I'm totally confused

[JCLP]

Good morning All. I have a weird problem and I'm looking for any suggestions on how to fix it.
I have a large panel about the size of a 2"x12"x6' that I'm trying to spray, with no luck.
I'm using a Q5 with the air set at approx. 3/4 power. I'm using a T70 with a 1.5mm needle and cap with 3M PPS pressure pot.
The paint I'm spraying is BM Regal Select conditioned with 10% BM Extender.
The problem is, when I spray a grey colour, Stone Habor, the finish coat is perfect. No orange peel, no grit and perfect coverage. But, when I spray a different colour, Dove White, the finish comes out gritty and it doesn't level out. Same paint base is used for both colours. Everything is the same for both paints, just the colour is different.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
JC

 

[Oldwood]

Hi,

The only thing I can think of is the white could be old stock? I have pulled my hair out trying to get rid of a gritty finish using CV and it turned out the bucket was very old although I bought it just a few days before using. Tried a new bucket and it went down like glass  [cool]

Other than that I would have said a clear base with the grey and pigmented with the white but you ruled that out.

Gerry

 

[JCLP]

Hi,

The only thing I can think of is the white could be old stock? I have pulled my hair out trying to get rid of a gritty finish using CV and it turned out the bucket was very old although I bought it just a few days before using. Tried a new bucket and it went down like glass  [cool]

Other than that I would have said a clear base with the grey and pigmented with the white but you ruled that out.

Gerry

Hi Gerry. Both the grey and the white have the same batch number and were purchased at the same time. Both gallons were from the same box. Almost done my second gallon of white dove with no success. At $60 a gallon it's getting expensive.

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

If the paints are different colors than the paints aren't "identical".  Different pigments can have different effects on the paint binder. There's also a chance that even if the pigments were formulated to work the same in the paint binder, that there was some specific issue with the batch of pigment used to mix the one color. You might want to contact the paint supllier and see if they have a suggestion, or have had other issues. 

 

[JCLP]

If the paints are different colors than the paints aren't "identical".  Different pigments can have different effects on the paint binder. There's also a chance that even if the pigments were formulated to work the same in the paint binder, that there was some specific issue with the batch of pigment used to mix the one color. You might want to contact the paint supllier and see if they have a suggestion, or have had other issues.

I thought about that. When I spray Cloud White, same paint, it uses the same pigments, just different quatities then White Dove. Here are the formulations for both.
White Dove - OC17
Y3 Ox 3.000  ( Oxide yellow )
S2 Ox 18.500 ( Gray )

Cloud White - CC-40
Y3 Ox 2.500  ( Oxide yellow )
S2 Ox 12.000 ( Gray )

No issues spraying Cloud White. I did an identical panel in Cloud White for the same client and it turned out great. Same needle, same air presuure same size of fan.

Still confused, or as Bill would say, "Most Confused"

Cheers,
JC

 

[tjbnwi]

JC, try spraying the Dove White thru your hand held.

Hard to believe 7/32nds (6.5 of S2 and 0.5 of Y3) of an ounce of colorant difference is having that great of an effect on the finish quality.

I could see more problems with the Stone Harbor, it has almost 2 ounces of colorant in it.

Tom

 

[Oldwood]

I agree with Tom, the small amount of pigment added should not change the way it lays down. If possible you might want to ask for the paint store to mix up a fresh gallon for you.

It is rare for the paint shops to get it wrong but it does happen.

Gerry

 

[bertv]

[member=24938]JCLP[/member]  Did you filter the paint?

 

[JCLP]

[member=24938]JCLP[/member]  Did you filter the paint?

The paint was filtered twice. Once when poured into the the cup and a second time through the filter on the PPS lid.

Cheers,

 

[wptski]

JCLP:

You don't mention anywhere above if you tried increasing your Q5 back up to 100% or anything else, did you?

I have a motor speed control that I can use on my Q4.  The first and only time I tried it spraying the first coat of three reduced to 75%(by ear) with poly, it produced a somewhat dry spray.  I returned to full power for the next two coats planning to try this again at a later date.

 

[JCLP]

JCLP:

You don't mention anywhere above if you tried increasing your Q5 back up to 100% or anything else, did you?

I have a motor speed control that I can use on my Q4.  The first and only time I tried it spraying the first coat of three reduced to 75%(by ear) with poly, it produced a somewhat dry spray.  I returned to full power for the next two coats planning to try this again at a later date.

Hi Bill,

I do have the Q5 at full power but I have the air reduced at the gun down to about 75%. This is what I used for the other colours with good success. If I spray Advance, full air all the way.

Cheers,
JC

 

[JCLP]

So, I decided to put the White Dove aside and spray some grey to see what would happen. Well, the grey looks great. Too bad I'm not able to convince the client to go with grey instead of white.

Is it me or is the paint? That is the question. Hopefully it's me, as I can be fixed.

Cheers,
JC

 

[wptski]

Hi Bill,

I do have the Q5 at full power but I have the air reduced at the gun down to about 75%. This is what I used for the other colours with good success. If I spray Advance, full air all the way.

Cheers,
JC

Those ball valves at the gun are flow controls not really a pressure reducer in the true sense of the word.  Look how much one has to pay for a air regulator compared to a simple ball valve one can but at Home Depot, Lowes, etc.  No real way for "us" to test this but is this the reason why Fuji and other brand(s) slow the motor down instead??  Makes one wonder! [unsure]

I know its more convenient to have a control right there at the gun.  Since on my setup the speed control is external in the power input I can use extensions to get it at least in your spray booth or area where you are spraying.

 

[tiralie]

Those ball valves at the gun are flow controls not really a pressure reducer in the true sense of the word.

Interesting point.
Tim

 

[JCLP]

Just got some new paint. Will give this one a try. Met with the benjamin Moore District person and they are going to bring the bad gallon to their lab and investigate.
Now off to spray. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Cheers,
JC

 

[wptski]

Interesting point.
Tim

A regulator valve doesn't adjust flow either!

 

[JCLP]

Well I've come to the conclusion it's me. No problem with the paint now. Able to do smaller panels with white and no issues, but this large one has me wanting to jump off a bridge. Maybe lazer eye surgery will help or maybe just change the angle of the lighting to better see the paint going down.
Going to try one more time, if that doesn't work, I will get Tim to spray it.

Cheers,
JC

 

[tjbnwi]

I think you're going to have to spray the larger panels with your hand held airless. I'm not sure why you're having issues with the Fuji on larger panels, but I believe the hand held should solve the issue.

Tom

 

[JCLP]

Hi Tom,
My handheld fell on to concrete and bent the end. It was not fixable so I trashed it.
I've attached 2 photos. One is the grey, with the nickle so the camera could focus on something, and the other is the white that looks like sand paper. White is White Dove and the grey is Stone Harbor. Same base for both colours. Same needle, same air pressure same thinning.
The white looks grey in the photo because of the lighting. Trust me it's white. The grey is with the nickel.

Cheers,
JC

 

[antss]

I don't spray often, well almost never.  But that looks like orange peel to my eye.

Which usually means the paint hasn't been thinned enough. 

But that doesn't explain why the other one goes down fine.  [unsure]