CXS 12 form factor

[MMCO]

I was really excited to buy a CSX 12 today after admiring many videos showing the diminutive size and weight. I went to my local Woodcraft to check it out and left empty handed because I struggled to find a comfortable way to hold the drill due to the limited space for fingers. I cannot hold the drill with all 4 fingers in the grip area. I tried it with my index finger outside, like I hold a pistol, but found the indent for the screw irritating and knew this would become an issue with prolonged use. I then switched by having my pinkie out and it felt better but still weird. I cannot be the only person on this forum that has experienced this with the 12. What are others doing to compensate?

 

[Hawkeye0001]

I can totally see this being an issue if you have big hands; the original CXS was much better in that regard.
You might wanna check out the CXS 18 though. The top portion of both drills is identical but offers more space for your hands on the 18V model as battery sits under the handle (instead of the bottom portion being cut out to receive the battery).
A CXS 12 with a battery has the same dimensions as the CXS 18 without a battery, so if you use the 3.1Ah or 4.0Ah it'll still be pretty package small.

 

[UncleRunkle]

I'd say (and my gloves also say this) that I have medium sized hands and don't have a problem and am used to using my middle finger on the drill, but the suggestion above on the CXS18 is a winner. I can use either index or middle on that one, though with that style drill I still use my middle finger. The Milwaukee M12 is big enough.

If you're not beholden to C-style then maybe also consider the TXS12? Haven't tried personally

 

[Cheese]

The CXS 12 and CXS 18 weigh the same but there's more space for fingers on the CXS 18. There also isn't much difference in overall size between the two so they handle similarly. Here's a shot of the additional finger space. The CXS 18 also has about 30% more torque.

 

[mino]

Everyone has different hands .. but was it not the whole point of the C-grip and, especially, the CXS series that one does NOT hold it like a T-drill /whole hand wrapped around the handle/?

Even with my C12 /same as C18/, I would routinely have only three fingers "inside", for short jabs only two even. Holding the drill mainly between my thumb and one or two fingers opposite to it.
When I used three fingers "inside" it was a compromise already necessitated by the C12 being a /comparatively/ heavy drill for a C-grip hold.

With the original CXS as well as the CXS 12, IMO the natural grip is thumb + two fingers opposing it, the ring finger on the trigger and pinkie partially sideways, i.e. not fully "inside".

I see that type of a super-controlled (for both side and up/down motion) grip being the whole point of the CXS 12 existence. So support those stating that if you do not want that type of a grip for whatever reason, the drill is not for you ... and the CXS 18 would be the better fit.

 

[MMCO]

The CXS 12 and CXS 18 weigh the same but there's more space for fingers on the CXS 18. There also isn't much difference in overall size between the two so they handle similarly. Here's a shot of the additional finger space. The CXS 18 also has about 30% more torque.

Very interesting, I assumed the 18 would weight considerable more. I wear XXL gloves so the 18 may be the way to go. Thank you, very helpful.

 

[Jim_in_PA]

Very interesting, I assumed the 18 would weight considerable more. I wear XXL gloves so the 18 may be the way to go. Thank you, very helpful.

While my two CXS are the original format, I was myself tickled by how lightweight and compact the CXS18 is when I bought it. I used it for a bunch of work at the modular home we recently bought to house our disabled daughter and while I still prefer the lighter CXS drill/drivers I have for general work that doesn't require the higher power, the CXS18 was very pleasing as a "do all" tool when I was away from the shop.

 

[GordonR]

Just got the csx 18 delivered today and impressed how compact it is and nice and light even with the 4ah battery
Liking the fact there is room for four fingers to fit within the handle , not too sure which way I will prefer to hold and operate the drill yet (early days)

 

[luvmytoolz]

@GordonR That's good to know thanks!

I've been deliberating for some time now on whether to get the CSX 18, or the CSX12 which seems to be really popular, but I really would like to just stick to the Festool 18V battery range, not add 12V as well.

 

[GordonR]

That's another reason I opted for the 18v as I already have a selection of 4ah and 5ah batteries and also that the 18v has Bluetooth connectivity

 

[derekcohen]

I use the CXS 18 with a 3.0Ah battery. I have 2 of these, but one lasts a very long time. With this small battery, the drill is extra light. I use 3.1Ah batteries in a C12 and PDC18/4 as well. Especially in the latter drill, which would be otherwise heavy and cumbersome with a 5.0Ah. I canot think of a reason to use a larger battery in any of these drills.



Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[GordonR]

I use the CXS 18 with a 3.0Ah battery. I have 2 of these, but one lasts a very long time. With this small battery, the drill is extra light. I use 3.1Ah batteries in a C12 and PDC18/4 as well. Especially in the latter drill, which would be otherwise heavy and cumbersome with a 5.0Ah. I canot think of a reason to use a larger battery in any of these drills.



Regards from Perth

Derek

The weight difference between the 3ah and 4ah is only 200g
The 4ah high power battery has the newer 21700 battery cells whereas the 3ah still has the older 18650 less powerful cells

 

[mino]

The weight difference between the 3ah and 4ah is only 200g
The 4ah high power battery has the newer 21700 battery cells whereas the 3ah still has the older 18650 less powerful cells

Per above, weight is critical for the "C-grip" where you do not have load-bearing fingers inside the grip. Then it is a game-changer with the drill almost unusable when too heavy a battery is used. A heavy battery also impacts control - the drill center of gravity is too far from the grip and drilling axis.

And yes, I have huge hands and still even the 1.5 battery-equipped C12 /1200g total weight, lightest of the full-size C drill configs/ was too heavy for me.

A C-style drill held T-style-ish - fingers inside the grip - the weight is much less of a concern, so I can see you not bothered in particular.


Either way, congrats for a good purchase!

 

[GordonR]

Per above, weight is critical for the "C-grip" where you do not have load-bearing fingers inside the grip. Then it is a game-changer with the drill almost unusable when too heavy a battery is used. A heavy battery also impacts control - the drill center of gravity is too far from the grip and drilling axis.

And yes, I have huge hands and still even the 1.5 battery-equipped C12 /1200g total weight, lightest of the full-size C drill configs/ was too heavy for me.

A C-style drill held T-style-ish - fingers inside the grip - the weight is much less of a concern, so I can see you not bothered in particular.


Either way, congrats for a good purchase!

Can't lift above shoulder height then I need to use two hands whatever the weight of the drill is due to a right shoulder worn out rotator cuff
Sold a Panasonic impact driver to get the lighter cxs for light jobs around the house
The Panasonic with a 5ah battery was 1.7kg

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I haven't seen it mentioned here. Is the sound of the motor running still a factor?
I love my original CSX and it is still my only "extra" battery platform. Someday, that might have to change, especially if I get a tool where 18v comes into play.
The 12v battery is also an orphan, correct? Maybe someday they will design something around it too?
I really don't expect anything for the little CXS batteries, but the 12v seems a shame to ignore.

 

[mino]

...
The 12v battery is also an orphan, correct? Maybe someday they will design something around it too?
I really don't expect anything for the little CXS batteries, but the 12v seems a shame to ignore.

Yup. Though it does use the same charges, so is not that much of an issue.

The one tool where it could have been practical was the OFKC 500 but it went with the 18V packs instead ..

One thing I am kinda unhappy is that the "new" 12V packs were made incompatible with the "old" "12V" packs which work with the C/T12, the PDC/DRC 18/4 and a bunch of other tools that can take the 10.8-18V input voltage, some still in production. That was IMO an unnecessary self-goal by FT, especially the PSC could use a super-light pack ..

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Yup. Though it does use the same charges, so is not that much of an issue.

The one tool where it could have been practical was the OFKC 500 but it went with the 18V packs instead ..

One thing I am kinda unhappy is that the "new" 12V packs were made incompatible with the "old" "12V" packs which work with the C/T12, the PDC/DRC 18/4 and a bunch of other tools that can take the 10.8-18V input voltage, some still in production. That was IMO an unnecessary self-goal by FT, especially the PSC could use a super-light pack ..

Sadly, we can't get the OFKC here. I really don't know where 12v would work though, since that seems to be better with "momentary" tools, like drills. Longer-running motors, like saws, sanders, etc not so well. It seems a little excessive to design a light around 12v? Maybe a laser? (either measuring or level)

 

[mino]

Sadly, we can't get the OFKC here. I really don't know where 12v would work though, since that seems to be better with "momentary" tools, like drills. Longer-running motors, like saws, sanders, etc not so well. It seems a little excessive to design a light around 12v? Maybe a laser? (either measuring or level)

Well, my PSC worked great with the puny 10+ year old 1.5Ah 12V batteries from my C12 .. and was 150g lighter for it compared to using a 3.1 18V pack .. It could really be felt, compared to using it with a 1.8V 3.1, not mention a 5.2 pack. The removed wight far from the cut position made it into a way more agile tool. I even used the DRC 18/4 with the 12V packs a couple times when doing some light work .. reduced the top speed a bit, but at 3000+ rpm it was still aplenty and the same - more agile.

I let go of both the C12 /too heavy for a C-grip for me/ and the PSC /a Trion is a better fit for my usage/, but I absolutely swear that having a super-light pack option for those tools would make a difference. I see the OFKC 500 being in the same league - 3-cell packs can provide 300W+ watts of sustained power easily these days. Plenty for most trimming work.

 

[derekcohen]

The weight difference between the 3ah and 4ah is only 200g
The 4ah high power battery has the newer 21700 battery cells whereas the 3ah still has the older 18650 less powerful cells

Gordon, you realise that 200 gm is closing in on 1/2 lb? Those new batteries sound very promising, but I wonder how much that extra weight will affect the user-comfort? I went to 3.0 because they were the lightest battery I could find (it make the PDC18/4 usable for general work, especially with the Centrotec system). I always have a spare charged to swap over, so the run time does not bother me when in my workshop. I can see that it may impact others.

Thanks for the information. I will check them out.

Regards from Perth

Derek