CXS Centrotec Bit

[stidrvr]

I recently got a CXS, and while I love the drill I'm a little disappointed in the P2 bit that came with it. I kept striping screw heads and noticed that the bit doesn't fully sit in the screw head. Now granted, I know this is petty and its just a cheap bit, but when you buy a $280 drill, you pay for perfection. Otherwise, it's no better than Dewalt. See the Festool bit next to a Dewalt P2. I'm guessing this doesn't happen with other bits.

 

[AlexThePalex]

The Festool bit is a Pozidrive bit.

Your screw is Philips and the DeWalt bit is also Phillips.

[unsure]

 

[rvieceli]

The Phillips bit will say PH2 on it.  [wink]

 

[TylerC]

Thanks for jumping in.

You have a PZ2, which is different from a PH2.  “PZ” indicates Pozidrive, whereas "PH" is Phillips.  PZ2 has extra engagement points that look like little “fins” between the main “fins”.  This prevents the bit from engaging the screw that is not Pozidrive. I hope that helps.

 

[Cheese]

FWIW...this is probably a US problem more than anywhere else in the world. Pozidrive screws just do not exist in the US, and if you want to use a Pozidrive screw, you have to seek them out. So actually, I'd say overall, this would be a pretty common mistaken identity issue over here.

I'd be willing to make a bet, that I could give several of my motorcycle mechanic buddies a Pozidrive bit to remove Phillips screws on their bikes and they'd just dig right in and round out/butcher both the bit and the screw.  [eek]

 

[Locks14]

FWIW...this is probably a US problem more than anywhere else in the world. Pozidrive screws just do not exist in the US, and if you want to use a Pozidrive screw, you have to seek them out. So actually, I'd say overall, this would be a pretty common mistaken identity issue over here.

I'd be willing to make a bet, that I could give several of my motorcycle mechanic buddies a Pozidrive bit to remove Phillips screws on their bikes and they'd just dig right in and round out/butcher both the bit and the screw.  [eek]

This surprises me, I seem to remember that I saw an episode of either The New Yankee Workshop or This Old House where Norm Abram did a segment on the different screw head types available.

 

[Stephen B]

From Wikipedia -
[size=8pt]

Pozidriv Edit
Screw Head - Pozidrive.svg

Screws with the Pozidriv head.
The Pozidriv (sometimes purposely misspelled Pozidrive to avoid trademark infringement) screw drive is an improved version of the Phillips screw drive. Pozidriv was jointly patented by the Phillips Screw Company and American Screw Company. The name is thought to be a portmanteau of the words "positive" and "drive." Its advantage over Phillips drives is its decreased likelihood to cam out, which allows greater torque to be applied.[15][16][17][7] In ANSI standards, it is referred to as "Type IA."[18] It is very similar to, and essentially compatible with, the Supadriv screw drive.[19]

Pozidriv drive bits are often designated by the letters "PZ" plus a size code of 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 (by order of increasing size);[7] the numerical bit size codes do not necessarily correspond to nominal screw size numbers.

[size=10pt]Attempting to use a Phillips screwdriver bit is likely to cause damage because the design difference between them is fairly significant even though at first glance they appear to be very similar.[7] [size=8pt]A Phillips driver has an angle on the flanks, a pointed tip and rounded corners. The Pozidriv screwdrivers have straight sided flanks, a blunt tip and additional smaller ribs at 45° to the main slots.[7] The Pozidriv was designed specifically to allow much greater torque to be applied because of its more positive engagement.[7]

[member=6515]stidrvr[/member]

 

[Cheese]

Knowing the different screw heads available is far different than actually using/seeing them in service.

The only item I know that comes with PZ screws standard are the Blum products. Otherwise, if I purchase a European product it usually uses PZ, but that's about all that I ever run into.

Actually, I'd rather the US manufacturers would start to phase out Phillips and use PZ instead.  [thumbs up]

 

[Locks14]

[member=49749]Locks14[/member]
Knowing the different screw heads available is far different than actually using/seeing them in service.

The only item I know that comes with PZ screws standard are the Blum products. Otherwise, if I purchase a European product it usually uses PZ, but that's about all that I ever run into.

Actually, I'd rather the US manufacturers would start to phase out Phillips and use PZ instead.  [thumbs up]

Yes PZ are certainly better than PH, the only thing in the UK that I currently use that are PH is dry wall screws.

 

[jimbo51]

This reminds me of the situation when Festool put 20 amp plugs on extractors without realizing that few people in the US had dedicated 20 amp outlets. I have their shorty adaptor firmly taped to the original plug.

 

[RKA]

3 drills here, all came with a PH2 bit.  I think you got an odd duck.  Save that bit, you'll encounter a pozidrive screw eventually.

 

[stidrvr]

As I hang my head in shame, and embarrassment. I'd like to thank the people who were actually decent human being and pointing out the fact that it was a Posidrive bit. Yes, I did see the "fins" between the points, figured it was an antislip feature. I was also confused as the point of the bit hardly fit in the screw, making me believe it was a tad oversized. I mean, you buy a drill that ships with "ONE" bit, I assumed it would be a PH2.

 

[Cheese]

Well that's certainly interesting...a CXS shipped to the US with only one bit, that just happens to be a PZ bit. Who'd have thunk..,,.that's kind of reminiscent of shipping 20" automobile wheels to Britain with 5/8" hex nuts...a serious disconnect.

[member=6515]stidrvr[/member] ,
Just enjoy your new Festool drill and use the correct bit, it can be confusing and by the way,  [welcome] to the FOG.

 

[Jimdude]

Actually, I'd rather the US manufacturers would start to phase out Phillips and use PZ instead.  [thumbs up]

The wiki quote above is 'wrong'. PZ is not an 'improvement' on PH, it just suits different needs. PH heads are designed with a taper in the X-slot so that the bit will drive itself out when you try to overtighten the screw. That feature certainly has its place in a shop (especially automotive).

As such I see no reason to 'phase out' PH. although I do bloody hate them in woodworking .

 

[TomE]

OP, next time you might leave out the 'I paid such and expect such' when framing a 'complaint'. This is a Festool group, we've all paid such and expect such.

Just ask the question. There are plenty of folks here that'll come up with answers.

 

[waho6o9]

Welcome to the learning curve!

A high end cabinet supplier gave me a pozi screwdriver and I said thanks for the phillips screwdriver

she said it's a pozi. Oops

 

[jwaite550]

I also never heard of Pozidrive until introduced to the world of Festool a couple of years ago and began my hobby.  I was a fireman by trade, but built, wired, HVAC and plumbed both of my houses I lived in.  I considered myself to know a fair amount about a lot of things, but this was a new one.  Every day that I watch many of you on youtube, I learn something else I didn't have a clue about.  I am sure this will and hope it does continue until the day I am gone.  Don't feel bad at all, this is how we learn.  Have a great day and learn something else. 

 

[mike_aa]

A couple of sources on screw types:

One from Wikipedia

Post on Instructables

Mike A.

 

[semenza]

I also never heard of Pozidrive until introduced to the world of Festool a couple of years ago and began my hobby.  I was a fireman by trade, but built, wired, HVAC and plumbed both of my houses I lived in.  I considered myself to know a fair amount about a lot of things, but this was a new one.  Every day that I watch many of you on youtube, I learn something else I didn't have a clue about.  I am sure this will and hope it does continue until the day I am gone.  Don't feel bad at all, this is how we learn.  Have a great day and learn something else. 

Yup, always good to learn something. Those little added fins are not always easy to spot. Especially if you are not even thinking they exist in the first place.

Seth

 

[semenza]

As I hang my head in shame, and embarrassment. I'd like to thank the people who were actually decent human being and pointing out the fact that it was a Posidrive bit. Yes, I did see the "fins" between the points, figured it was an antislip feature. I was also confused as the point of the bit hardly fit in the screw, making me believe it was a tad oversized. I mean, you buy a drill that ships with "ONE" bit, I assumed it would be a PH2.

Simple mistake. We all make them.

I would also like to thank those that were decent in their response.

Seth