes they themselves have into the blackberry.

It's not just about encryption though, it's also about code quality and a history / philosophy of both as well as an adherence to open IETF standards that underpins that. RIM embraced interaction through standards support early on although they took a proprietary route involving the purchase of their server software. (that is apparently about to change with native PGP support)

Both iOS and Android are late comers to the first two, don't seem terribly commited to either, with a laughable trust in openssl and are still fighting against the latter, desperately trying to defend their closed proprietary products to lock people in and using binary 'blob' driver code both to lock out open competition and easy analysis of their woeful code state. (All the mistakes of Nokia...)

In time I can't see how both iOS and Android won't evolve or crumble, just like nokia and ericsson and motorola and palm. Google have paved the way really, they've shown that you can take a free software based OS and build a mobile eco system on it, they did it out of pure greed and made it cynically closed as ever, but perhaps in the future there will be a genuinely open linux mobile (not android clone), where the hardware / open firmware will permit any recompiled linux distro.

That opens the door to any cross compiled OS such as FreeBSD or OpenBSD which are in an entirely different league. It's where you find people who genuinely know what they are doing, rewriting software from scratch (libreSSL) rather than applying endless sticking plasters to collander code like Apple or Microsoft have in the past... rumour is though that Microsoft of all people have made huge improvements! Maybe they'll have a stab at 3rd time lucky with an open source MS mobile???

 

[joinercp]

Leaving aside the security debate I bet most people would be amazed if they used a Blackberry Passport or the new classic for a week. Since changing to the Passport I rarely turn on my laptop or ipad.

 

[Wuffles]

Just listing exploits isn't the whole picture, more important is whether they get patched and how

Bang on.

Herein lies the problem with the mess created by Google with Android. Take (as an example) an HTC from just a couple of years ago and tell me if HTC have bothered patching any bugs/exploits/anything at all. The "forked" Android experience they levered into place to sell the new shiny phone for a few months has long been ignored I expect. That'll be their undoing in time.

Samsung are perhaps even worse, but I really don't have any experience as the bloatware/copycat apps they nail into their version of Android makes me feel confused and old when I try to figure out just which app I am supposed to open to look at pictures.

 

[tazcubed]

Leaving aside the security debate I bet most people would be amazed if they used a Blackberry Passport or the new classic for a week. Since changing to the Passport I rarely turn on my laptop or ipad.

Unfortunately, some of the posters are more concerned with explaining how iPhones and droids are superior (or inferior) to each other, rather than actually answering the question you originally posted. I've seen a few Passports around, but you are correct - they are few and far between. Personally, I think it's a good phone with out-of-the-box functionality second to none.

 

[CrazyLarry]

Personally, I think it's a good phone with out-of-the-box functionality second to none.

That's actually quite a pertinent point, **speech phone** functionality (lack of it) aside the other major fault with the IOS / androids is their expectation that to make use of them you'll be buying 3rd party apps because that's part two of making you pay through the nose. Blackberry, although not cheap, always did give you a full range of utility. If they are still doing that its a big factor for a business phone.

Just a pity it's 'samsung silly' in size though, as that rules it out completely for me.

 

[joinercp]

I have a BB for work and an iPhone for personal use.  Short answer is I fully understand why BB is on the verge of bankruptcy.  Although it is a full keyboard model, so I know it is dated.

Blackberry let themselves down with several models running the Blackberry 7 OS. They were buggy and years behind IOS and Android.

The Classic, Z30 and Passport have hardware specs to match any other device on the market while the new OS really efficient and a joy to use. I don't know how I could operate without the HUB.