Building a shop front with sliding doors

[Mellowfellow]

Hi all!

I'm designing a shop front that I'll be building out of Douglas Fir. I'm trying to decide how to do it in the best way possible, considering I will not be able to fully build it in my workshop - the ceiling is not tall enough and will have to do some bits in the workshop and some on site.
Also, this is not a standard work that I do or design so any design advice would be appreciated.

Short description - quite a tall shop front - 3m behind a shutter to accommodate couple of chairs and small tables when the doors are not in use.
The doors are sliding. On both sides of the doors there are windows that they'd like to be able to open when the doors are shut.
The unit will be attached to the walls on the sides but will be sticking out on the inside. They like the glass for the natural light
so there's a top on it with 4x glass.
The top will be made as a single unit in the workshop together with the doors and the other parts with be half assembled except for the connection to the top.
At this design stage I have not included any mouldings or rebates just main structures so I could work out what goes where and the best way to do it.
I'm planing on using mainly 45x95/2x4 with some exceptions for door rails. 14mm dominoes + some lap joints here and there. For the mouldings and main profiles I'll probably go for Ovolo profile and use this kit here:https://www.scosarg.com/cmt-800-exterior-interior-door-router-set-s-1-2
or one of infinity tools router kits for doors/windows.

Couple of sticky points that I'm not sure about:

The corners, is it strong enough of I use 2x4 and then directly from it go to the return? Definitely the nicest looking option. Is that good enough also to be used a window frame support that the hinges will be attached to?

The door stiles, can I get away with having them 95mm wide or should I go wider? the bottom rail is 300mm and mid+top ones are 150mm.

I know that in some corners at other things I'll have to use a chisel and won't get away with just using router table + table saw. I'm happy with that.

Thanks!

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[Packard]

When you write “shop” can we assume you are talking about a retail shop and not a woodworking shop?

If you are talking about a retail shop, you will probably have to file plans (usually drawn by an architect).

What kind of sliders are you planning on using?  Residential grade?  Storefront sliders?

I’m probably not the right guy to give advice, but I feel I am on safe ground asking the questions.
https://www.stanleyaccess.com/applications/storefront-doors

I would note that if you put a ceiling fan above the doors, it will keep flying insects out as they cannot handle the downdrafts.  A great way to eliminate mosquito bites.

 

[Mellowfellow]

When you write “shop” can we assume you are talking about a retail shop and not a woodworking shop?

If you are talking about a retail shop, you will probably have to file plans (usually drawn by an architect).

What kind of sliders are you planning on using?  Residential grade?  Storefront sliders?

I’m probably not the right guy to give advice, but I feel I am on safe ground asking the questions.
https://www.stanleyaccess.com/applications/storefront-doors

I would note that if you put a ceiling fan above the doors, it will keep flying insects out as they cannot handle the downdrafts.  A great way to eliminate mosquito bites.

Oh yeahs, it is a shop font for a bakery, not my woodworking shop We don't really need the approval of council for where the location is, typically in some places over here in UK you have guidelines on how to design the shop fronts from the council, but you do not need a planing permission.

 

[Packard]

Some 55 years ago, I stopped in the quaint village of Horseheads, New York.  It probably had a population of less than 5,000.

I stopped to eat in the local bakery/restaurant.  The only thing I really remember about the shot was the store front windows. It consisted of small panes of glass, probably 12” x 12” or so.  Each pane was convex, so that the glass bulged outwards.

The net optical effect was that the view outward was largely undistorted, but the convex glass from the outside made everything miniaturized.  The net effect was that the patrons at the tables had a good view out, but good privacy looking in.  I was impressed.

Of course that window was a dead light (fixed with no way to open it).  You could not use that glass in a slider.

So I got a chance to remember an old trip with my (then) girlfriend, you got information that is likely useless.
https://www.nathanallan.com/product/convex-squares-6-textured-glass/

Unfortunately they show only the glass and not the optical effect.

 

[Lincoln]

Jus some random thoughts -
I'd be surprised if steel posts weren't required, by your planning department, so that might dictate some parts of the design.
Personally, I'd make the door bottom rails a bit smaller and continue that line all the way around the fixed panels.
I like to line things up, where possible - maybe the glass or the v/joint panelling etc. (Can't tell if you've already done that)
I'd pick my locking hardware, before committing to a size for the door stiles.
Shopfronts are tricky down here in Aus, I think you need a builders license to do them now, as they're considered 'structural'.

 

[Mellowfellow]

Thanks for your advice. Steel is not needed here, I’m in London UK and there’s no such requirement.
As for the sizes of the stiles, I want minimal size that I could get away with, currently it’s 95mm and I think it should be okay.  Looking hardware doesn’t matter, it will be a bolt in the floor probably - there’s a shutter in front for when it is closed.
I thought there was another reply to my plea for help, detailed and very helpful to which I couldn’t reply in time as I was working.
Anyways, since posting I’ve updated the corners to 95x95mm instead of 45x95 and going to reduce the top rail of the door to 100mm, so: top 100mm, mid 150mm bottom 300mm.
I guess my next sticky point is the size for the window stiles and rails.

 

[Lincoln]

If you're thinking about building a shop front with sliding doors, I think it's a great idea. Sliding doors can make your shop look modern and inviting, plus they save space compared to regular doors.

Thanks for your input, Mr. AI.