Dewalt DWS520SK vs Festool TS55EQ - long with pictures

[Gary Nichols]

Well, until now, I've been hesitant to add my 2 cents, but I was sure I had seen a more substantial Festool rail square once upon a time, just couldn't find a photo to back up that claim. I have and occasionally use the newer Festool square, not as much as I would like, since it's just too bulky for me to leave it on all the time. The old one looks like it would have been a little more handy to me. So if you go to:

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/festool_atf_55e_part1.htm

you can see a not-so-great photo of it in a systainer, and if you watch the videos titled "Play Guide Rail Video Part 1" and "Play Guide Rail Video Part 2", you can see it in action.... try the higher quality  videos (1.3 MB and 2.1)..... I just KNEW I wasn't dreaming that thing.......

That said, I'll be placing an order for the Dewalt T-square attachment on Amazon today..... Thanks, Daviddubya, for the heads-up

Gary Nichols

 

[Jimhart]

Here's a couple of pictures of the older clamp in action.

While it looks a lot less substantial than the newer one, it has a few advantages that make it much more practical and stable.

It attaches to the rail by design, advantage #1. When you tighten it, the non slip strips contribute to locking it in place.

The scale, while it doesn't look near as good, is every bit as useful as the one on the newer one, which is not at all.

You need to use a square with either to know you've got the angle, so this is a tie.

(I'll go learn to upload pics and be right back  ;D)

Jim

 

[Jimhart]

I just posted a couple of pics of Festools older angle guide for the guide rails.

 

[nickao]

I have that unit and it works great for me.

 

[fshanno]

Looks like it has a stop at about 47 degrees.

 

[tenfingers]

when i bought my festools today, at the store they had the dewalt saw on display next to the festool.
The festool TS55 was $475 and the dewalt was $499. The store owner said he didnt realize that it was more and that it
was very interesting. We both commented that the dewalt wouldnt sell as well vs the festool if the prices were comparable.

Martin

 

[Peterm]

The festool TS55 was $475 and the dewalt was $499.

Wow; DeWalt are being much more aggressive in their pricing here in the UK. I've just had a 'show special' email for an upcoming trade show, and the price for the DeWalt with a 1.5m rail and bag is ?280 UKP vs ?381 for the TS55 & 1.4m rail - enough of a difference to sway some potential buyers away from Festool, I would think.

Personally, I'll just be stocking up on some DW accessories for my Festool rails...

Pete

 

[richard.selwyn]

All the Festools I own were made in Germany, and I think the only one made outside is the linear sander.

I know that Tooltechnic or whatever the parent company is called has a plant in Czech Republic or Slovakia, but it may be that they only make Protools there.  I have come across quite a lot of stuff made in Eastern Europe (including my wife's Skoda) and I'm impressed with the quality.  I'm typing this on an Apple Computer stuck together in China which I love. 

I tend to think it's not so much where its made but what standards are demanded by the parent company.  The Chinese seem capable of producing high quality electronic goods for Apple etc and REALLY RUBBISH PLYWOOD (not to mention poisoness baby milk...toothpaste...) that I've been using all week.  I hate it.  Trouble is its half the price of the local stuff and the client won't pay the difference,  It's full of voids and even bits of metal - my table saw was sparking yesterday.  Sorry for the rant.

 

[Forrest Anderson]

All the Festools I own were made in Germany, and I think the only one made outside is the linear sander.

I know that Tooltechnic or whatever the parent company is called has a plant in Czech Republic or Slovakia, but it may be that they only make Protools there.  I have come across quite a lot of stuff made in Eastern Europe (including my wife's Skoda) and I'm impressed with the quality.  I'm typing this on an Apple Computer stuck together in China which I love. 

By co-incidence I noticed the Czech connection with my LS130 linear sander the other day, but things don't seem to be quite as straightforward as they first seem:

Here is what appears on the Systainer label of the sander...

...and here is what appear on the label on the sander itself:

Given these labels, it appears that it's the Systainer which is made in the Czech Republic, not the sander!

I looked at some of my other Festools, and found the following:

The LS 130 has a "Made in Germany" label, whilst its Systainer (made Aug 05) has a "Made in Czech Republic" label.

My two Sortainers (made Mar 07 and May 07) both have "Made in the Czech Republic" labels

The Rotex RO125 and its Systainer (made Oct 04) both have "Made in Germany" labels

The TS55 and its Systainer (made Feb 07) both have "Made in Germany" labels

The Domino and its Systainer (made Feb 08) both have "Made in Germany" labels

The Domino Accessories Systainer (made Nov 07) has a "Made in Germany" label

To summarise - all the above power tools have "Made in Germany" labels - it seems to be the Sortainers and some of the Systainers which are made in the Czech Republic.

Forrest

 

[Frank Pellow]

That's interesting Forrest.  I checked all my Festool tools and the only one that is not labelled 'Made in Germany' is my LS130.  It does not have any 'Made in ...' text.  Here are photos of the two labels:

[attachimg=#1]

[attachimg=#2]
I thought that maybe Wedingten was a place in either Germany of the Czech Republic, but could not find such a place in my atlas.

 

[Forrest Anderson]

That's interesting Forrest.  I checked all my Festool tools and the only one that is not labelled 'Made in Germany' is my LS130.  It does not have any 'Made in ...' text.  Here are photos of the two labels:

Thanks for that. I'm pretty sure your sander was made in Germany.

I thought that maybe Wedingten was a place in either Germany of the Czech Republic, but could not find such a place in my atlas.

Wendlingen (note spelling, which is maybe why you didn't find it) is a small town about 11 miles south east of Stuttgart, and is home to the Festool factory. See the Festool Germany website for address and contact information and Google Maps for a aerial photo/map.

For details of a factory visit you might like to read "Festool Comes to Highland and Highland Goes to Festool" from Wood News Online.

Forrest

 

[Frank Pellow]

I thought that maybe Wedingten was a place in either Germany of the Czech Republic, but could not find such a place in my atlas.

Wendlingen (note spelling, which is maybe why you didn't find it) is a small town about 11 miles south east of Stuttgart, and is home to the Festool factory. See the

Thanks Forrest, The name of the place was quite faded on my sander.  I'm glad you could set me right and I also thank you for the links.

 

[Tinker]

Here's a couple of pictures of the older clamp in action.

While it looks a lot less substantial than the newer one, it has a few advantages that make it much more practical and stable.

It attaches to the rail by design, advantage #1. When you tighten it, the non slip strips contribute to locking it in place.

The scale, while it doesn't look near as good, is every bit as useful as the one on the newer one, which is not at all.

You need to use a square with either to know you've got the angle, so this is a tie.

(I'll go learn to upload pics and be right back  ;D)

Jim

Jim,
I have been rearranging my shop for most of the summer.  I'm finally getting close to making it workable.  The next step will be to locate all i have stored in new places and get labels printed up so I can RELOCATE tools without opening every drawer and sliding aside everything on every shelf.  That is the next challenge.

While sorting out drawers a couple of weeks ago, i came across the item you show in your pics and have been scratching my head as to how it is to be used.  It must have come with my original purchase of my ATF 55/MFT 1080.  I was so thrilled with the setup of guide rail/fence to cut square that i just stuck that little squaring device into a drawer with a lot of other almost never used items.

Thanks for the pics.  i now see how it can be used. (I've been scratching my head over it) It can be set to hold its angle much better than the MS-KS square that has been subject of much frustration for so long.  If it can work and hold its angle for repeatable cuts, I will report back when I get back into shop to work on projects.

Right now, I am going full speed and with aches & pains to show for it, trying to beat the frost and snow for my outside work.

Tinker

 

[Gary Nichols]

Tinker,

Here's a few videos of that old angle square in action. It's so much less obtrusive than the newer model, that I wonder why they ever stopped making it. If Festool ever decides to bring it back, I'd be first in line.

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/graphics/festool/atf/guiderail1_low.wmv

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/graphics/festool/atf/guiderail2_high.wmv

As to where our Festools were made, has anyone else been a little surprised about the Festool Shop Apron Promotion? There is no place of origin on the Mini-Systainer sticker, but the apron itself says it's made in China, for Bucket Boss:

[attachimg=#]

Coincidentally, I received a Bucket Boss Christmas flier in the mail the same week, and there is no shop apron shown....

Gary Nichols

 

[tarpon2007]

Couple of other/additional points on the Dewalt track saw vs the Festool TS55EQ, based on seeing it demo'd and using it at a show at the local (Orlando) Woodcraft:

1.  By nameplate amps, the Dewalt motor is 12A vs 10A on the Festool - or, at 120V, ~ 1400 watts of power for the Dewalt, 1200 watts for the Festool.

2.  The Dewalt rep recommended doing a very shallow scoring cut first, then a through cut if tearout on the offcut piece is problematic.

3.  The local Woodcraft sells both.

4.  The Dewalt's price can be and was discounted at the show.  10% off.  No discount on Festool for retail buyers.

5.  The Dewalt's track can be used on either right or left edges, so you can hold the saw with your right hand on edge cuts on a sheet of plywood where you can't with the Festool.  For people who are sinisterly (left handed) challenged like me, that's a plus.

6.  The Chech's have a long history of very fine machine work - both the Germans and the Russians used them for weapon and aircraft manufacture when they occupied them - I'd pick their stuff over Taiwanese or PRC stuff any day.

7.  The Dewalt track saw is just that - a saw and a track and a couple of minor accessories, while the Festool is part of a system with the MFT worktables and all the rest of the Festool stuff.

8.  So far, in the US, only the standard 48 tooth blade for the Dewalt, while many (though expensive) choices for the Festool.  I did ask the Freud rep at this show about availability in the US of Freud blades for the Festool and/or the Dewalt track saws, but they apparently are not available here, though they are in the UK and the rest of the civilized world.

All told, the Dewalt seems like a very good saw and track, but I own a Festool TS55EQ and it's accessories, and in all, have been very pleased with it.  I do think giving Festool some healthy competition is good, though.

 

[fshanno]

.........

2.  The Dewalt rep recommended doing a very shallow scoring cut first, then a through cut if tearout on the offcut piece is problematic.

.........

I went to one of the Woodcrafts in Houston for the sales event there.  They had the DeWalt there as well and I went over the saw with the DeWalt rep.  We talked about off cut chip out but he didn't mention the scoring pass.  Ironically I used the example of the scoring blade that most sliders have to emphasize the importance of chip out protection. 

Then I saw your post today and I tried the scoring pass technique with my TS55 minus the chip out protector.  It works very well on melamine.  So the green thingy is not drop dead essential after all.  It's just a nice convenience.  I never thought of this.  Is it common knowledge in the Festool world?  It's news to me.  To be perfectly honest I think the scored cuts without the green thing are better than single pass with it.  Have you tried it?

By the way, did they trip a SawStop at your show?  They ran a weenie through the contractor saw in Houston.  It's something you have to see it to appreciate.  I've got to get one of those.  People say the riving knife is probably just as important as the brake.  I had some QS white oak close up on me yesterday on my stupid little ancient Sears contractor saw.  It was so bad that it just stopped the cut.  I had to turn off the saw, flip the board over and start from the opposite end.  It was spooky and I burned the heck out of the board.  I wish my wife had seen it.  Actually, the fact that the saw is so weak saves me.  It bogs down before it can kick back.

 

[JEFF JOHNSON]

Does the dewalt router attachment fit on festool rails?

 

[tarpon2007]

.........

By the way, did they trip a SawStop at your show?  They ran a weenie through the contractor saw in Houston.  It's something you have to see it to appreciate.  I've got to get one of those.  People say the riving knife is probably just as important as the brake. 

[/quote]

No hotdog cutting demo this time.  Meat (and Sawstop cartridges and blades) must be too expensive in this time of economic crisis... ;D

As to the riving knife, I know that most of my traumatic experiences on the tablesaw involved kickback, which is what the riving knife helps prevent.

 

[Peterm]

Does the dewalt router attachment fit on festool rails?

Don't have one to try, but I don't see why not - unless it only attaches to the second 'rib' of the DeWalt rail i.e. the one closest to the rubber splinter-guard; if it does, it probably won't have enough reach if used on a Festool rail?? I think I'd want to try it out before buying one..

Cheers, Pete

 

[Frank-Jan]

The dewalt rail only has 1 rib, in the middle. (It's the saw that has 2 "grooves", so it can ride on the festool rail aswell). The routerattachment is quickly demonstrated at 1 min 50 in the video I looked at the routerattachment picture in the accesories part of the site, because I could be possible the rods went through both holes in the routerbase, like a parallel-guide; but it doesn't, so my guess is it won't work on the festool rail. (the rods just look too short)