Felder Combination Machine

[tomsharres]

Just finished watching this video and the Felder Combination Machine looks truly amazing! Besides thinking about how much money this machine must cost, I'm left wondering if it's actually any good and if anyone has any experience with it?

I would think that the Felder combination machines are excellent in all ways. Obviously a little more fiddling around to change configurations, but the space savings is worth it.

My ideal setup if I was in your situation would be the Hammer 16 inch jointer/planer with the Silent power spiral cutting block, and one of the KF 700 machines for for shaping and cutting. There's a mortising attachment for the Hammer that isn't too expensive. I think that there sliding table might only be surpassed by the Format machines and such.

The Hammer is pretty economical, maybe with a little less sophisticated rise mechanism the the Felder, but otherwise a fine machine with a good build for the money.

I looked at the KF 700 S and its a very good value, but I didn't know if I would need the shaper as I have two router table that I have parts for but need to be integrated with a frame and top.

I will get some pictures up this weekend for the FB 610; I have to finish installing the X-Life guides which were part of the original purchase, but were backordered for a while.

 

[avanderhoorn]

Does anyone have any thoughts on Felder vs. Hammer? How much of a difference is there between the two, does it just come down to duty cycle, etc or is it more fundamental than that?

 

[junk731]

Hammer is it's own line of entry level machines from Felder with accessories that only fit the Hammer machines. They have a sliding table on some of their saws but don't have the same rolling mechanism or slider sizing as the Felders. If you get a chance to try them side by side you will be able to tell the difference.The J/P's can be had with the Silentpower or straight knives which are the same basic design as the Felders. Chassis's are lighter as are many of the drive components. The 500 series from Felder are still basically Hammer components with the addition, on the saws of the X-Roll sliding table. With the 500 series you can now use Felder accessories. With every series above the 500 you start to get a more robust build with stronger trunnions, larger blade capacity and more electronics available. My first slider was a K500S and my first J/P was an A3-31.

John

 

[avanderhoorn]

Great info and exactly what I was after knowing.

 

[g1_lo]

Does anyone have any thoughts on Felder vs. Hammer? How much of a difference is there between the two, does it just come down to duty cycle, etc or is it more fundamental than that?

I've just taken delivery, 6 weeks ago, of the Hammer bandsaw and J/P with spiral head.

I have to say I had a lot of deliberation about spec price quality. In the end I looked at what I needed to achieve in 12 months. Which was to buy all new stationary machinery.

The quality of the machines is very high and the finish it produces is amazing. Quilted maple on the J/P comes out like a baby's bottom.

Sure I'd of probably liked a felder. But unless your running all your machines every day for 8 hours you've got to think about the price point.

My next conundrum is K3 Winner comfort or K4 Perform because of the slightly longer slider. Which is causing me to travel to the new showroom which opens at the end of the month here in the UK. Which is undoubtedly going to cause serious conflicts with the wallet.

This probably hasn't helped you much sorry.

 

[avanderhoorn]

[member=24867]g1_lo[/member] huge thanks for the info. Which exact bandsaw and j/p did you end up getting? Also did you get any options/accessories? Have you done much resawing with bandsaw yet (I'm wondering how much difference the makes vs the standard guides and if its just splitting hairs)? Lastly, do you know how the Hammer compares to the Laguna?

 

[tomsharres]

[member=24867]g1_lo[/member] huge thanks for the info. Which exact bandsaw and j/p did you end up getting? Also did you get any options/accessories? Have you done much resawing with bandsaw yet (I'm wondering how much difference the makes vs the standard guides and if its just splitting hairs)? Lastly, do you know how the Hammer compares to the Laguna?

I had the conversation with Fergus in sales (Sacramento) about the X-life and he said that he often demo's the Felder bandsaw without guides at all, but he felt that the X-life vs European guides was personal preference. I think that they are less fussy than the European guides. He highly recommended the Lennox trimaster; I'm running a 2-3 vari-pitch 1 inch blade, it's carbide tipped and you can find it online for under $300. It cuts very well, but I have to see if I can tweak the X-life guides to take out the very small amount of drift.

All in all, I thought that the FB-610 was a better value than the comparable Laguna model. If you are thinking of resawing, this could be a very good saw for you. Note that it will cut 400 mm (15 3/4 inch) thick material, so plan on at least a 16 inch jointer/planer model as a complement to the resawing capability.

I'm still squaring up aluminum this morning, but I will at least get you a few photos later today. I'm also happy with some magnetically attached fingers for the saw, so I'll show those as well.

 

[SittingElf]

If you end up with a Hammer or Felder Bandsaw, consider adding the Laguna Driftmaster Fence system as an addition to it. It is unparalleled for resawing!  [tongue] (Their ceramic guides are also awesome, and can be retrofit to most machines).

Cheers,

Frank

 

[g1_lo]

[member=24867]g1_lo[/member] huge thanks for the info. Which exact bandsaw and j/p did you end up getting? Also did you get any options/accessories? Have you done much resawing with bandsaw yet (I'm wondering how much difference the makes vs the standard guides and if its just splitting hairs)? Lastly, do you know how the Hammer compares to the Laguna?

I can't comment on the x life guides as I didn't spec them. I think again if your running the bandsaw a lot, 4+ hours a day. Maybe think about this as an upgrade.

I went for the N4400 bandsaw and the baby P/T. In hind sight I should of gone for the 31 but it's a minor grievance seeing as it's only the odd occasion I need the extra capacity.

I have no experience of the Laguna B/S. As I am from the UK. But from other threads previously discussing these very topics of bandsaw choices etc, they seem to be highly recommended from your fellow compatriots.

Options wise. Nothing other than the 800 out feed extension table on the bandsaw.
P/T spiral cutter head. Makes such a difference to the cut and the noise in the shop. You hardly know it's on once the dust extraction is sucking through it.
I also opted for the 400 exstension for the out feed of the thicknesser table on this.

I am going to try and do a video review at some point. As there is limited resources on these matters and I think a lot of people find themselves in a similar situation in thought processes and choosing/justifying each purchase.

The only one note on the bandsaw is that the t slot isn't standard so you can't use other mitre fences and the hammer one, supposedly is shocking.

But I felt, I didn't need one and would be able to adapt the incra v120 and make my own when the time arises. If you watch some of the hammer videos, the demonstrator makes some pretty cool jigs to run in the slot. 

[eek]

 

[junk731]

If you end up with a Hammer or Felder Bandsaw, consider adding the Laguna Driftmaster Fence system as an addition to it. It is unparalleled for resawing!  [tongue] (Their ceramic guides are also awesome, and can be retrofit to most machines).

Cheers,

Frank

You would have to bastardize a Hammer or Felder Bandsaw to use the Laguna  Driftmaster. Set the saw up properly and you won't have any problem drift. I routinely resaw hundreds of feet of material with no drift. Felder makes ceramic guides for the bandsaws now at an extremely reasonable price so again no need for Laguna products.

John

 

[avanderhoorn]

[member=4907]kcufstoidi[/member] The one downside of these machines seems to be knowing whether you have them setup correctly. Are the resources provided pretty good or are there any good videos or is it fairly simple?

[member=37748]tomsharres[/member] some photos when you get the chance would be great!

[member=24867]g1_lo[/member] video would be amazing, as you said there seems to be a lack of them out there. Also do you have a link for the t-slot jigs handy?

For the Hammer, how do you find the out of the box guide? 

 

[junk731]

The 6 machines I have received since 2008 for the most part were good. My K500S and K700S Pro were commissioned so they came setup very close to exact. I got my FB600 for a very good price uncommissioned and it came needing adjustment which I was aware of, so no problem. It took a little tweaking to get it setup the way I wanted but it cuts true and within a couple thousands on large resaws. What few seem to realize is these machines are shipped from Austria in a container by sea. Then loaded on a truck and shipped to the Felder branch then from there shipped where ever. If you don't pay for commissioning you get the machine untouched from Austria until it arrives at your door. I'm lucky enough to live about a 1/2 hour from my dealer and the head technician is a friend, if you wonder where I get my info. As with a lot of things if your mechanically inclined the adjustments are easy and the info is there for the asking. One of the best resources for information on Felder/Hammer equipment is the first FOG, Felders Owners Group. Some don't like the messaging system but the information is second to none.

John

 

[avanderhoorn]

Thanks for all the info!

 

[tomsharres]

Sorry for the delay.

I have attached images of the X-life guides and the FB-610 with extension tables.

It took me a bit of fussing to get the X-life adjusted, and one of the jaws isn't yet parallel with the blade. Shimming is possible, but I will probably remove the mounting blocks and face them flat to see if that will fix it in a more consistent way.

You might be able to discern the carbide teeth on the Lennox Trimaster in the photos.

I need a larger fence, and I'll probably just make one, though there are some sources of extrusion that would be workable;

http://www.techno-isel.com/LMC/Products/Aluminum.htm#TABLES