Classified purchase issue

Status
Not open for further replies.
K

kfitzsimons

Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2007
Messages
303
I wasn't sure where to post this, but I thought it was worth writing about just so folks making purchases from the FOG classified are always careful of their purchases.  I've bought several items from FOG members and never had an issue until now. In mid January, I purchased a Midi CT and a 125 orbital sander from "Mark90".  He seemed like a fine fellow to deal with both in emails and on the phone.  When I got the vac with the accessory kit in the systainer, the floor attachment was missing.  It's a $28.00 part from Festool if I have to buy it new.  I emailed Mark Gagnon (Mark90) a couple of times and got an email back that it was in his truck and he'd send it right out. A couple of weeks went by and I emailed him again. No answer.  I called him today and one of his phone numbers is "not accepting" calls and one is a child's "leave a message".  I've not got a return call.  It's not that much money, but folks should be honest about the whole thing.  Just tell me you don't have it and we'll work it out.  But don't ignore the issue.
I've been very impressed with the people I've purchased Festool and Inca machines from.  Very nice to deal with and quality people.  I guess I'm more disappointed more than anything that someone didn't follow up on a purchase on the FOG.
Anyone else have issues that we can learn from?
 
I think it remains a situation of "buyer beware" when we are dealing with people we really don't know and are not dealing with face to face.
Email is not as reliable as people often think it should be and I would not count on it for any critical communication even though you did get one reply it appears.  Phone is better but can be hard to get through if the other person doesn't get back to you too.  Who knows maybe he did send it and it got lost in transit...it happens and has happened to me.  Maybe he didn't recall the piece belonging to the set or lost it somewhere along the way.  I am not saying this is what happened in your specific case but there are many explainations that could be coming into play here.

I guess we all hope and expect that we will be dealt with fairly and quickly, but it brings to mind a deal or two I have been involved in with a friend I have known for 20 years recently.  I felt he was not meeting some of his end of he deal and was taking advantage of the situation but to him there is no issue at all.  I am left to determine how to deal with it and how much sleep to loose over it as you may be in this case too.  You are disappointed by the mis-matchiing of expecations of the whole deal.  But that is part of dealing with used stuff and people we don't really know or have any easy way to hold accountable.  I guess that is in part why we have the option to go to a good local dealer or someone on the internet with a solid reputation, pay the going rate and hopefully get our full expecations met.

Best,
Todd
 
Wow, I feel your frustration.  I purchased a kapex from him a couple months back.  It arrived, but minus one crown stop and the owners manual.  He assured me that he would send both out right away.  Months later and numerous emails, I still have only one crown stop and no owners manual.  It's not a huge deal, but it pisses me off when I think about it. 
 
Guys it appears this Mark90 only joined the forum to sell his stuff. He is not a member that was here for a long while.

When guys join up and then start selling stuff the next day I would not purchase from them unless it was through eBay or somewhere you could complain about the transaction.

I saw him selling things and then noticed he only joined on Jan 8th 2009 and never saw any posts that were really useful to the forum at all. You purchased from someone no one new without the benefit of an arbitrator to fall back on. To me you are lucky you received anything at all. Was the price you paid worth the saving over new to be without pieces and a used item?

I would not hesitate to purchase from someone here that has made 10 posts or more and has been a member for a long period, but buying from a guy that seemed just joined to sell stuff was and is a murky situation. I may be wrong, but it does seem this was the case in this instance. If I am wrong maybe Mark90 can respond.

I do not think anyone should be able to sell anything here unless they are a member in good standing for 90 days and has made at least 20 posts. I think Matthew should make that or something similar a rule to prevent guys that only join to sell stuff.

I would not want to get a bad rap so I would personally make good, but anyone only here to sell items may not care how we feel about them. So lets weed out the guys just wanting to skip ebay fees and not really want to be a participating member.

On the other hand, it may be Mark is experiencing some hard financial times or personal tragedy that is preventing him from getting back to you or sending out the items. Mark90 we are giving you the benefit of the doubt, please send the guys the things you promised and I am sure all will be forgiven.

Nickao

 
Sorry for your troubles guys.  I have to agree that buying from someone who just joined probably isn't a good idea, but there are many who lurk for a long time and then join for a specific reason.  I also agree with Nick that if possible a time limitation be put in place before someone can sell thru the classifieds, but diagree on a number of postings.  If someone has to meet the posting rules, I would doubt that the posts would be beneficial to the forum anyway.

As always, a few cause issues for the whole.

Peter
 
Kfitzsimons and Evergreen sorry to hear about your troubles.

One quick note about new rules for the classified section, Matthew has made it clear he doesn't want to get overly involved. That may extend to implementing new rules and enforcing them. Remember he's started the classifieds as a service to the membership here and it's not fair on our part to turn it into an administrative headache.

The most important rule to follow is common sense and that won't always work out as we can see here. Like Nick, I'd only trust the guys with a long time good standing in the forum. 
 
I don't think this is going to be a consistent problem. It doesn't happen very often and for me, it isn't much to worry about.  I do give people the benefit of the doubt.  These are hard times and maybe people are selling items they really don't want to sell.  Our Craigslist has many posts of "selling, going out of business", or "need the cash".  It's a shame.
 
nickao said:
Guys it appears this Mark90 only joined the forum to sell his stuff. He is not a member that was here for a long while.

When guys join up and then start selling stuff the next day I would not purchase from them unless it was through eBay or somewhere you could complain about the transaction.

I saw him selling things and then noticed he only joined on Jan 8th 2009 and never saw any posts that were really useful to the forum at all. You purchased from someone no one new without the benefit of an arbitrator to fall back on. To me you are lucky you received anything at all. Was the price you paid worth the saving over new to be without pieces and a used item?

I would not hesitate to purchase from someone here that has made 10 posts or more and has been a member for a long period, but buying from a guy that seemed just joined to sell stuff was and is a murky situation. I may be wrong, but it does seem this was the case in this instance. If I am wrong maybe Mark90 can respond.

I do not think anyone should be able to sell anything here unless they are a member in good standing for 90 days and has made at least 20 posts. I think Matthew should make that or something similar a rule to prevent guys that only join to sell stuff.

I would not want to get a bad rap so I would personally make good, but anyone only here to sell items may not care how we feel about them. So lets weed out the guys just wanting to skip ebay fees and not really want to be a participating member.

On the other hand, it may be Mark is experiencing some hard financial times or personal tragedy that is preventing him from getting back to you or sending out the items. Mark90 we are giving you the benefit of the doubt, please send the guys the things you promised and I am sure all will be forgiven.

Nickao
Click to expand...

I like your Idea, but I think it would be difficult for Matt to put those rules in and inforce them.  As others have said and I agreee he put this here for our bennefit so policing it would be unfair.   Maybe we should just accept that rule as a guidance and say if an individual does not meet that standard (or some other) we know if we proceed with a purchase its definately a risk.  In reality they are all at risk.  TM2CW
 
When I buy something over $300 that needs to be shipped and I don't have the protection of Ebay, I use escrow.com.
(I know there are escrow scams out there, this isn't one of them.)
It works great. Seller doesn't get their funds until the buyer ackowledges they got what they paid for.
Only costs a percent or two for peace of mind.

Jim
 
I'm with Bones.  Matthew shouldn't have the burden of policing the classified.  We take individual risks purchasing and we should make our own criteria for evaluating sellers.  I think a very small percentage of folks have a problem buying on the FOG.
 
Making a few rules is not policing. Heck, on at least three other forums I know of you can not even post a link until you make ten posts. There can be at least a few rules in place to protect some of the more computer naive users in the FOG. We have a good rep and someone can easily assume these transactions though not sanctioned by us are  still safer than not.A few rules could not hurt anything. I truly think making a 90 day member requirement to sell is a good thing. It is not policing in any way. Making a restriction preventing brand new members from selling for a short period seems like common sense to me.
 
I was going to ask Matthew about this - but no.  We are responsible for our own actions and decisions.  Look before you buy.  Read before you respnd; etc.

We shouldn't need an administrator to protect us from ourselves.  Common sense...priceless

Peter
 
I always purchase from this forum's classified's, but I try to buy from someone I see posting other than classified. I like to hear if someone has had a somewhat bad experience, because now I know what to expect from said person. Also if the person I purchased with was great, and selling something else, I would try to chime in, saying that my experience was great. Some sort of rating system for the use of classifieds would be nice, similar to the peer rating system, but if not I like how it is now too. I'd rather take a chance on not getting the deal I thought I would get, rather than losing this classified section altogether. Just my $0.02 though.
 
Does anyone police Craig's List?  I doubt it with the complaints I hear.  Anybody want to buy a bridge?
 
nickao said:
Making a few rules is not policing. Heck, on at least three other forums I know of you can not even post a link until you make ten posts. There can be at least a few rules in place to protect some of the more computer naive users in the FOG. We have a good rep and someone can easily assume these transactions though not sanctioned by us are  still safer than not.A few rules could not hurt anything. I truly think making a 90 day member requirement to sell is a good thing. It is not policing in any way. Making a restriction preventing brand new members from selling for a short period seems like common sense to me.
Click to expand...

Let's keep in mind that what sounds like a simple rule has more administration behind it than you think!

Although you say this is not "policing," it does in fact require quite a bit of oversight.

First, I would have to check how long someone has been a member anytime he or she posts a classified.  I would also have to check on the member's post count.  And a post-count requirement could easily be abused: someone would just post enough to qualify.

Next, I would have to remove classifieds from people who have not been a member long enough, or who have not posted enough, which of course would lead to the need for me to explain my actions.

Finally, such rules could penalize recently-joined members who are selling tools honestly.

If it came to that, honestly, I would simply remove the classifieds board altogether.

I've given the classified section a lot of thought, and did my research on how other similar forums handle it.  In the end, it's best for the management to allow classifieds but to have a hands-off approach.  Each member must decide for himself or herself whether to trust the seller.

However, discussions about the experiences you have had with a seller (such as this one) are an excellent way to go about things.  Discussions like this, in my opinion, have a much greater affect than any rules.

As a reminder, I have posted a set of guidelines for classifieds: http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=276.0

Stay in touch,
Matthew

 
I guess I do not get it. There should be a setting somewhere that allows you to exclude users from threads based on time in the forum or number posts they, made set it and you do nothing else. I guess your software is different than other forums I frequent. Many forums exclude me from posting or getting in certain threads until certain conditions are met.

No biggie I personally do not care just thought it was a good idea and if it is to hard to implement  forget it then. I stand by that it still is a good idea whether you can or want to implement it or not is another issue.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

M
ETS EC 125/3 EQ-Plus Replacement Brush / brushes
Replies
2
Views
2K
squall_line
S
F
sysrock br10 conenction issues
Replies
1
Views
107
rmhinden
R
H
Bowed festool 1.4M guide rails
Replies
17
Views
838
TSO_Products
TSO_Products
trampis
CT SYS
Replies
4
Views
581
trampis
trampis
P
Due Diligence; How to avoid being scammed
2
Replies
25
Views
1K
onocoffee
O
Back
Top