fish tails with DS400 sander & sequence of sanders

[canadamike]

This more of a question to understand the sanders, or perhaps improve my technique.

I am sanding out walnut to 240 grit using an RTS 400 sander. I am noticing a number of whirls or fish tails in the final session. So I sand these out by hand.

Will the ETS150 sanders eliminate the need to hand sand prior to applying finish? Or another sander such as RS2E? Or should final sanding be done with a Rotex? I have 2 sanders - DS400 and Rotex150.

Thanks in advance, Mike

 

[rizzoa13]

Hey Mike I use my dts400 for drywall which can be really prone to swirls and fishtails. Try turning the suction all the way down ( please don't be insulted some people don't know that). Other than that a real light touch and constant movement should give you a nice finish. I've got a rotex and find the dts is a softer sander than the rotex even on random orbital mode. Hope that helps.

 

[canadamike]

Hey Mike I use my dts400 for drywall which can be really prone to swirls and fishtails. Try turning the suction all the way down ( please don't be insulted some people don't know that). Other than that a real light touch and constant movement should give you a nice finish. I've got a rotex and find the dts is a softer sander than the rotex even on random orbital mode. Hope that helps.

Thanks - I did have the vac at 50% so I will turn it all the way down & see how this goes!

 

[semenza]

You can probably run the vac at more like 10% - 20% with the finer grits and Brilliant or Granat and get sufficient suction. If you are sanding finish check the abrasive for any little finish build up, that will make very noticeable swirls.

Seth

 

[canadamike]

You can probably run the vac at more like 10% - 20% with the finer grits and Brilliant or Granat and get sufficient suction. If you are sanding finish check the abrasive for any little finish build up, that will make very noticeable swirls.

Seth

Thankyou Seth,

I will try those vac settings.

In your experience, would there be any gain in using an ETS150 in the process, or any other sander?

Or to put it another way, what would be your ideal sander sequence for an oil based finish on domestic hardwoods (such as cherry, walnut, maple). Not asking about grits, but ideal sanders. Maybe Festool has a comparison chart out there to give more insight?

I used to plane and handscrape everything, now that I am into the Festools, I am looking to learn enough about the sanders to develop a consistent and efficient finish prep approach. Hope that make sense.

Mike

 

[Stone Message]

You can probably run the vac at more like 10% - 20% with the finer grits and Brilliant or Granat and get sufficient suction. If you are sanding finish check the abrasive for any little finish build up, that will make very noticeable swirls.

Seth

A lot of people (and I was one of them) think that using the extractor at full blast will keep the air cleaner. Sanding with Festool sanders (I have only tested the Rotex but am sure that they are all the same) in conjunction with a good extractor (mine is the CL 26) is, surprisingly, one of the least dusty operations that you can do in the workshop. I did a dust study, measuring atmospheric dust down to below a micron, and sanding with the extractor turned low is perfectly okay. There were no levels of dust that even approached the UK recommended exposure limit with any Festool tool that I used.

The very worst thing is hand sanding - it produces hundreds of times the dust that a Rotex with CT produces.

Peter

 

[AlexThePalex]

In your experience, would there be any gain in using an ETS150 in the process, or any other sander?

In my experience, random orbit sanders leave a finer finish than orbital sanders, because the random orbit action is more erratic than that of an orbital. For the finest result possible I use the ETS 125.

It is also important to keep your paper as clean as possible, sanded off particles can build up on it and cause those nasty swirls. 

 

[semenza]

Without getting into grits and type of wood etc. I will choose a random orbit ( such as the ETS series) over an orbital  every time for finishing work unless there is some reason not to like getting into corners or the like. In which case I would use the random for all the parts that I could. Not that it can't be done well with an orbital  but I just don't see a reason not to use a random orbit.

Seth

 

[canadamike]

Thanks everyone for your suggestions!

All of your pointers have helped me improve my finish prep. I am sanding walnut, so it probably shows defects more readily with an oil finish, compared to a lighter toned wood.

So, here are the points I learned:

Turn the vac down to 10-20% speed
Maintain a light touch - don't push down
Keep the sanding paper clean (or replace paper) so it does not hold onto broken grit particles or finish build-up
Random orbital is preferable to orbital for a fine finish prep - that learning point will cost me again!

Have I missed anything? Please let me know!

Just to let you know, I was trained with hand tools and own way too many handplanes, spokeshaves and other things that slice wood. I have been doing all of my final prep with the hand tools, but since getting into Festools, have found lots of room for time savings. I do not do production work; mostly custom stuff.

So thank you for taking the time to help me begin to understand the Festool sanders. My guess is there is alot more to learn!

Mike

 

[greg mann]

Mike,

Grab a cup of coffee and walk down to the beach some morning. I will try to channel thru you to enjoy one of the prettiest little places on the Bruce. My late wife and I paddled out of there quite a few times to enjoy the cliffs from the water. I also hiked the loop with my two youngest about 20 years ago. You live in one of my favorite places.

 

[canadamike]

Mike,

Grab a cup of coffee and walk down to the beach some morning. I will try to channel thru you to enjoy one of the prettiest little places on the Bruce. My late wife and I paddled out of there quite a few times to enjoy the cliffs from the water. I also hiked the loop with my two youngest about 20 years ago. You live in one of my favorite places.

Greg,

Thankyou for your email. Yes - it is amazing country around here. My wife and I have kayaked alot of the coast on the east side of the Bruce Peninsula, and have put in lots of miles south of Killarney and north of Parry Sound.

Have you considered travel up here again? If you are in the area next year, we should hook up. If you are interested, send me a PM and I'll send you some pics of our backyard.

Kind regards, Mike