Chisels

[RustE]

Thanks to all responders. I think I’ll go to Highland Woodworking and handle both the Blue Spruce and LN chisels.

I think you’re spoiled. I’d like to get my hands on a Blue Spruce chisel or few.

Although, I can’t complain about my five LN bench chisels.  I went with 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, 5/8, 3/4 to get a nice general purpose set.

 

[ALI Construction]

Don't eliminate the option of vintage.
you could really get some great steel with little tune up on fleabay or even flea markets if you search long enough.
especially if you'll eventually decide to get a single one in a particular size like 1/2" that have bin mentioned above.

I collect Stanley, 750's, 740's and 720's,

but my favorite users are. SWAN socket type, (long and skinny, but surprisingly very strong steel that stays sharp for a while)
for a shorty i'd check E.A.Berg (Swiss made) wonderful steel as well. usually short tang types around, but you may find an odd socket one in a while.
and my other favorite would be STANLEY Everlasting #40 wood handle. those are thru tang one piece beaters that are sollid as a rock. short like 750's and lie Nielsens, but a bit heavier in the handle. some people like that. also that steel is indestructible, i'd argue that it holds up on par or even better then vintage 750's

the Everlasting's were basically the #60's of the 1920's era. with same solid construction but beter look/feel/steel

 

[Alanbach]

Remember that LN makes two different handles for their chisels. The classic handle for chopping and the less common long handle for paring. See if Highland has one of those on hand and use that as well. If you decide on LN buy one extra long handle (handle only) so that you can use it for paring when needed.

 

[derekcohen]

My go-to chisels for dovetailing are Veritas PM-V11. They have narrow lands, which are needed for the tails. The steel is excellent, as is the balance and mass for chopping or paring. For clearing the corners of half-blind sockets, get a Blue Spruce fish tail chisel.

This is a drawer front (in process) in my current build (24-drawer apothecary chest with curved fronts). To get the curves, the dovetailing is done with some wild angles ...


Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Birdhunter]

Again, thanks to all the responders. Lots of good info. The chest dovetail work is amazing as I’m still struggling to get my basic techniques down.

I did get my first dovetail to tap into place. It’s not very good, but a lot better than earlier attempts.

I’m using a Bad Axe saw and magnetic saw guides.

I decided to go with the LN chisels. I bought 5 bench, 2 mortise, and 2 fishtail chisels.

I’ve tried working with a 25 degree primary bevel and a secondary 35 degree bevel. I then tried the chisels without a secondary bevel and I think i get a smoother cut. The chisels leave a shiny surface so I think they are sharp.

What’s the consensus on secondary bevels?

 

[Alanbach]

Were you able to get your hands on a long handle when you tried the LN bench chisels? I would highly reccomend that you buy one. One will cost you $35 plus freight from Lie-Nielsen.  They are really comfortable for paring and really help you line up a nice straight (plumb) approach. I actually have two sets of their bench chisels, one with the short handles and one with the long but all you really need is one or two long handles to break out when you need one. They are shown on LN’s site in the hand tools / chisels / handles section.

 

[ChuckM]

What’s the consensus on secondary bevels?

No consensus out there.

I use them on my blades and chisels except the Japanese ones. I find the micro-bevels easier for my free-hand sharpening routine.

 

[derekcohen]

I’ve tried working with a 25 degree primary bevel and a secondary 35 degree bevel. I then tried the chisels without a secondary bevel and I think i get a smoother cut. The chisels leave a shiny surface so I think they are sharp.

What’s the consensus on secondary bevels?

Bench chisels, especially A2 steel such as the LN, are best used with a 30 degree bevel. You can up the secondary bevel angle to 35 degrees for the mortice chisels, which need to withstand more stress.

The lower then bevel angle, the easier they are to penetrate wood fibres, and they sharper they feel. However everything is a compromise, and 25 degrees for bench chisels will not hold an edge long, especially A2 steel.

The fishtails could remain at 25 degrees, if they come this way, simply because they are used very little and specifically on end grain.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Birdhunter]

I ordered 1 LN long handle. It looks easy to swap handles on the LN chisels.

The technique that I’ve been trying is to mark the saw cut locations and depth of cut in pencil and then make the cut using the magnetic guide and the Bad Ax saw. I then mark the cut line for waste removal with a marking knife. I make a light 90 degree chop on the waste line with a chisel and then remove a flake of waste. I make a deeper cut on both sides removing a little more waste. I then remove most of the waste with a Knew fret saw. The final step is to pare the waste out using chisels.

Does it work to use a mortise chisel to do the final waste removal?

I understand that a secondary bevel will keep the chisel sharp longer at the sacrifice of cutting efficiency.

I have a sharpening station with Course, Fine, X Fine, and XX Fine diamond stones set up that I use with a LN guide. It just takes a few minutes to resharpen a chisel.

I built the angle setting jig that LN recommends and it’s great for a quick accurate angle set for the guide.

I am finding doing the dovetails is both fascinating and far more difficult than I ever thought.

In general, I am increasingly preferring hand tools over power tools. In the past, I bought some extremely nice planes and almost never used them. Hand tools seem to  give a quiet satisfaction that I wasn’t getting from power tools.

 

[derekcohen]

Does it work to use a mortise chisel to do the final waste removal?

No, you cannot do this. It is too coarse a method.

You can partially drill out waste ...

... and then split it away ...

Another method - more advanced (= greater risk for error, but faster) - is to route it out. Here is a video example ...


A couple of articles ...

Half blind dovetails: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/HalfBlindDovetailswithBlueTape.html

Through dovetails: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ThroughDovetails3.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Alanbach]

You are going to like the long handle for paring and yes, they are very easy to remove and reinstall. Just grab the chisel by the socket and then tap the end of the handle against your bench top, at an angle (about 45 degrees to the bench top) exerting side pressure on the handle. A couple of light taps should do it. Then reinstall by firmly grabbing the chisel portion around the socket and hitting the handle straight down (90 degrees to the bench top) against the end of the handle very firmly. Again two to three firm taps should do it.

 

[bertv]

… but my favorite users are. SWAN socket type, (long and skinny, but surprisingly very strong steel that stays sharp for a while)
for a shorty i'd check E.A.Berg (Swiss made) wonderful steel as well. usually short tang types around, but you may find an odd socket one in a while.

E.A. Berg is (was) a Swedish company & their chisels are of exceptionally high quality. AFAIK they made chisels for some other European brands, like Nooitgedagt in the Netherlands — so you may want to include those in your search parameters.

 

[Birdhunter]

I did order a selection of LN chisels and 1 long handle. I later visited Highland Woodworking and handled a couple of Blue Spruce chisels.

My impression is that the LN chisels are excellent general purpose tools. The Blue Spruce chisels feel much smaller and, perhaps, better for finesse work.

I subsequently ordered a few Blue Spruce chisels.

It will be fun trying them back to back although I don’t know if I want to hammer on the Blue Spruce chisels. They are too pretty.

 

[Knight Woodworks]

The Blue Spruce mallet is superb.

John

 

[Birdhunter]

I ordered the Blue Spruce round mallet. Is that the one you recommend?

 

[Alanbach]

You guys are costing me money! I was not aware of Blue Spruce Tools until today. I have an e-mail question out to them. I have a feeling the answer is going to cost me.

 

[RustE]

I bought a Ramelson mallet for $35 or so at a local Woodcraft store. It works for me. And the rock maple is still slightly softer than hornbeam.
https://www.ramelson.com/product-page/14oz-rock-maple-wood-carvers-mallet

 

[Birdhunter]

I am spending a lot of money on nice hand tools. I’m also watching a lot of videos on using hand tools. There must be thousands of YouTube videos on the best way to do dovetails!

There is a possibility that my wife and I will move out of our rather too big home into a retirement community. There, I probably won’t have room for my too large collection of big power tools.

So, I’m learning to do woodworking with hand tools. Except for hammering out dovetails, this mode of woodworking is much quieter. It’s certainly full of challenges.

The next challenge will be how to divest my dearly beloved power tools.

 

[Runhard]

I am very pleased with all of my Blue Spruce Toolworks and LN purchases. I highly recommend them both. BSTW is a great company and the owner, Dave, is a great communicator if you have any questions. I have some Japanese chisels that are good as well. I’m considering buying these two sets next:
http://northmen.com/en/products/woodworking-tools/bench-chisels
http://northmen.com/en/products/woodworking-tools/timber-framing-tools/set-of-5-2

I have added to the collection since, but here is a nice picture.

 

[Birdhunter]

I’ve looked at the Japanese chisels. I noticed the backs are concave except for maybe 1/2” behind the cutting edge.

After the chisels have been sharpened many times, the concave surface would affect the cutting edge.

What’s the secret?