Bosch Barrel Grip vs. Trion

"Either way, I've yet to find a jigsaw I'd use for anything precise anyways, so the whole conversation is somewhat moot.  And I've had two Trion saws.  I can tell you as a fact that I don't care what jigsaw you use and what blade, there are very few combinations that will yield a perfect 90 degree edge when cutting a 3" radius on 1 1/2" thick built-up particle board counter top stock."

Sorry to disagree, in your mind it may be moot, but the OP was asking about the qualities of both units, just because you don't have the ability to make the cuts doesn't mean its can't or isn't being done others. Setup properly with the right blade the Trion will provide the cut, FACT!

John
 
vkumar said:
Steve at the Festool training center in Las Vegas demonstrated that very thing to us by cutting a counter top that was 1-1/2 inch thick and showed a perfect 90 degree.  You could say that it was Steve's skill, but many of us tried it and got similar results. Seeing is believing.  Till I saw this I also used to think there was no difference between the Bosch and Festool.

Vijay, glad you posted that. This is one of the demos that we do of the Trion. The Trion can consistently reproduce 90 degree cuts in very thick material. I've seen it cut 90 degrees in material that was so thick that our longest blade (which I believe is 6" long) barely had enough length to cut through.
 
I've had two Trions, barrel and d-handle.

I found them to be loud and not that special.  I picked up two of the 35 packs of blades and those do not impress much either.

The Carvex looks like it may just change the jigsaw game anyways, so you'd be foolish to buy into the old design now anyways.

JT
 
Julian Tracy said:
 I can tell you as a fact that I don't care what jigsaw you use and what blade, there are very few combinations that will yield a perfect 90 degree edge when cutting a 3" radius on 1 1/2" thick built-up particle board counter top stock.

JT
Yes,i have found that when using the gold looking blades from Festool,you do get perfect 90 d. cuts.
I used to work with bosch jigsaw until 5 years ago when i got the trion.I like it but i wish that it had a dust blower like the Bosch.
 
I  bought a new Bosch 1581vs in 1986 and it still cuts extremely well today.  I also have a barrel grip and top handle bosch that I bought used and am not sure of the year model, I only know that they are later versions than 1986.   I bought a trion about 3 years ago and and have had a love/hate relationship with it.  I almost gave up on it, but, after modifying the dust collection shroud so that I could actually see the cut line. and adding an LED light in front of the blade, covering the plastic base with wood veneer so tiny bits of cut metal would not embed themselves so easily, It is now a very usable saw.  

After using  the trion with dust collection, I cannot stand using a jig saw without it.   My jig saw use consists of radius cutting in usually 1 1/2" plywood, mdf, and particle board and cut outs for drop in sinks & cook tops.  I've never been completely happy with the trion and look forward to the day the carvex becomes available.

With the same blade (bosch t101bf) the bosch saws will cut a much cleaner cut line than the trion in HPDL and that is dissapointing, but the trion cut is plenty good enough for what I use it for.
 
junk said:
Has anyone done a comparison cutting material in the 3" to 5" range with the Bosch? I know from personal experience the Trion can easily cut 3 1/2" accurately, just curious how the Bosch works in the thicker stuff.

John

John:
You sold me, although it didn't take much convincing after I read about how Kreg used one to build an Arbor. The photos of the the ogees he cut on the ends of those 4x4's was impressive!
I have a 20+ year old Bosch that has served me well, but like Laminator says the dust it throws off drives me nuts.
Tim

 
Tim Raleigh said:
junk said:
Has anyone done a comparison cutting material in the 3" to 5" range with the Bosch? I know from personal experience the Trion can easily cut 3 1/2" accurately, just curious how the Bosch works in the thicker stuff.

John

John:
You sold me, although it didn't take much convincing after I read about how Kreg used one to build an Arbor. The photos of the the ogees he cut on the ends of those 4x4's was impressive!
I have a 20+ year old Bosch that has served me well, but like Laminator says the dust it throws off drives me nuts.
Tim

I agree that the Festool dust collection is nice but everything I have read basically states that the sight line is sacrificed by the plastic shroud.  Also, although Jigsaws without DC can be messy the dust pretty much stays in a small area and is easy to sweep up.

 
I had to pull the shroud off my Festool jig and I never used it again, it is a sight line issue.

The Bosch is a better saw in my opinion., I do have a Trion, but I would not get another. So far in  my mind Bosch makes the best jig saws and definitely some of the best jig saw blades ever made are Bosch.

I can and have made perfect 90 degree cuts with both the Festool and Bosch though.
 
I solved the site line issue for me by enlarging the opening in the dust shroud to 3/8" wide.
The dust collection is still great & I can also see the line. Below is a link to a post I made about it 3 years ago.
You may need to scroll down the page. The post is a comparison of the Bosch & Festool jigsaws

Trion Dust Shroud Mod.

 
I'll just add that my personal preference between the Trion and the Bosch is the Bosch 1591 (barrel grip).  I've used the Bosch with most of their wood/composite/metal blades including thick material and have no problem cutting at 90 degrees even in the thick stuff.  I'm just careful of the blade I pick and my feed rate.  Previous to this I had the top handle version for a short time before Bosch came out with the barrel grip version, but didn't like it compared to a barrel grip and before the Bosch I had the horrible Porter Cable that couldn't cut at 90 degrees in 1/4" balsa plus the blade change mechanism was ridiculous and the sawdust it blew in my face with the blower on or off was frustrating.

If the Carvex turns out to be significantly better than my Bosch, I'll change.  Otherwise I'm very happy with it.
 
I have 5 jigsaws: Bosch top-handled equivalent of your 1591, the newest (2 yrs)
                          Trion Body-grip  (5 yrs)
                          AEG hybrid handle and body grip (10 yrs)
                          Metabo body-grip (8 yrs)
                          Elu body-grip (25 yrs)

All have different strengths and weaknesses, which would be impossible to elaborate on without boring you to tears.

However, my favourite, despite it being the newest (and the one with which I'm least familiar) is the Bosch.
My least favourite, in fact the one that I absolutely loathe and detest, is the Festool.

Reasons for liking the Bosch:  I can preset the speed AND still feather the speed on tricky corners with the trigger.
                                            The lowest speed is lowest on the Elu and then the Bosch for really delicate materials like 3ply.
                                            It has the best blower for clearing the cut line of them all.  I often need to use the saw for site work, and don't really see the need for dust extraction at all.  It's not "dirty" dust like drilling brick etc., and haven't really had any problems with the minuscule amounts produced in client's houses/business premises to date.
                                            The blade locking and ejection mechanism is the best of them all.
                                            I can go from cutting steel to aluminium to thick or thin wood or corners in a fraction of the time it would take with any other.  The automatic lower guide adjustment mechanism is simple, intuitive and reliable.
                                            It feels second only to the AEG in terms of balance and manoevreability.
                                            The base tilting mechanism is streets ahead of all but the AEG, quick, easy and accurate.

Reasons for hating the Festool:  It's predicated around dust extraction; without, it's messy and tends to throw dust into my face when cutting, rendering it useless for me as a site tool.
                                                It takes way too long to change blade types.  It's fussy, complicated, time consuming and I don't always get it right, resulting in either wandering if too loose or premature blade destruction through overheating if overtightened.
                                                It doesn't seem to be as well balanced or feel as "right" in the hand as the others.

I concur with many other replies made so far.  However I'd be very careful when considering some alternatives suggested.  If I bought a Carvex (realistically unlikely given my experiences with its predecessor) I can imagine  driving miles to a client's premises only to find I'd accidentally left the Accessory Systainer containing the bevel foot/baseplate behind!  Many consider the Mafell Cuprex to be the very best Jigsaw currently on the market, but it has similar limitations (not to mention the price).

I cannot for the life of me imagine any circumstance where I'd be using a Jigsaw on a guide rail.  Nor can I envisage the need to be making dimensionally critical cuts in material thicker than 2".

Bosch invented the jigsaw.  They've been making some of the most innovative, if not the best available, jigsaws (and blades) ever since.  It's their specialty, whereas Festool's particular forte is in sanders and routers.  Bosch make terrible sanders, and pretty dodgy routers.

The case illustrated is made by Sortimo, and is in their "L" range.  It's a similar, but incompatible product to Tanos, designed around an interlocking vehicular racking system.  I personally like them a lot, and use them daily for my jigsaw, cordlesses, Kango Hammer and screws.
 
I was in the same situation as you last year, and I tried both at my tool pusher.

I really cant pick any as a winner when it comes to accuracy or cutting trough thick stuff.

The sight line was a bit better on the Bosch and it has a blowing function to keep the sight line free of dust. But that doesn't really matter if you use dust collection.

I you need a really heavy duty jigsaw I'd say take the Bosch. It seems like a tough machine and you could probably easily break the skull on a buffalo by bashing it with the Bosch.

Well...I didn't need that! I needed an accurate jigsaw in the shop with good dust collection and since the Trion was a bit lighter I chose that. I have never regret that and I wouldn't even change it for the Carvex if I was offered to do so free of charge. I tried the Carvex when my tool dealer got it and yes of course it has som advantages...but I just prefer my Trion!

By the way I also tried the Makita but I felt that the Bosch and the Festool was in a better league.

Kind regards
Henrik
 
aloysius said:
I have 5 jigsaws: Bosch top-handled equivalent of your 1591, the newest (2 yrs)
                          Trion Body-grip  (5 yrs)
                          AEG hybrid handle and body grip (10 yrs)
                          Metabo body-grip (8 yrs)
                          Elu body-grip (25 yrs)

All have different strengths and weaknesses, which would be impossible to elaborate on without boring you to tears.

Great review. Thanks!
Tim
 
aloysius said:
If I bought a Carvex (realistically unlikely given my experiences with its predecessor) I can imagine  driving miles to a client's premises only to find I'd accidentally left the Accessory Systainer containing the bevel foot/baseplate behind! 

If you store the systainers locked together, you are less likely to bump into that particular problem.

I see the flexibility of the system as a plus, but I can see your point as well... to a point.

Make sure you don't forget the blades and power cord (or batteries), either...

:)
 
I cannot believe how bad that Bosch splintered the ply on that video I was about to say its not a fair comparison as the Bosch wasnt fitted with the splinter guard but it was  [eek]

I have the newer Bosch model if I get a chance I will do a video review as Im sure it will cut just as good as the Trion. To me Bosch have always been "THE" jigsaw to have after all they did invent the tool.
 
I just watched the video and maybe I missed something but was the orbital action on "high" for these tests?
Also in my experience, with visibility already so limited on the trion, adding the splinter guard completely obscures the cut line.

With the bosch saws I used to always make countertop cutouts after laminating and with the trion I cut them before if at all possible and when I do have to cut after laminating, don't even think of using the orbit mode and thats using a blade that has no set to the teeth at all (T101bf). I've seen the tirion pull chips out of the laminate about 3/16" from both sides of the cut line.    My bosch saw will cut this in the #1 orbit setting with little to no chips at all and has done it thousands of times.

I'm waiting on the carvex with great anticipation and hope it lives up to my expectations.
 
It seems to me that with a good blade, the in and out motion shouldn't matter....

But seriously, what is the explanation to account for why the Festool would be better with the same blade? Higher reciprocating rate?
Better blade guide?
 
Better blade guide as in lack of wander of the blade.  No amount of side force by the operator will let the blade wander. The splinter guard also helps.

Vijay
 
I'd take the Bosch every time against a Trion. Infinitely better sight line - why should the end-user be modifying the Trion shroud just so you can see the cut-line? Deeper cutting capacity on the Bosch for any given saw blade. The Bosch has equal build quality and durability to any Trion.

To cap it all the Bosch is half the price of the Trion.  No contest in my opinion, speaking of the owner of a Bosch (10 years old and still excellent).  I only brought the Trion because I thought it would be vastly superior.  Sorry, in my experience, it's not and if I could go back in time I would never have bought it. 

I have no problem in paying Festool prices for most of their tool, but where jigsaws are concerned the inventor of them still leads the field.  Bosch every time!

Troll
 
I modified the trion because I was too embarrassed to tell my friends I paid $300.00 for a saw that didn't work. LOL.  It is the only Festool I have that I was not satisfied with.  I have also found through the years that If a tool doesn't work exactly like I  want it to, it is a rewarding challenge to modify or improve it.  Now the trion works good enough and I will give it credit for making better 90 degree cuts than my old bosches (With a new blade and freshly adjusted guides).  i love the removable cord( which I modified to about 25')  which makes it easy to store in the sortainer drawer and I  am spoiled to the dust collection.  It will find itself  seeing very little use in my shop once the carvex arrives.
 
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