ETS 150/3 vs ETS 150/5

Oh boy, here we go. 

First see the definition of "issue" below. 

By saying its an "issue" doesn't imply or state its going to result in a failure.  By saying its an issue could simply mean its just an inconvenience to the user or workflow.  Such as waiting for the motor to spool back up before proceeding with a cut.  However, every electrical motor on the planet that I know of or care to know of draws more current upon start up.  More current = more heat = possible additional wear on brushes, windings.  ***note*** I did say "possible" I'm not an electrical engineer nor do I pretend to be.  Only that what I know says starting and stopping of an electrical motor continuously isn't beneficial for it.  My dust collector specifically says NOT to start/stop repeatedly for this specific reason.  Granted, its different circumstances and the DC has bigger impeller load etc. to rotate but its also a bigger motor too.  Either way its pretty common knowledge that it isnt "good" for it either. 

If this is the first time you have seen it mentioned as a concern or issue you haven't been paying enough attention before rushing to judgement.  There was some mention/discussion of it on FOG and others noticing the cycle timing particularly when using the SCMS, just within the last couple weeks.  So, just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it didn't happen...It  only means that you didn't see it. 

I also clearly stated I was happy with the CT and would buy it again. So, not sure how you are claiming what I said as disingenuous. Frankly, I'm a little tiered of you "selectively quoting" to try and make a point.  Please if your going to quote me or someone else include the post in its entirety.  Enough of just highlighting a few key words out of a post.  This practice of "selective quoting" seems disingenuous to me.

I also know that there are lots of CT's that are decades old and still in service. That also doesn't mean that there aren't some failures as well.  Is it from starts/stops constantly? Don't know, and never said it was.  There was just a post on FOG from a very angry CT customer that let the smoke out of his CT with less than 24 hours of use.  If you take the time to search you will see I clearly, and unequivocally stuck up for the CT.  I am not here to bash Festool.  However if I see a better option, possible issue, concern or room for improvement. I will voice it, not in an effort to bash Festool but in hopes to help an individual look at his or her situation from different angles that he or she might not have even thought of so they can make the best decision that fits their needs and hopefully save them some time and money. Also so Festool can address and make things better in the future. 

I have said it before and will say it again incase anyone missed it.  Festool makes some really great tools and I own a fair share of them BUT they also make some stuff that I would never buy because it lacks the quality for what Festool charges and there is need for improvement on more than one of their offerings.  That's not to say I think Festool is a bad brand.  Im also a heavy Dewalt user and have a similar list of needed improvement's for them.  Hopefully that clears a few things up and you can look at a situation from another persons perspective.   

 

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As you know, the meaning of a word comes from context. The context you used implies the "problem/bad-characteristic" meaning.

Anyway. Lets say I know a thing or two about the physics of the bearings and the (brushed) motors work and how full-wave electronics used to control such devices in the CTs work.

In order.
The mechanical challenge is for bearings from -sudden- jolt/hit they get when motors do not have soft-start. Not applicable for the current CT series.
The electrical challenge is for the motor commucator and brushes from the high in-rush current going through during a hard start. Again, not applicable for current CTs.
The last aspect is about the electronics. There, just from external observations, we do not have a way to know. At same, it is easy to build it up in a way it could handle cyclings even every 5 seconds for years. Decades, to be precise. It is just a question of properly sizing the components and not overloading them. Given these are not the first tool-powered vacs for Festool - or for the industry in Europe - I would presume they know their stuff.

In short, there is no indication the today CTs are negatively affected by usage in the intended way - aka with a tool attached. Certainly not in a statistically significant way.
Was that the case, it would literally mean bad design by Festool. And I really do not like insinuating such against anyone, be it a company or an individial. Not without some proof of that. To me that borders on FUD. Intentional or not.

But you are right, if a device is NOT DESIGNED for frequent start/stop cycles, doing so can appreciably, sometimes drastically, reduce its life. But there are no such tools made by Festool these days, and the CTs not for decades.

The point about a shop turbine limitations being real and this being applicable to CT26 is like judging a 2020 Honda direct injection engine based on the experience from a 60's Ford one. Just different worlds.
 
Wrong again, but refuse to keep [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] [dead horse] have a nice day
 
Well, thanks to this thread, I am now the proud owner of an ETS EC 150/5 EQ Plus.

I had been eyeing it at my local paint store for the last few weeks, and the dealer had one left. I passed on it at the time bc I don’t really need it, I have a perfectly fine Milwaukee 5” ROS. I came in today to get some paint on clearance ($7 a gallon for good paint!) for my shop walls, and it was still there. Based on this thread, I figured I would not regret the purchase, even though it was quite a hit to the wallet.

But hey, at least I saved money on paint, right?
 
Congratulation's, I cant speak to the Milwaukee but it was a big upgrade all around comfort, dust collection, performance from the dewalt sanders I had. 
 
It you buy enough paint (for future projects) it will be like getting the sander for free.
 
The local Sherwin Williams' stores here are/were listed on Festool's website as dealers, but I've never seen a single Festool product in them, so I was surprised to read about purchasing a sander from one.

Admittedly, I never thought to look there, but I can't imagine my local SW dealer having anything more than abrasive stock, if even that.  I should check the next time I'm in that part of town.
 
squall_line said:
The local Sherwin Williams' stores here are/were listed on Festool's website as dealers, but I've never seen a single Festool product in them, so I was surprised to read about purchasing a sander from one.

Admittedly, I never thought to look there, but I can't imagine my local SW dealer having anything more than abrasive stock, if even that.  I should check the next time I'm in that part of town.

The only dealers close to me are paint shops - their selection is very limited (typically sanders and vacs) but they can order anything for you, and they sometimes DO have things in stock (albeit usually as display items in my case, but they will sell them to you sometimes if you ask). I got my MIDI from my local Benjamin Moore dealer, who had ordered it for a display. It was brand new in the box - I happened to ask if he had one in stock the day that he got a tracking number from Festool, so instead of going to the display, it went to me.

Yardbird said:
It you buy enough paint (for future projects) it will be like getting the sander for free.

Exactly! And the dealer even gave me a small discount off the sander since it was a display unit, so at this rate, this baby is going to pay for itself in no time.

afish said:
Congratulation's, I cant speak to the Milwaukee but it was a big upgrade all around comfort, dust collection, performance from the dewalt sanders I had. 

Thank you! I have the m18 ROS from Milwaukee - a neat little sander, but I'm definitely looking forward to not having my hand go tingly and numb after the first few minutes. Also the dust collection! I have never even imagined being able to sand indoors before.

To the OP's original question though, I would have been happy with the 150/3 or the 150/5, with a slight preference for the 150/5. But I think you made the right choice hanging on to it. There seem to be some stock issues with the 150 ETS EC sanders, so if you need it now or soonish, then I would have kept it as well! I also think the difference between 3 and 5mm stroke is less important than the difference btw 125 and 150 pad diameter. If you had a 125/3 then I might encourage you to swap it. But the 150/3 looks to be a great sander that you will not regret buying!
 
Agree.  I got the 125/3 but then added the 150 pad.  I doubt I will ever put the 125 pad back on, love the 150 size. 
 
afish said:
I have a love hate relationship with the auto tool function of the CT.  I seem to short cycle the CT a lot for what I do.  So, just about the the time the CT is winding down or stopped it needs to fire right back up again so its constantly turning on/off.

My biggest/only real problem with the festool extractors. Other high end units - Starmix, Nilfisk etc - have about 10 seconds of 'run on', after the tool turns off, which is usually enough to avoid the stop/start problem. Don't know about any wear on the extractor, but it means you can't start sanding straight away, you need to pause while it fires up. A real pain when you have a stack of parts to sand and want to get stuck into it. Otherwise you start to create dust.
 
Be careful using those trigger words like problem or issue.  [wink] It would be real handy to have a variable timer for the shut off like the AC models have for the filter cleaner.  That would be  8) 
 
squall_line said:
The local Sherwin Williams' stores here are/were listed on Festool's website as dealers, but I've never seen a single Festool product in them, so I was surprised to read about purchasing a sander from one.

Admittedly, I never thought to look there, but I can't imagine my local SW dealer having anything more than abrasive stock, if even that.

That's also the issue with my local SW stores, I frequent about 5 of them and only 2 carry sandpaper, the other 3 stores are special order only.

Benjamin Moore however is the exact opposite, both of those stores carry a complete line of Festool equipment used for finishing.  [cool]
 
afish said:
... It would be real handy to have a variable timer for the shut off like the AC models have for the filter cleaner.  That would be  8)
This would be great indeed.

Possibly an auto-learned so that the firmware will prolong the time when frequent on/off are seen over a period of time.

The CTM AC models already have all-too-many dials as it is. When I lend mine to friends, they need an education on how to turn it on. And still tend to get it wrong ...
 
Yea, I have a strict rule of never loaning out tools to anyone... If your a close friend I would rather just do it for you but I have found the quickest way to loose a friend is to loan him/her a tool or money. For me a simple dial would be preferred. 
 
afish said:
Yea, I have a strict rule of never loaning out tools to anyone... If your a close friend I would rather just do it for you but I have found the quickest way to loose a friend is to loan him/her a tool or money. For me a simple dial would be preferred.
Same here. But a vac like the CTM 36 AC is pretty idiot-proof. Same like with a hammer. Though I had a friend break my "10-pounder" once ..  [big grin]

I actually bought it with the vision of using in our local hackerspace when I do not need it elsewhere.

Point being, it is pretty complex as it is on the exposed controls.
Thinking about it more, this would be a prime candidate for configurability via the BT interface.

[member=101]Festool USA[/member]
Can you possibly pass along that the ability to set the vac time-out in auto mode will be very useful (and unique)?
Being able to configure this using the Bluetooh App would be pretty cool! Just a couple presets like 5/10/20 seconds would do here.
 
I literally just ran across THIS during my Amazon shopping spree.  Instantly bought it. this is almost exactly what I was thinking.  I would prefer a simple dial without the extra electronics but ill take it eitherway. Im redoing my sander station so I will put this through its paces and see if its as problem free as my HD remote control outlet. Crossing fingers it works as well as I hope. I never timed my CT but looks like 30s is max which should be fine to reduce needless cycling on/off
 
afish said:
I literally just ran across THIS d uring my Amazon shopping spree.  Instantly bought it. this is almost exactly what I was thinking.  I would prefer a simple dial without the extra electronics but ill take it eitherway. Im redoing my sander station so I will put this through its paces and see if its as problem free as my HD remote control outlet. Crossing fingers it works as well as I hope. I never timed my CT but looks like 30s is max which should be fine to reduce needless cycling on/off
thanks.
 
No problem and just a quick update it works great and I have had zero issues out of it. 
 
If you ever plan on owning additional Festool sanders, the RO 150 also has a 5mm stroke.  I have the RO 150 which is fairly large and heavy.  I plan on getting the ETS 150/3 for fine finish sanding.
 
for 15 years i worked with a ETS150/3. recently i bought, well, i went astray with a Mirka 150/5 sander. it's almost the same price bracket as Festool, but it is one of those tools where you think you should have gotten it years ago.
regarding swirl marks, i don't see any difference between the Festool ETS 150/3 and the Mirka 150/5. working the last 2 years mainly with red oak and plenty of douglas fir and using solely Rubio Monocoat, i'd say the Mirka is the bomb!
so much smaller and lighter! and i love the paddle switch!
 
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