Dewalt DWS520SK vs Festool TS55EQ - long with pictures
- Thread starter BloomingtonMike
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I recieved my DeWalt T-Square and I've had a chance to try it out. From what I've seen so far it works great. At this point I believe it's a must have considering its low cost. It small, light and attaches/detaches rapidly and about as accurate as any other portable method for crosscutting sheet goods.
It's not for ripping and I wouldn't attach it to anything longer than the 55" guide. You need a very clean reference edge. But all in all it's a sweet little tool.
The T-square has a notch so that a clamp can be inserted in the rail ahead of it allowing clamping on both ends. And here's the ironic part. From my observations on 3/4 material the Festool clamps work better than the DeWalt clamps in this role. The DeWalt clamp is essentially a typical Irwin style pistol grip clamp and when fully engaged on 3/4 or thinner stock the clamping trigger contacts the thumb screw on the bottom of the t-square making it difficult to push the release trigger. The handles on the Festool clamps face the other way and don't interfere.
The T is only a few inches so it has it's limitations. The friction of the guide rail, which we love so much, works against the T-Square in this application. It's not a big problem on melamine or prefinished ply but on unfinished ply there is quite a bit of force working against you as you squeeze it up to your mark. It would be best work in ways that avoid cumulative error. My initial testing indicates that I'm getting crosscuts on sheet goods that are as accurate as anything else I've tried. It's like the two guys in the woods wondering what they would do if a bear attacked. One said he doubted they could out run a bear. The other said, "I don't have to out run the bear. I just have to out run you." This little thing may out run the MFT for crosscutting sheet goods.
Thank you DeWalt, now lets get started on something inexpensive for parallel rips.
It's not for ripping and I wouldn't attach it to anything longer than the 55" guide. You need a very clean reference edge. But all in all it's a sweet little tool.
The T-square has a notch so that a clamp can be inserted in the rail ahead of it allowing clamping on both ends. And here's the ironic part. From my observations on 3/4 material the Festool clamps work better than the DeWalt clamps in this role. The DeWalt clamp is essentially a typical Irwin style pistol grip clamp and when fully engaged on 3/4 or thinner stock the clamping trigger contacts the thumb screw on the bottom of the t-square making it difficult to push the release trigger. The handles on the Festool clamps face the other way and don't interfere.
The T is only a few inches so it has it's limitations. The friction of the guide rail, which we love so much, works against the T-Square in this application. It's not a big problem on melamine or prefinished ply but on unfinished ply there is quite a bit of force working against you as you squeeze it up to your mark. It would be best work in ways that avoid cumulative error. My initial testing indicates that I'm getting crosscuts on sheet goods that are as accurate as anything else I've tried. It's like the two guys in the woods wondering what they would do if a bear attacked. One said he doubted they could out run a bear. The other said, "I don't have to out run the bear. I just have to out run you." This little thing may out run the MFT for crosscutting sheet goods.
Thank you DeWalt, now lets get started on something inexpensive for parallel rips.
Jnh. Design
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Well first off i would like to thank every one who contributed to this thread. I have been very interested in the differences between these saws, and this thread has a remarkable amount of owner input. after reading all of the posts here, and finally making my way to my local woodcraft to try the festool, I think i have made my decision based on the very first picture......
Yep I am going to be the proud new owner of the Dewalt... why? most of you are probably thinking.. as a majority of the posts would point to the festool as being their choice... well for me, the side by side comparison shows it all.. on the festool, the angle of the handle changes as you adjust the depth of cut. the dewalt seems to stay the same. The fes. just didn't feel right until it was plunged all the way..
Note* that clamp rack looks mighty familiar mike
Yep I am going to be the proud new owner of the Dewalt... why? most of you are probably thinking.. as a majority of the posts would point to the festool as being their choice... well for me, the side by side comparison shows it all.. on the festool, the angle of the handle changes as you adjust the depth of cut. the dewalt seems to stay the same. The fes. just didn't feel right until it was plunged all the way..
Note* that clamp rack looks mighty familiar mike
Obviously its personal preference, but I have to say that I've never even considered that the angle of the handle changes with plunge depth, so I don't see how it can really make any difference. If the Dewalt is even half the saw the Festool is, it will be a great tool.
Fred
Fred
Jnh. Design
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so I went and demoed the dewalt and wasnt pleased at all. I used a piece of melamine for my test piece, and even with thier best blade, i had unsatisfactory results. the clamps that were supplied didnt even fit in the rail, and needed the top of them ground. the rail itself felt very brittle, and would not hold firm to the melemine with out the use of clamps. the plunge action ( what I thought would sell me this saw) actually was not very smooth, not even close to the 55. after my demo I drove to woodcraft and just bought the festool 55.
and i am very pleased.
and i am very pleased.
robtonya
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I haven't heard yet, and maybe it has already posted, but does the Dewalt have the circuit protection that the Festool has? That is a big deal to me. Also thanks to daviddubya,( his link to Amazon was one of the few that still had it in stock) I purchased the T-square, and it is nice. I didn't expect it to be aluminum for some reason. It fits nice and tighter, and using my cheap-o square, it seems right on.
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Mr. Design.
When people ask me why I spend tha amount of money that I do on the Festool products, I tell them that I research my purchases and what I have found is that Festool makes claims and delivers on them. Others hype and don't. That being said, I have plenty of tools from all the other manufacturers that have served me well because I have learned what to anticipate and also what to accept. Every power tool that I bought since 1983 (except the miterbox that was run over by the bus - not my fault - loaned out - is working and can be utilized. Unfortunately for them, I have found better than them.
I hope that you enjoy your new saw.
Peter
When people ask me why I spend tha amount of money that I do on the Festool products, I tell them that I research my purchases and what I have found is that Festool makes claims and delivers on them. Others hype and don't. That being said, I have plenty of tools from all the other manufacturers that have served me well because I have learned what to anticipate and also what to accept. Every power tool that I bought since 1983 (except the miterbox that was run over by the bus - not my fault - loaned out - is working and can be utilized. Unfortunately for them, I have found better than them.
I hope that you enjoy your new saw.
Peter
BloomingtonMike
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The JLT is the best tool I have driven for in a long time. Thanks again for that sale!
Sorry the Dewalt tracksaw was not to your liking. I have to say I had quite a different experience with the two saws in my shop. Ultimately you need to be happy with your tools so you DEFINATELY made the right choice.
Did you change shop spaces yet?
Sorry the Dewalt tracksaw was not to your liking. I have to say I had quite a different experience with the two saws in my shop. Ultimately you need to be happy with your tools so you DEFINATELY made the right choice.
Did you change shop spaces yet?
Jnh. Design
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ahh the shop, yeah its about 8000sf now. I have the main 4k for processing, the area that previosly housed the JLT is now strictly a finishing room, with a prep room, spray booth, and 12x20 curing room. i added the 3500sf unit with the 5 bay doors to the mix, and use that for final assembly and packaging.
i made a bunch 4x8 carts that make the flow even better. i can load them up, wheel em into the booth, curing room. then off to final assembly..
not bad for a 1 man show. now I need to find some people that want to learn this craft!!
i made a bunch 4x8 carts that make the flow even better. i can load them up, wheel em into the booth, curing room. then off to final assembly..
not bad for a 1 man show. now I need to find some people that want to learn this craft!!
Just a FYI. I was at Woodcraft today and the rep was there with the Dewalt saw as well as the new Unisaw by Delta (more on that in a minute). I have to say there were some interesting things about the Dewalt. First, it has a built in kick back feature that I think the Festool could benefit from. Second, the thing goes on the track both ways. Not sure how often I would really do that or why, but it was interesting. Third, he walked right over the MFT/3 and put it on the Festool track. Fourth, the motion you use to plunge is linear and keeps the wrist in the same position throughout the plunge vs. how the Festool is more of a push and forward sort of curve motion. I was so used to the Festool I couldn't plunge it the first time. It's weird. I guess from a pure ergonomics perspective that it a plus especially if you use the saw all day. Fifth, their track was slightly more rigid, but nothing compared to the EZ guide rails. 6th, they had a deal where you get two rails that when joined will have you able to rip 4 x 8 sheets from the get go. I saw no clamps and they have no plans for a table like the MFT/3. All in all, I thought it was neat, but didn't feel that I made the wrong decision with my TS75, though again, I liked that kick back feature (in the saw, not a rail stop).
The rep also went over to the Kapex and pointed out five patented features that belong to other manufacturers hold and, according to him, are suing Festool over.
Off topic: Okay, the Unisaw sure looked awesome. It is built in Tennessee! It has a new funky looking blade guard like the new little Bosch 4000 saw and everything including the riving knife can be adjusted or removed with no tools. It has well thought out dust collection, a biesemeyer fence and the extension table has a big drawer (that can be removed if you want to mount a router. All in all the thing had me drooling and I didn't even ask the price. Meanwhile, I used a friends Saw Stop cabinet saw last night and that was near orgasmic as well.
The rep also went over to the Kapex and pointed out five patented features that belong to other manufacturers hold and, according to him, are suing Festool over.
Off topic: Okay, the Unisaw sure looked awesome. It is built in Tennessee! It has a new funky looking blade guard like the new little Bosch 4000 saw and everything including the riving knife can be adjusted or removed with no tools. It has well thought out dust collection, a biesemeyer fence and the extension table has a big drawer (that can be removed if you want to mount a router. All in all the thing had me drooling and I didn't even ask the price. Meanwhile, I used a friends Saw Stop cabinet saw last night and that was near orgasmic as well.
Dave Ronyak
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Deke,
I witnessed a similar demonstration at Woodcraft's store in Bedford, OH (near Cleveland) about 2 wks ago. They had demo clamps there, and both the fixed 90 degree crosscut rail accessory and a similar device with an adjustable mitre head, but none to take with me. I personally confirmed that all of these accessories will fit Festool's Guide Rails while at that store. I pre-paid for a pair of clamps and the fixed 90 degree accessory, and am still waiting for delivery. I'm looking forward to using them, and freeing up a couple of Festool clamps. A new MFT/3 was nearby. I showed the DeWalt representative how the Festool clamps work with the MFT and told him that a even more Festool owners would be interested in those clamps if they were redesigned to also allow them to be used with holes in the MFT top.
Dave R.
I witnessed a similar demonstration at Woodcraft's store in Bedford, OH (near Cleveland) about 2 wks ago. They had demo clamps there, and both the fixed 90 degree crosscut rail accessory and a similar device with an adjustable mitre head, but none to take with me. I personally confirmed that all of these accessories will fit Festool's Guide Rails while at that store. I pre-paid for a pair of clamps and the fixed 90 degree accessory, and am still waiting for delivery. I'm looking forward to using them, and freeing up a couple of Festool clamps. A new MFT/3 was nearby. I showed the DeWalt representative how the Festool clamps work with the MFT and told him that a even more Festool owners would be interested in those clamps if they were redesigned to also allow them to be used with holes in the MFT top.
Dave R.
EcoFurniture
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Martin Johnson
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There were a number of reviews in the woodworking pubs...basically they all came down to about the same conclusions, and this was before we had the parrallel guides...there are few more coming out, but I can't say which ones until they hit the street, but the results are about the same. Most rank them like this:
1) Festool
2) Makita
3) Dewalt
http://www.festoolusa.com/SysNotes/SysNotes-May-2009.html
1) Festool
2) Makita
3) Dewalt
http://www.festoolusa.com/SysNotes/SysNotes-May-2009.html
I had Dewalt plunge track saw for over a year. Nothing to complain about. The plunge action is a bit weired at first but I got used to it. I modified Dewalt to accept Festool off-cur splinter guard - took me 30 min. The track allows to clamp to narrower stock due to central position of the channel. This is the part I miss most working with Festool track saws. Also, the Dewalt guide rail router adapter fits multitude of routers from different manufacturers. It could be used with Festool rail, but needs to be shimmed to remove all play - no big deal, really. Major con of Dewalt track is having splinter guards on both sides - makes it impossible to butt the rail against a T-square for 90 degree cuts on sheet stock, - you have to mark it on both sides of the sheet, then carefully align the rail. Also, since they have only one channel making DIY parallel guides (no OEM version produced unfortunately) is problematic (although not impossible). Dewalt clamps are awesome. I sold Dewalt saw and rails with almost no loss and bought TS75, - only to have deeper cut capacity. Thinking of getting a lighter TS55 to use on the same rails, but might get another Dewalt since it glides on Festool rails as well.
As a final thought I think Dewalt really dropped the ball with pricing and marketing of their awesome tool. Had they dropped a price a bit and insisted on big box stores carrying this product in stock so that people could see it, touch it and maybe test it in stores they would have sold tons of those saws. Offering parallel guides, rail adapters for jigsaws, etc. would have also helped.
As a final thought I think Dewalt really dropped the ball with pricing and marketing of their awesome tool. Had they dropped a price a bit and insisted on big box stores carrying this product in stock so that people could see it, touch it and maybe test it in stores they would have sold tons of those saws. Offering parallel guides, rail adapters for jigsaws, etc. would have also helped.
I like my DeWalt too. One disadvantage it has is the reviewers all tend to be Festool users who consider the plunge of the DeWalt odd and undesirable. Wood Whisperer is a Festool guy. The guy that did the Fine Homebuilding review was also a Festool user. I like the plunge action - it is purely a subjective thing with no right/wrong. But the Makita tends to be preferred because it feels more like the Festool. The FWW article was also wrong in stating DeWalt doesn't offer a track connector. They do. They also have three lengths of track (I have one of each).
I did have trouble with the blade change mechanism of my DeWalt, however, and ended up breaking a part. But it still works fine without that part - it was the button you push down at the start. It wouldn't go down and when I forced it, a small piece of the aluminum casting broke. But with no button, everything still works. I still am happy with the saw and don't wish I got a different one.
I did have trouble with the blade change mechanism of my DeWalt, however, and ended up breaking a part. But it still works fine without that part - it was the button you push down at the start. It wouldn't go down and when I forced it, a small piece of the aluminum casting broke. But with no button, everything still works. I still am happy with the saw and don't wish I got a different one.
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