Bought a C18, no magnet in the spindle?

[demographic]

So, I've bought a secondhand C18 drill driver, it's only got the 13mm chuck and the spindle that holds the chuck has a 1/4" hex hole in its end and deeper down has a 4mm hole in it. No magnet in there though.
Now to my untutored eyes an absolutely obvious thing to have in that 4mm hole would be a magnet so any standard 1/4" bit could be used directly for the shortest possible driver without it dropping out everytime I point the driver down.
Am I missing something?
It seems that in order to sort this out I just epoxy a 4mm diameter by about 5mm long (I've not measured the length yet so that ones a guess) into that little hole in order to have something far more practical.
Anyone else done this or am I missing an important point?
Other than that the C18 seems, err... OK I guess. The torque setting thing seems pretty good but I've been using drill drivers and impact screwdrivers for so long that I have fairly good trigger control and I hardly ever use the torque controls on them anyway.
It's not especially lightweight and nor is it balanced like a ballet dancer either.

 

[Coen]

I have no experience with being a ballet dancer, so wouldn't know about their balance.

I don't remember anymore if the Festools have a magnet there. But reading here;

L

Thread 'Magnets in drills and Centrotec'

Dec 16, 2016

Do the magnets in your drills and bit holders keep coming out of the holders?  It is driving me batty.

• linnlp12
• Replies: 15
• Forum: Festool Tool Problems

It seems they do have it but more people had it fall out.

 

[demographic]

Hmm, theres a small circlip inside the hex that I assume has just lost some of its tension so doesn't do much in the way of gripping. Might pull that out with a pointy hook doo daah and see if I can tighten it up without knackering it.
Or possibly pull one out of a Spax bit holder.
Then I might sort the magnet issue.

 

[Cheese]

I have no experience with being a ballet dancer, so wouldn't know about their balance.

 

[Jim_in_PA]

The native attachment, while certainly of a size that .25" bits can slip into isn't really designed to "hold" them. That hex shaped hole provides support for the length of Centrotec compatible tooling that goes much deeper than the typical .25" bits. (which is why the detent groove is farther down the shaft on Centrotec tools) If you intend to use .25" bits, then there is a magnetic bit holder in Centrotec format that is designed to hold them and it holds them extremely well. It comes standard with the drill/driver kits but if you bought a bare tool...you wouldn't have it.

The Festool impact driver is the exception to this and it does support .25" bits natively.

 

[Coen]

Yeah, but it gives the shortest combination.

I don't know why Festool still doesn't seem to be able to publish basic tool dimensions... but I have used the same function with a Bosch GSR 12v FC, which tool-only is like ~126mm long.

 

[demographic]

Hmm,

The native attachment, while certainly of a size that .25" bits can slip into isn't really designed to "hold" them. That hex shaped hole provides support for the length of Centrotec compatible tooling that goes much deeper than the typical .25" bits. (which is why the detent groove is farther down the shaft on Centrotec tools) If you intend to use .25" bits, then there is a magnetic bit holder in Centrotec format that is designed to hold them and it holds them extremely well. It comes standard with the drill/driver kits but if you bought a bare tool...you wouldn't have it.

The Festool impact driver is the exception to this and it does support .25" bits natively.

Hmm, not quite.
The hole in the end of the spindle isn't that deep at all, this is a standard 25mm long bit that came with some plasterboard screws.

This is it fully inserted, the circlip in the drill driver is about the right place and using this spindle would give the shortest possible driver for tight spaces.
I suspect you are referring to the Centrotec bit holder that fits on this spindle. They have a deeper hole and the groove is located deeper in also.
Centrotec is a rabbit hole I have zero interest in going down as it seems to me to be a way of spending four times as much on proprietary bits that do the same job.
The bit in this is as deep as it goes in but there's a 4mm diameter hole that goes about another 5mm deeper in.

 

[Jim_in_PA]

Hmm, not quite.
The hole in the end of the spindle isn't that deep at all, this is a standard 25mm long bit that came with some plasterboard screws.

I'm sorry I wasn't clear enough...the combination of the Centrotec tooling holder (black with the green rim) and the recess in the tool provide extra length for Centrotec driving and drilling tooling. Only the impact driver is designed to hold bits securely without the Centrotec bit holder. I hope that clarifies my comment.

You can insert a .25" bit into the tool like you show in the photo for tight access, but if it's something "grippy" on the fastener, such as Robertson/Square or Torx, the bit will likely stay friendly with the fastener rather than the tool. I've done that every once in awhile over the 20 years I've been using Festool drill/drivers, but try to use the right angle attachment with a Centrotec bit or .25" in a Centrotec bit holder for tight spaces when it's possible to do so as it doesn't let go of the bit.

If you require the drill/driver to hold the bit directly like you show in your photo, the Festool drill/driver (other than the impact driver) is not going to satisfy your needs.

 

[semenza]

So I did some measuring. The hole does seem to be 4mm. Which means you will need a magnet that is just a touch under 4mm in order to get it into the hole.

Not sure of the depth of the hole. However, that magnet will need to be close to flush in order to hold the bit and also not protrude at all above the hole. Because the shafts on the chucks either butt against the surface around the edge of the hole or come within about 1mm of butting. So if the magnet protrudes at all you may not be able to use any chuck on the drill.

I would be inclined to get the other chucks because they are really good to have (right angle, offset, Centrotec). Use the Centrotec chuck with the Centrotec stubby bits for the shortest set up under normal circumstances. And just use the bit directly in the drill shaft for odd ball situations. Not worrying about the bit pulling out for the once in a while uses.

Also, maybe try magnetizing the bits? That might be enough to keep them in the shaft for occasional use?

Seth

 

[demographic]

Good points about the other chucks, the right angled one and maybe the offset look useful.
I can't see myself going down the installers set route though.
As for the diameter of the hole, well my 4mm drill bit shank fitted down inside it, snug

Then I put it so its against the point where it narrows from 1/4" hex to 4mm round and eyeballed the difference.
So far not even measured that depth properly but it looked to be about a 5 mm extra depth beyond that quarter hex.

So, my idea is...
4mm diameter by 4 mm long N52 magnet, a wee dab of epoxy down the hole then using a short length of brass pipe, push the magnet through the pipe and into the 4mm hole*
Then remove the charging pipe and put a hex bit in the drill spindle with a coating of wax on the end so the magnet sticks to the end without the epoxy sticking it in permanently. With luck that'll hold it flush with the end of the 4mm hole.

Then, hopefully let it cure and then I have a drill that does all the stuff it does now, plus it'll be able to hold the 25 mm totally bog standard bits just like every other magnetic bit holder I own does.

Am I missing something?



*I'm nor so sure about just pushing a decent magnet in the end of the drill unguided cos I feel it might just stick to a side and be a right faff to place properly.

 

[demographic]

Right, so this just wasn't rocket science at all.
I roughened the magnet 4mm diameter by 4mm long, m52 magnets bought off Ebay) by holding it in a set of pliers and scrawped over a coarse diamond sharpening plate.
Cleaned the hole in the spindle end with foam gun cleaner on a cotton bud (think you lot call em Q tips?) Put a bit of mixed up epoxy resin on a cocktail stick into the hole and waggled it about a bit to get coverage in the 4mm round hole part.
Then pushed the magnet through a short length of 6mm external and just over 4 mm internal diameter brass tube set so it definately went where I wanted it.
Waxed the end of a longish quarter hex bit so the epoxy wouldn't stick to it and clamped the entire drill and bit so the slight pressure in the hole wouldn't push the magnet out.
Left it to cure removed the bit and now I have a tool which is far and away better than when I bought it.
It still holds its normal Festool chuck in place but now I can put a 25mm long bit in place without it dropping out.
Obviously its just a magnet so the odd time during use the bit will stick in a screw end, just like a few bit holders I own anyway.