Festool Newbie - DF700 XL Good For What?

J

Jeanluc

Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2014
Messages
8
Well, let's see.  I am a hobbyist, have Powermatic 2000, 6" joiner, 14" drill press, General Int'l 9" mortise, 13" planer, full shop dust system spiral pipe connected with actuated gates, 10" miter saw, 10" band saw and then the assorted hand tools.  Been replacing all my old hand power tools with Festool: T18+3 drill, Festool Carvex 420 EBQ jig saw, Festool Domino DF700 XL and a Lamello biscuit joiner.  So far the build quality of all the Festool products is outstanding.  However, the DF 700 is heavy, cumbersome to use, and frankly, I can't figure out what to use it for.  Purchased it on the advice of a friend.  Basically a $1200 boat anchor right now.  The tenons are expensive and so far impossible to find, and I am still trying to figure out how to buy a tenon that fits the DF700 - everything seems to be made for the DF500.  Also, no drill bores smaller than 8mm (3/8") so of limited use to me.

Guess I am looking at dumping the Domino.  My Lamello is a better choice for joinery work - easy to use, dead on slot accuracy, can buy biscuits by the gross, etc.  I have bored 1 hole with the DF 700 to practice and that was a chore to handle (I'm 6'-4" and 220lbs so not a lightweight).  My Lamello on the other hand runs smooth, easy to set up, can use 1 hand on the tool - sweet and simple.  The DF 700 just isn't blowing my skirt up.  What is everyone else's experience with the tool?

Any suggestions?
 
I am curious why tenons are 'impossible to find'.

There are two assortments that come in SYS2s
498204 and 498205

As well as 22 different part numbers in the catalog for XL tenons

Check any of the online retailers or Amazon and you should easily be able to find tenons. They might not be at your local store, but most dealers offer free shiping so you would not be out any additional funds.
 
I would suggest watching some YouTube videos on it, Half-Inch Shy has a good one. Maybe the Domino 500 would have been a better choice for you. I have the Domino 500, but everything I have seen and read have been very positive about the 700.

There is an aftermarket attachment that allows you to use cutters smaller than 8mm. I believe it is from Seneca Woodworking. You can also make your own domino tenons, there are topics about this here on the FOG.

Good luck,

Daniel
 
Sounds like you need to find a friend who knows more about Dominos. Just sayin.  ::) If you had bought the 500 instead you would stop using your biscuit joiner.

The 700 XL is for very large work pieces such as heavy doors and garden gates. Go to YouTube and watch Greg Paolini, Peter Parfitt, and Halfinchshy's videos on that beast.

If you haven't had it long I'd use Festool's money back program and buy the 500 with the Domino assortment kit.

I will eventually build something that needs Domizilla but till then I'll keep my $1200 in the bank.
 
I bet you aren't the only one with a Domino XL sitting idle on the shelf.  Sure its a super cool concept and superbly engineered tool but the realty is it is a specialized tool beyond the needs of the average hobbyist woodworker.  For the right applications I imagine there isn't a better tool for production work, then the price tag can be justified.  I'd say this tool is a stretch for the serious hobbyist woodworker unless you regularly produce projects needing large tenons.  So you're making dozens of chairs, doors or dining tables every year then maybe the XL is right up you alley.          

Remember if you're inside the 30 day window you can return it or sell it with a fairly small loss if you are beyond the 30 return period.  
 
[welcome]

Set up and used correctly, my wife could easily handle the DF700, so there's certainly a technique issue ... the advice to watch some youtube usage examples would seem very good advice.

Now tenons ... don't look at the cost of a piece of wood, look at the time and effort involved in making a tenon joint. Festool Domino tenons and tenon and cutter sets are easy to obtain - I'm sure some people local to you will respond.

If you don't recognise the significant difference between an accurate tenon joint and a biscuit joint it's probably advisable to take on a little study in to various jointing techniques and their uses.

Now back to the DF700 ... doors, gates, tables, beds, heavy furniture, generally large joints, that's where it shines. The 500 is suitable for cabinetry, chairs ... generally finer furniture and box work.

You will find that Festool products are design with specific steps/processes/worflows in mind ... this is a very German approach, they solve a problem rather than just make a tool. A little shift in thinking is required.

You seem to have possibly been given some bad advice, but calling an extremely good tool a boat anchor really won't make many friends on this forum [wink]

cheers,

Kev.
 
Its amazing how much information we have access to here on the internet and from other sources too. Saying that its of limited use to you because it only cuts 3/8 holes baffles me because you knew or should have known that before you bought the thing.

Why don't you check out the seneca woodworking adapter for df500 bits and see if thats an option for you.
 
I'm wondering what your friend said to make you think it's what you should have bought.  It sounds kinda like buying a sledge hammer for pounding finish nails, you need the right tool for the job. I'd take the boat anchor thing up with him.  The 500 is what you should have bought. You can still do doors and large projects with multiple 500 dominos for the occasional large project.  Like Brice says, you better have a lot of big projects to consider buying the 700, unless you got loads of cash to burn.
 
I think that, as usual on this thread, you are getting some good sound advice from members. (You can buy tenons from Bob Marino, Tom Bellemare, Toolnuts, Hartville, Woodcraft, and a slew of others.). The first time that I used the 700, I thought that it was such a beast that I was hardly ever going to use it, after the table build that I bought it for. (Wow, it made that table quick work!) Well, I just got used to it after that...found the balance to it and it didn't seem heavy any more.  Since that table, I have made five more builds with 8/4 red oak for customers.  Right now, I'm making a very cool 8/4 red oak love seat.
The 700 has paid for itself a few times over.  For me, it's one of my favorite Festools. The weight adds to the security I feel using the tool and now prefer it to the 500. So much so, that I even thought of buying the adapter for the smaller bits, eventhough I also own the 500.  I recommend trying some builds with 8/4. The furniture is very satisfying. Very comfortable...like the first time I drove my new Volvo after having had a small Toyota.
 
I purchased a 700XL this week and have only cut a few test mortises so my experience with this tool is quite limited.  I purchased it for an upcoming project that requires large and deep mortises.  I have had the Domino 500 since it was introduced in the US.  Even though the 700 is bulkier and heavier, I found it very easy to control, stable, and bores accurate and very smooth mortises in ash.  I experienced some sticking in the plunge action initially and discovered that whatever lubricant was on the guide bars was tacky.  I wiped this off with a paper towel and then used the towel to apply Tri-flow.  This made the plunge action much smoother.  My experience with the 500 helped achieve the perfect results with the 700XL.  The ability to control and get a quality mortise is sensitive to the plunge rate.  If you jam it in as fast as you can such as many do with a plate joiner, you will experience control problems and poor results in your mortises.  Practice by boring more than one mortise and try different plunge rates to get a feel for the tool as there is a learning curve but, it is short.

Domino tenons are not made of unobtainium and are available from a number of dealers as I received a package with my order in addition to what was in the 700 box.

With respect to the size issue, it sounds as if you purchased the wrong Domino.  Given what you describe as your needs, you may want to return the 700 and get the 500. 

 
Appreciate the input from everyone.  The cost of the tool is no biggie - I just purchased all the Festool and Lamello tools at 1 stop since I wanted to move beyond the B&D and Sears stuff I had collected over the years and get really solid tools to work with since I am now trying to push my hobby quality to something worth showing off.

I have an outdoor gate to build and the DF700 was recommended as being better than my 9" mortise plus I was told at the time that it would be perfect for my garage cabinets project I had in mind.  After cutting / drilling 1 tenon mortise I just can't see using that heavy beast on 3/4" stock for cabinets.  My reference to "boat anchor" is not meant to be derogatory but means "of little use" to me in current setup - my slang.

I've dropped about $30k on the shop tools in the last 3 weeks which is fine and met my budget.  What I want is to end up with tools I actually use for a change instead of a dozen tools sitting in a plastic storage bin, if you get my drift.  I have the 9" General Int'l mortise for the gate so don't see using the DF700 for that on a 1-time / 1- off use and then the DF700 sits in the Festool case for the next Xx years; not what I had in mind when I bought it.  Of course looking back now, not sure what I had in mind at the time I bought the thing.

If the DF700 is for large jobs then I'll just chunk it (its always such a big PITA to hassle through exchanges and refunds) and look hard at the DF500.  All the tenons and cutters I have looked at on Amazon and at Woodcraft (where I purchased 90% of the shop stuff) appear to only be for the DF500 so that was why my comment - trying to find tenons and having some difficulty locating any for this tool.  Appears to be my personal problem and confusion since I am not all that familiar with the tool and accessories.

Anyway, much appreciated comments and I'll do some deeper reviews on the DF500 to see if that will fit my needs.

Thanks to everyone.

 
You say you are going to just chunk it...  It is not hard to exchange if you are in the 30 day window. If not, you can still fetch a pretty penny for it on eBay or the classifieds here.
 
A member here "deepcreek" is looking to buy a DF700.  For me I have both the 500 and 700 and find them both very useful and I'm almost 70 years old and i find that the DF700 is a better balanced machine than the 500.

If your fine with your General Mortiser and don't have issues keeping your mortise chisels sharp then you might want to sell the 700.

I use mine for things like the gate where holding large gate timber on the mortiser a bit of a pain and find that bringing the tool to the work precisely helps with accuracy.

Jack
 
The DF700 is 2 weeks old.  Came in one of the usual Festool cases but about 3 times the height.  I dislike dealing with selling stuff and its too cold outside to bother driving 30 miles back to Woodcraft.  If the weather breaks enough to bother taking it back within the 30 days then fine.  If not, into the garage attic storage bin or dumpster it goes.  Either way works for me.  My time is worth more than the tool.

Starting to research the DF500 and see if it has drill cores and tenons down to 4mm.  That would be the right size.
 
Let me know your address and when you plan to throw it in the trash, it is dumpster diving time?  Must be nice just to throw $1300 in the trash.
 
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