How to make sacrificial fences and inserts for the Festool KS120 Kapex - Video

[Stone Message]

Hi Everyone

A friend of mine has recently bought the KS120 Kapex and asked me to produce some sacrificial fences and inserts for him. I thought it a good time to replace my own and so went the whole hog and created a video description of the work.

I give all the dimensions for the Kapex but the process can be applied to any mitre saw.

Here is the link:


Peter

 

[bobfog]

Didn't watch the whole video as it's not relevant to me as a non-Kapex owner, and already have zero clearance inserts/fence on my Bosch Glide.

However, one thing to be careful of is that I recall a thread on the FOG a little while ago that a customer sent their Kapex to Festool for (surprise, surprise a motor issue) and it came back with the zero clearance inserts removed and OEM ones installed because Festool classed them as an unauthorised modification.

So it might be worth putting a big disclaimer at the beginning of your video that doing what you show could potentially have warranty implications.

 

[six-point socket II]

Hi Peter,

thank you very much for making another outstanding & very educational video!

Kind regards,
Oliver

 

[Stone Message]

Didn't watch the whole video as it's not relevant to me as a non-Kapex owner, and already have zero clearance inserts/fence on my Bosch Glide.

However, one thing to be careful of is that I recall a thread on the FOG a little while ago that a customer sent their Kapex to Festool for (surprise, surprise a motor issue) and it came back with the zero clearance inserts removed and OEM ones installed because Festool classed them as an unauthorised modification.

So it might be worth putting a big disclaimer at the beginning of your video that doing what you show could potentially have warranty implications.

I cannot believe that any company would make such a stipulation and I would not accept it. Why else would Festool put the holes on the fences when they do not supply any accessory to fit them?

Peter

 

[bobfog]

Didn't watch the whole video as it's not relevant to me as a non-Kapex owner, and already have zero clearance inserts/fence on my Bosch Glide.

However, one thing to be careful of is that I recall a thread on the FOG a little while ago that a customer sent their Kapex to Festool for (surprise, surprise a motor issue) and it came back with the zero clearance inserts removed and OEM ones installed because Festool classed them as an unauthorised modification.

So it might be worth putting a big disclaimer at the beginning of your video that doing what you show could potentially have warranty implications.

I cannot believe that any company would make such a stipulation and I would not accept it. Why else would Festool put the holes on the fences when they do not supply any accessory to fit them?

Peter

Just passing on the information and as a point of clarification it was the one on the bed, not the fence that Festool took issue with in the thread I mentioned.

I clearly remember reading the thread where the zero clearance inserts were removed after the saw was sent to the service department and the reason for it being as I stated above. I'll see if I can find the thread for you; however it might prove difficult as that issue was an incidental one and not the main topic of the thread IIRC, so it may be like looking for a needle in a hay stack.

 

[peter halle]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

 

[Stone Message]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

Thanks Peter.

I like it when we get facts.

Peter

 

[Phil Beckley]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

Thanks Peter.

I like it when we get facts.

Peter

.....new to me as well......carry on  [smile]
rg
Phil

 

[bobfog]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member]

Thanks for the clarification, I understand the distinction - it's not specifically warranty.

Does that mean though, by extension, that there might be potential implications for Festool being liable/not being liable if someone had an accident with their saw that had OEM inserts vs their own zero clearance inserts? Would the customer be in a lesser position to make a claim against Festool, if all other things being equal, that the non OEM inserts could possibly have played a part in the cause of the accident?

 

[Phil Beckley]

Hi Peter
Nicely done video and good result - maybe I should get around to doing mine  [thumbs up]
rg
Phil

 

[DrD]

Specifically to the issue of OEM inserts:  I sent my Kapex in for repair and laser alignment recently.  When I shipped it out it had the FastCap Zero Clearance blade guide (tape), and when it came back, it still had the FastCap Zero Clearance Blade guide (tape).  Don't know what that means, but Service didn't remove it.

 

[peter halle]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member]

Thanks for the clarification, I understand the distinction - it's not specifically warranty.

Does that mean though, by extension, that there might be potential implications for Festool being liable/not being liable if someone had an accident with their saw that had OEM inserts vs their own zero clearance inserts? Would the customer be in a lesser position to make a claim against Festool, if all other things being equal, that the non OEM inserts could possibly have played a part in the cause of the accident?

You are asking legal questions that certainly I am not able to answer.  Whereas the legal situation is certainly different in every country of the world if you are really interested or concerned you should seek legal advice from those experienced in the country you are concerned about.

Whereas the supplemental manual for the Kapex - commissioned and distributed on a Festool website has instructions for the construction of sacrificial fences...

In other words,

 

[bobfog]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member]

Thanks for the clarification, I understand the distinction - it's not specifically warranty.

Does that mean though, by extension, that there might be potential implications for Festool being liable/not being liable if someone had an accident with their saw that had OEM inserts vs their own zero clearance inserts? Would the customer be in a lesser position to make a claim against Festool, if all other things being equal, that the non OEM inserts could possibly have played a part in the cause of the accident?

You are asking legal questions that certainly I am not able to answer.  Whereas the legal situation is certainly different in every country of the world if you are really interested or concerned you should seek legal advice from those experienced in the country you are concerned about.

Whereas the supplemental manual for the Kapex - commissioned and distributed on a Festool website has instructions for the construction of sacrificial fences...

In other words,

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member] - fully appreciate you're not qualified to answer it, however it should be a question Festool can answer without the need for an end user/consumer/member of the public to commission legal advice. Maybe [member=57769]TylerC[/member]  or [member=41214]Phil Beckley[/member] can approach the relevant people for an answer.

To expand on your point, that's interesting; Festool removed the inserts in the thread previously mentioned for insurance purposes, yet a Festool commissioned supplemental manual advises on the instruction of sacrificial fences.

Is that to say there is a contradiction here, or is it just the fence, not the bed - as such my original point stands? I wonder if the addition of a zero clearance insert for the bed/channel to accomodate the slide action of the blade is in fact an unauthorised modification that could potentially lead to liability issues.

 

[peter halle]

[member=60286]bobfog[/member],

That wasn't the case.  Festool has to return it with the OEM parts for their insurance protection just like they will not return a tool that was sent in for service out of warranty and then the customer declines, assembled.  It is not a warranty issue.

Peter

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member]

Thanks for the clarification, I understand the distinction - it's not specifically warranty.

Does that mean though, by extension, that there might be potential implications for Festool being liable/not being liable if someone had an accident with their saw that had OEM inserts vs their own zero clearance inserts? Would the customer be in a lesser position to make a claim against Festool, if all other things being equal, that the non OEM inserts could possibly have played a part in the cause of the accident?

You are asking legal questions that certainly I am not able to answer.  Whereas the legal situation is certainly different in every country of the world if you are really interested or concerned you should seek legal advice from those experienced in the country you are concerned about.

Whereas the supplemental manual for the Kapex - commissioned and distributed on a Festool website has instructions for the construction of sacrificial fences...

In other words,

[member=1674]Peter Halle[/member] - fully appreciate you're not qualified to answer it, however it should be a question Festool can answer without the need for an end user/consumer/member of the public to commission legal advice. Maybe [member=57769]TylerC[/member]  or [member=41214]Phil Beckley[/member] can approach the relevant people for an answer.

To expand on your point, that's interesting; Festool removed the inserts in the thread previously mentioned for insurance purposes, yet a Festool commissioned supplemental manual advises on the instruction of sacrificial fences.

Is that to say there is a contradiction here, or is it just the fence, not the bed - as such my original point stands? I wonder if the addition of a zero clearance insert for the bed/channel to accomodate the slide action of the blade is in fact an unauthorised modification that could potentially lead to liability issues.

Bob,

I really doubt that a manufacturer will answer such a question on an Internet forum where it is not unusual on such forums to get trolls posting these kind of questions especially when the term liability is used.

Any such answer would certainly vary based on country and their laws and then there would be insurance liability considerations that might differ from carrier to carrier.

Move on.

Peter

 

[joiner1970]

The only thing I've never understood about the base zero clearance insert and why I've never made one, is that as soon as you do a bevel cut surely you lose the zero clearance ?

You would have to remove it every time you do a bevelled cut.

Sent from my ALE-L21 using Tapatalk

 

[Phil Beckley]

Hi
Can we keep to the thread and talk about the kit without it being side tracked.......please?
rg
Phil

 

[bobfog]

Hi
Can we keep to the thread and talk about the kit without it being side tracked.......please?
rg
Phil

Don't worry Phil, it seems that my most recent post has been deleted, but the post that prompted the response is still visible. So a moderator gets to imply I'm a troll but censored my right to response. Guess my words struck a chord.

 

[Stone Message]

Don't worry Phil, it seems that my most recent post has been deleted, but the post that prompted the response is still visible. So a moderator gets to imply I'm a troll but censored my right to response. Guess my words struck a chord.
[/quote]

The moderator was not talking about you.

Peter

 

[oldie]

Thanks, as ever, for the videos you make - will study this one, carefully, if ever [when?] get the KS60. 
Really like the look of that saw. 

Richard (UK)

 

[Stone Message]

Hi Peter
Nicely done video and good result - maybe I should get around to doing mine  [thumbs up]
rg
Phil

Hi [member=41214]Phil Beckley[/member]

Only just spotted this....

As I have done the video, making more zero clearance inserts will only take about an hour. I will put a set in the box when the KS60 gets returned.

Peter