ETS EC 150 vs Mirka DEROS which way would you go?

[junk731]

Dovetail, I tried the EC125 at the AWFS and found out Festool has finally come to the party with a powerful 5" sander. I was talking to Steve Bace at the booth and he had an 8/4 piece of maple with a very rough edge, was pleasantly surprised at how the sander knocked the edge down smooth in no time with 100P Granat. I also tried to stall it but it just kept going. IMHO a very nice sander. Couldn't find anyone selling/demoing the Deros at the show. Also heard some disturbing things regarding service of the Mirka Ceros and how often they breakdown. This was from someone that sells both Festool and Mirka whose opinion I trust.

John

 

[Holmz]

[member=3373]Dovetail65[/member]
I have a UVA 115e, I do prefer it to the Bosch in very way. But say that it leaves swirls or do not sand is a misnomer. Yes It is slow and yes it vibrates, but it sands the wood just fine.
That was the context of the question which I was answering.

Much like saws working well when the blade is good. The Bosch with a good pad is mechanically more similar to other sanders in terms of what happens between the pad and wood than dissimilar.

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Dovetail:

I would say that they are fairly close and I would not think of them as "aggressive" sanders. They are not digging down like a Rotex but with a coarse grit they can remove / strip down a surface quickly.

I have not done any side to side comparisons sanding the same surface size and material at the same time. I feel a little less fatigued with the Mirka if I have done lots of sanding and I still prefer the Deros for sanding between coats. I do some HVLP spraying and I was introduced to the Deros by a colleague (who is very very good finish spray painter). When I do finishing touches on delicate surfaces I feel more in control with the Deros. I also had to strip down a surface (table, two layers of spray paint) very quickly and the Deros made swift work of it and left a spray paint ready surface immediately.

As for build quality I have not heard much about problems with Deros machines and our machines are used daily. The previous Ceros I know very little about so I can't speak for the build quality of those. I judge machines based on model performance and not brand history. 

Still like - but don't love - the ETS EC 150 and still prefer the Deros. We have quite a range of sanders in the shop and I would say that the two stand out machines are Rotex 150 and the Deros. My Bosch GEX Turbo was stolen on a job site and the person who borrowed it from me bought me a new Rotex 150 as a replacement.  [big grin] I think the Bosch is a very good machine and has lasted me very well with rough sanding but the Rotex is a bit better.

 

[nickao]

Thanks, I too find my Rotex 150 still my favorite sander.

I cant believe I still use my original Rotex 150 from when I first joined the forum and have used it 2 hours plus 5 days a week since. That's over 7 years! Can it really be that long? I need to pull out the receipt, that's hard to believe.

Ill go with the Mirka. I can't wait to get it.

 

[junk731]

Henrik I might have missed it but what voltage do yours tools/sanders run on.

John

 

[sae]

All of Europe is 220v. Only the UK nannystate makes everyone use 110v on jobsites. Workshops are still 220v.

 

[Steve-Rice]

Does anyone know if you can switch between the 5" and 6" base pads on the U.S. Versions of the Deros?

 

[nickao]

No for some reason in the US we can't.

Mirka offers  the DEROS in a 5" and 6" with 5mm stroke and a 6" with 2.5mm stroke and none look to be able to use both sizes. I have searched their US website and there is zero about using 5" and 6".

It appears the CEROS version uses a 5/16" threaded attachment so other pads should be able to be used. I am still reading up on the DEROS and how that works.

 

[Holmz]

...
Mirka offers  the DEROS in a 5" and 6" with 5mm stroke and a 6" with 2.5mm stroke and none look to be able to use both sizes. I have searched their US website and there is zero about using 5" and 6".
...

There at least 3 models or Deros, 5", 6", and the one that is both 5/6" in 220v only".
There is also 2.5, 5-mm and maybe a 7 or 8-mm strokes.

And i think that the Ceros is still largely available in 220v.

There are even models in the 32-mm and 75-mm sizes.???
They only have Sandra and vacs, no Kapex, nor Domino.

 

[Steve-Rice]

Like many others, I have scoured the Mirka website, and the internet in general, in an attempt to find additional information on switching the base pads on the Deros between the 5" and 6" pads on the U.S. version.  Today, I called the "contact us" number on Mirka's North American website and finally got some definitive answers...

I was told that the current U.S. versions of the Deros cannot change the base pads because of balancing issues related to the weight of the pads.  The good news, however, is that Mirka is currently working on a dual pad version of the Deros for the U.S. market.  It will be a 6" Deros that will also accept a heavier 5" base pad.  The bad news is that they could not provide me with any time frame as to when this new product will be released.

I am very eager to get a 6" sander for larger furniture projects, but I am currently heavily invested in 5" Abranet, so a dual pad sander would be the perfect solution for me. Looks like my old DeWalt ROS with the Mirka base pad will have to last me a while longer...

Thanks again to all of you who have responded to my questions regarding this.

 

[Holmz]

Or just buy it out of Finland now, and get a 110 -> 220v transformer.

 

[Benjamin]

I bought the 6" Mirka sander and a additional 5" pad and switched it no prob

Didn't notice a big deference in vibration or balancing ( there's a way of switching the
Weight in the sander as they supply the additional weights )

Amazing sander, super quite vs the rotex

It's like a ETS on steroids

I have a ETS and it's a totally different sander

WAY more powerfull

 

[Steve-Rice]

I currently have several 220 volt outlets in my shop, both 30 amps and 15 amps. I realize this may sound like a stupid question, but (aside from the plug) is 220 in the U.S. the same as 220 in Europe? Would the European Deros actually work on a 220 line in the U.S.?

 

[Steve-Rice]

I believe I just found an answer to my own question: it appears U.S. Electricity is 60 Hz whereas European electricity is 50 Hz, so Euro tools will not run here without some kind of transformer specifically designed for that purpose.

 

[Holmz]

Most of the Eu tools are "Universal" so they operate both 50H and 60Hz.
It is usually worse to fee 50Hz to a 60Hz motor than the other way around.
So it says "Universal" anywhere, then it handles both.

US 220v versus Eu 230v.
Technically the US 220 has the "A" and "B" both sourcing current. When A is high then B is low, so measureing voltage between them you get 220v. If you measured the Voltage at A or B referenced to ground each side would only be 120v.

Eu 230 is sourcing at one of the pins and the other is neutral. Remember the US both are live at 1/2 the voltage.
If you measure between pins A & B they measure 220v/230v (or 240v in Australia).

From the perspective of the tool it doesn't know and it doesn't care. It just works.
All the Eu tools I have do not have a ground running to them. They are insulated or (double insulated), and they are all "Universal".

The most straight forward would be to contact Mirka USA and see if they can bring in an Eu model and whether Mirka confirms the "Universal" 60-Hz.

They are not any general cheap transformers that change the frequency, mostly old school where they change the voltage.

 

[Steve-Rice]

Just received an email from the Tool Nut.  They are taking pre-orders for the ETS EC sander priced at $385.00 for the 5" and $485 for the 6" version.  Both sanders will be available October 1st.

 

[weekendwarrior]

Like many others, I have scoured the Mirka website, and the internet in general, in an attempt to find additional information on switching the base pads on the Deros between the 5" and 6" pads on the U.S. version.  Today, I called the "contact us" number on Mirka's North American website and finally got some definitive answers...

I was told that the current U.S. versions of the Deros cannot change the base pads because of balancing issues related to the weight of the pads.  The good news, however, is that Mirka is currently working on a dual pad version of the Deros for the U.S. market.  It will be a 6" Deros that will also accept a heavier 5" base pad.  The bad news is that they could not provide me with any time frame as to when this new product will be released.

Hmm... I think that 5"/6" dual pad compatible Mirka would be worth the wait.  I would have replaced/upgraded my ETS 150/3 with an EC model if it supported multiple sized pads.

Do the EC 150 and EC 125 have the same 400W motor in them now?  If so, wouldn't that make the pads theoretically compatible with either sander?

 

[Steve-Rice]

I agree that the Deros 5"/6" dual base pad combination is preferable, but who knows when we'll see it in North America. The Mirka rep had no information on any ETA.

I believe the ETS EC 5" and 6" models do have the same 400W brushless motor, but I have no idea if the base pads are interchangeable. I guess there might be a balance issue, but that's just a guess on my part.

I definitely prefer Mirka Abranet sanding discs over conventional sandpaper, so I'm wondering if the Mirka Abranet pad protector will line up with the dust collection holes in the ETS EC 6" so I could use Abranet discs with the ETS EC.  Anyone know about that? 

Thanks

 

[jcpsmallwoodworkershop]

i have purchased 5 seperate mirka deros 6" 650 sanders, each one had a problem,
they all stopped working after moderate use, or if it stopped working at 10000rpm.
luckily i bought them from amazon, so kept swapping them. the 6" pad mirka provides
is not well balanced and each pad is a different weight and spinning at 10000rpm, they
would get wobbly and stop itself. there is also the stop if too hot problem, i had two
do that for about 2-5 days of purchase and then never turn on again.
i have called mirka in ohio and they swear up and down there is no problem, never heard of
such issue. well i said i bought from amazon, so within 30 days, each bad unit goes back
and funny thing, none of them ever showed on amazon warehouse, which means all
went back to mirka to get repaired.

mirka deros has one advantage, sander is light, so if doing above the head work, work at odd angles,
this is the go to unit, but cant work at 10000rpm, 9000 rpm, 8000 rpm for long, not a selling point.

mirka deros with the festool sandpaper leaves alot of dust as the festool sandpaper does not
have all the suction openings that the pad provides.

i am ordering the ets ec 150 because after 5 mirka deros, and none function, its done.
the ets ec 150 has a slow down speed if wobbly or out of balance feature, the mirka is shut down
if wobbly, there is a difference, imho.

 

[Steve-Rice]

Very disappointing to hear about 5 bad units in a row.  I've read a number of stories about people having problems with Mirka sanders and their terrible customer service department. 

It appears that everyone on this forum who has used both the Deros and the ETS EC, prefers the Deros, and I'd like to get one, but stories like yours are keeping me on the fence...