Festool TSV 60 plunge saw with scoring blade

[Cheese]

It's interesting but it certainly isn't the best of all worlds.  [smile]

Like Peter mentioned, this TSV 60 is 381 euros more expensive than the TS 60.
It's 2.2# heavier.
It needs to reside in a 437 Systainer rather than a 337.
It needs the 1900 rail rather than the 1400.
It bevels 0º to 45º rather than the -1º to 47º.
The scoring blade is diamond.

I give Festool kudos for thinking out of the box, but it certainly is a niche product. That's OK...bring those niche products on. [smile]

 

[six-point socket II]

Well, it's certainly not a replacement/upgrade to the regular plunge saws. It's an option if you want the scoring blade in a portable/ hand held saw. It will make some peoples lives a lot easier, it will frustrate some people, some people won't care.

Personally, I just love the fact that it is truly innovative.

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[mrboult]

So my new £600 TS60 is less than 3 months old and is already superceded and obsolete. This one incident is enough to make me ditch Festool on a permanent basis. The perfect demonstration of 'how to immediately lose a long-standing and loyal professional user'.

It's been fun - but I'm done. Bye.

lol

 

[Frank-Jan]

I almost got a ts60 when one of the toolstores I frequent had a special deal on it, but decided against it when I remembered Woodbutcherbower's post about the price of the blades, I did briefly handle it in the store and I did like the saw. With the new batterypowered tablesaw sharing that new bladesize, maybe the price of the blades will come down soon.

As for the saw with the scoring blade, I'm a bit curious, is the black cable you see a flexible shaft that drives the scoring blade, or a wire to power and control a small seperate motor.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Scoring blades are indeed an issue. Some are easier than others, but it is still something to deal with at every blade change, plus another thing to sharpen. I'm sure that is the point of the diamond blade on the scorer.
I do like the innovation and will be curious to see how it goes.

 

[Fourmi]

I am genuinely curious, who is this saw for? Because it seems to me that the very few who would appreciate and want to use one, are the exact ones who would complain about the price.

People like me - high end work, all hand done for clients wanting perfect work. I have a 100% portable setup that can go anywhere.

...but in general I agree with you, most smaller setups don't have the finance for a dedicated tool like this, and bigger setups will get a proper fixed machine.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I am genuinely curious, who is this saw for? Because it seems to me that the very few who would appreciate and want to use one, are the exact ones who would complain about the price.

People like me - high end work, all hand done for clients wanting perfect work. I have a 100% portable setup that can go anywhere.

...but in general I agree with you, most smaller setups don't have the finance for a dedicated tool like this, and bigger setups will get a proper fixed machine.

[member=79486]Fourmi[/member] that's my point exactly. There are guys who will absolutely love this....and be first in line to get one. Then there will be the ones who could definitely use one, but can't/won't pay the price that it will have to command, because the sales volume has to be low.
Then there's the guys like me, who think it's really cool, love the idea, but have no need for it.
Of those three groups, only one is buying. That doesn't seem healthy for longevity.

 

[Fourmi]

I agree with you, a very niche market tool, usually economics dictates that a tool like this won't see the light of day.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

People like me - high end work, all hand done for clients wanting perfect work. I have a 100% portable setup that can go anywhere.

And me. Hence me being so hacked off after just spending £600 on a TS60 without knowing that the perfect laminate cutting saw was only 12 weeks away.

I'm just glad that [member=22067]mrB[/member] found it so amusing.

LOL.

 

[Fourmi]

People like me - high end work, all hand done for clients wanting perfect work. I have a 100% portable setup that can go anywhere.

And me. Hence me being so hacked off after just spending £600 on a TS60 without knowing that the perfect laminate cutting saw was only 12 weeks away.

You've written some great posts and I personally appreciate your input - just a little point, if I remember correctly, you purchased the TS60 in a rush to do a waterfall edge for a customer. These are 2 very different saws, the TS60 if I understand correctly also runs on the FSK rails. The new TSV60 looks to be a pretty bulky saw.

If I wasn't so invested in Mafell saws, I would definitely want a TS60 and a TSV60. If the work's coming in and paying for it, lap it up, get the TSV60 when it comes out and have the best of both worlds.

 

[bobtskutter]

Surely for this type of saw to work you would have to start the cut with the entire machine out off the workpiece, so the scoring blade makes the first cut.  That's a lot of saw to be "hanging" on the guide rail.

I thought the green splinter guards that clip on the saw were suppose to prevent chip out on the top surface?

Bob

 

[woodbutcherbower]

[member=79486]Fourmi[/member] Thankyou. The TS60 came in a few weeks after I’d done that waterfall - my TS55 was 8 years old and really needed replacing, so the TS55’s slight lack of mitre cutting depth on that job was the catalyst - with the extra depth of cut being the no-brainer aspect of it. But now that I’ve calmed down a little - you’re probably quite right. Maybe that’s exactly the way to go, using the TS60 as a daily workhorse and just pulling out the TSV for laminate work. I just saw the picture and instantly perceived it as a 2-in-1 catch-all for every conceivable application I could throw at it. I’ll wait until the machine’s available and try one out at my nearest dealer (ProTrade, 15 miles away).

 

[woodbutcherbower]

Surely for this type of saw to work you would have to start the cut with the entire machine out off the workpiece, so the scoring blade makes the first cut.  That's a lot of saw to be "hanging" on the guide rail.

I thought the green splinter guards that clip on the saw were suppose to prevent chip out on the top surface?

Bob

You’re right, Bob. More care will have to be taken, and maybe the far end of the rail will always have to be clamped to avoid any potential see-sawing of the rail when the saw’s put down on the cut entry end.

And in principle - the combination of the rail splinterguard and the saw splinter shoe should produce very clean cuts on laminate. But in reality - it sometimes doesn’t, especially on the cheaper materials which are virtually impossible to cut cleanly with anything other than a router. What I’ve sometimes had to do on troublesome material like this is to set the cutting depth at 2mm, put the saw on the far end of the rail, and make a scoring cut by pulling the saw backwards down the rail towards me, so the blade teeth are cutting downwards into the laminate, rather than bursting up through it. It doesn’t happen often - but it’s a PITA when it does.

 

[bobtskutter]

Thank you for sharing that, I'm very much at the learning stage with my wood work journey.  I've been getting (very minor) chip out on plywood edges which I think is due to the splinter guard being trimmed too much by the panther blade.  I'd not thought about doing a scoring cut by dragging the saw backwards.  Much appreciated.

Regards
Bob

 

[afish]

I think its important to realize that the splinter guard will help "reduce" tear out and chipping but will NOT "eliminate" it.  There are many factors that come into play including saw tuning, blade sharpness, blade selection, travel speed, sawing technique etc. You would be hard pressed to get perfect chip free cuts without pre scoring.  We are working in an age where materials are uber expensive and sheet goods can easily reach $400 or more.  It doesnt take many mistakes or bad cuts to pay for a saw at that rate. Not to mention the time to rebuild a piece if you damage it making a trim cut.  As woodbutcherbower said making a shallow pass in reverse will typically make a huge improvement but is not a replacement the factors listed above.   

 

[woodbutcherbower]

"saw tuning"

Especially important when using corded tools, with the trip hazard of cords trailing on the floor. Because if you don't C sharp - you'll B flat.

 

[bobtskutter]

[thumbs up] hardy har har!
[big grin]

Bob

 

[woodbutcherbower]

[thumbs up] hardy har har!
[big grin]

Bob

Just trying to brighten everyone's day. My work here is done .........  [smile]

 

[guybo]

Over here we call it a power trip

 

[woodbutcherbower]

Keep 'em coming fellas. Right down to the wire.