Jigsaw purchase -- please push me over the edge!!

I'm on my second Bosch.  The first one was stolen when one of my kids left my garage door open.  I added a dust collection port from Bosch to the Bosch and it's pretty good.  I've never tried the Festool, and I bought the Bosch before I found Festool.  Even with my love of the Festool sanders, and the TS75 (7 Festool in all), I think I'd still go with Bosch.  Blades are readily available and I'm famous to needing "another" trip to Home Depot.  If I had the Festool, I'd likely find myself without readily available blades...joe
 
Joe Jensen said:
  If I had the Festool, I'd likely find myself without readily available blades...joe

Joe, all
The Bosch and Festool jigsaws use the same type blade, they are interchangeable.
 
Hey Toolpig,
You should give the Hilti a go. I really loved it. They have both grip styles and dust collection, a low friction baseplate, and use
Bosch style blades. I cut a clean circle freehand in 1/4" plex with no chattering. Don't know where the switch is in the barrel grip, I had the d-handle. I didn't have trouble seeing the cut line. Good machine.
Eli
 
Toolpig said:
Went to Woodcraft to try one out.  Picked it up and knew instantly is wasn't for me.

I'm left-handed.  The switch, which is located on the side, digs into my left hand.

Bummer, this sort of things happens to me a lot.

I'm now looking at the Milwaukee 6276-21 and the Metabo STW 135 PLUS because both have the switch on top of the housing.  Anybody have one of these?

I know the switch issue sounds trivial, but comfort is a big deal for me.  Oh well.

TP

I recommend you also try out a Makita jigsaw before making your final choice.  I am left handed, too.  As you already know, we "lefties" have long gotten used to compensating for tools designed for right-handed people.  I purchased the Makita after trying both the Bosch and the Festool jigsaws because the Makita was a) slightly smaller and lighter, b) lower in price - close to Bosch, and c) had an LED light so I can better see the cut line.  The Makita uses the same bayonet blade design as Bosch and Festool and grips/releases blades much the same.  There is a dust collection attachment for the Makita, but it doesn't work very well.  To make perfectly straight cuts, I simply guide the saw base along a straight edge - the back edge of a Festool guide rail will suffice.  The general purpose wood cutting blades supplied with my Makita cut cleanly through 2x12 PT SYPine when the special extra thick, coarse [4 tpi?] Festool blades would not.  But if you plan to cut through a lot of thick stock and need absolutely perpendicular cuts, Festool is you machine because the blade guides of the Makita will allow some side deflection of the blade.  But this is not an issue for stock of 1" or less thickness.

Dave R.
 
Dave Ronyak said:
...The general purpose wood cutting blades supplied with my Makita (jig saw) cut cleanly through 2x12 PT SYPine...

Dave R.

Makita makes some very good tools and great blades. One of my all time favorite tools is a Makita 9.6 volt reciprocating saw. That tiny tool, equipped with the thin kerf HS steel metal cutting blade Makita made specifically for it, runs through mild steel almost like butter. Every time I use it I'm amazed.
 
Brent b said:
Jeez, with a name like tool pig I would think you'd own several of each already! ;D 

I'm curious if anyone has been able to test Festool's claim that the Trion can cut straight through 4 3/4" beams, and how the Bosch stacks up against such ability.  Seems like if Trion can cut through 4x stock clean and straight and the Bosch deflects, even with a trion blade, then Festool has upped the ante.  I have both the Bosch and Trion and find that the Trion overall feels and cuts better for me and I grab it first when given the choice.

When I tested the saw a couple of years ago I took a clip of cutting a 4.5x8" piece of maple.  I don't have any close ups of the resultant cut but it was very good.  I cut a frame out of the below movie clip and I think you can see that the off cut piece is square...at least as square as one can discern from looking at the video.

video  http://nhwoodworker.com/trion/testcut-3.wmv

testcut-3_0001.jpg
 
"When I tested the saw a couple of years ago I took a clip of cutting a 4.5x8" piece of maple.  I don't have any close ups of the resultant cut but it was very good.  I cut a frame out of the below movie clip and I think you can see that the off cut piece is square...at least as square as one can discern from looking at the video."

Have you tested any others, particularly the newer bosch?
 
Well, I ended up getting the Bosch 1591EVSK barrel grip.  It feels great in either hand and cuts like a dream.  Have tested on some 2x4 spruce and cuts are perfectly perpendicular.  I can see the cutting line just fine and it's smooth as silk.  Haven't tried dust collection yet (had to order the accessories separately).

Thanks for your posts.  I know the TRION has its fans, but for the money the new Bosch is just too good to pass up.

TP

Toolpig said:
I'm about to pull the trigger and buy a new jigsaw.  I want a barrel-grip and have it narrowed down to the newest Bosch and the Festool Trion.

Forget the price and forget about dust collection.

I want a jigsaw that lets me see the blade on the cut-line!  I've read numerous complaints about not being able to see the blade on the cut-line when using the Festool (with or without dust collection).  I've read about tricks like using fabric softener sheets to reduce "static cling" on the chip catcher, etc.  But I don't want to mess around with that.  I want it perfect out of the box.

Comments?

TP
 
Well, I had to send the new Bosch 1591 jigsaw back.  Argh!!!!!!

It was running very hot, plus the "soft start" and "orbital switch" features weren't working.  My guess is that the internal electronics are toast.

Getting a replacement, but I now have my doubts.

Strike one!!

TP

Toolpig said:
Well, I ended up getting the Bosch 1591EVSK barrel grip.  It feels great in either hand and cuts like a dream.  Have tested on some 2x4 spruce and cuts are perfectly perpendicular.  I can see the cutting line just fine and it's smooth as silk.  Haven't tried dust collection yet (had to order the accessories separately).

Thanks for your posts.  I know the TRION has its fans, but for the money the new Bosch is just too good to pass up.

TP

Toolpig said:
I'm about to pull the trigger and buy a new jigsaw.  I want a barrel-grip and have it narrowed down to the newest Bosch and the Festool Trion.

Forget the price and forget about dust collection.

I want a jigsaw that lets me see the blade on the cut-line!  I've read numerous complaints about not being able to see the blade on the cut-line when using the Festool (with or without dust collection).  I've read about tricks like using fabric softener sheets to reduce "static cling" on the chip catcher, etc.  But I don't want to mess around with that.  I want it perfect out of the box.

Comments?

TP
 
ahhhh, see, your lack of loyalty has cost you.  Consider it a warning......

Seriously though, I tried my jigsaw (barrel grip trion) lefty and see what you mean about the switch.  Bummer.  So what advantages are their to being sinistral anyhow.
 
Toolpig said:
Well, I had to send the new Bosch 1591 jigsaw back.  Argh!!!!!!

It was running very hot, plus the "soft start" and "orbital switch" features weren't working.  My guess is that the internal electronics are toast.

Getting a replacement, but I now have my doubts.

It seems that you and I are the only people in the world that have had problems with the Bosch! Everyone raves about this jigsaw, but I had problems with mine (a D-grip version, equivalent to the 1590EVSK) and sent it back too.

For photographs to illustrate problems 1 to 3, see here.

Problem 1. Thicker genuine Bosch blades (eg the 1.7mm thick T144DP, supplied with he saw) didn't fit into the groove in the support roller. This meant that the "Precision Control System" (PCS) guides on either side of the blade did not give sideways support to the blade when pendulum mode was off, as the blade could not move back far enough to fit between the guides. Since neither the support roller nor the PCS guides properly supported the blade, there was very little lateral support at all.

Problem 2. Because the blade wanted to seat itself in the roller, but couldn't, after less than a minute of running, the support roller has started to wear a groove in the back edges of the blade.

Problem 3. This happened when the saw was put into any of the three pendulum modes with the 1.7mm thick blade and the PCS guides were engaged. The blade started to move back, but was obstructed from doing so by the PCS guides which had clamped shut behind it (see Problem No 1). However the blade continued to push back until it sprung the guides apart, and the blade then entered the gap. When the pendulum action moved the blade forward again, the guides clamped together, only to be forced apart again on the next cycle. The PCS guides ended up being continually forced back and then apart, and this repeated movement, at up to 2,800 times a minute, would have damaged the mechanism very quickly, as the guides are designed to remain stationary.

Problem 4. In the case of thinner blades, which did fit into the roller, the PCS guides clamped onto the side of the blade but pushed it to one side, resulting in a 1mm movement at the tip of the blade. The guides did not seem to be centred on the blade.

Problem 5. The soft-start feature was almost undetectable, and the saw jerked due to torque reaction every time I started it.

Problem 6. Whilst smooth and quiet at speeds 1 and 2, at speeds 3 to 6 the saw got rattly and I started to worry that there was something wrong inside. Vibration was also increased, and overall I was disappointed by the smoothness, vibration and noise. At speeds above 3, it felts and soundeds rougher than the 10 year old jigsaw I had previously. Oddly, the rattles and vibration were more severe when the pendulum action was off, which is the opposite of what I'd expect. I noticed all this before fitting any blades at all.

Problem 7. On two occasions, the T144DP blade refused to eject, and only did so when I gently started the saw.

Problem 8. On several occasions, the blade release mechanism got stuck in the open position, and pressure had to be applied to close it, rather than it springing shut on its own accord.

All in all, I was majorly disappointed in this much-heralded saw, which was the UK D-grip version of your 1591EVSK, called the GST135.

I replaced it with a DeWalt DW331K which works brilliantly and is one of my favourite tools:

41SD3W7HC2L._AA280_.jpg


The only reason I didn't recommend that you might like to get the DW333K barrel-grip version...

423011_DW333K_1.jpg


...is that it doesn't seem to be available in the USA. My DeWalt is super-smooth, with no torque reaction, practically zero vibration at speeds 1-3 and minimal vibration at speed 6, and it purrs along rather than rattles. I would have liked an LED like the Makita, since I sometimes use the jigsaw work in dingy conditions, but I'd happily get another DeWalt one and would recommend it to anyone.

Forrest

 
I've read about the problems you described with the blades not fitting right.  I never had that problem with mine, however, and read someplace that they fixed this problem awhile back (something about the roller being the wrong size on the early runs of the saws).

All cuts with mine were super-smooth, by the way.  I can't complain about the cutting performance one bit. 

I was wrong about the blade orbit switch not working, by the way.  I called Bosch -- turns out you can't see the difference in blade orbits just by looking at the blade, but you really notice the difference when cutting through wood.

"Soft start" is non-existent.  They claim it's a feature, but it's not.  My Bosch 1617 router has soft-start (for real).

ToolBarn is sending me another Bosch (same saw).  We'll see what happens.

Bosch makes nice stuff!  I'm not ready to give up on them just yet.

TP

Forrest Anderson said:
Toolpig said:
Well, I had to send the new Bosch 1591 jigsaw back.  Argh!!!!!!

It was running very hot, plus the "soft start" and "orbital switch" features weren't working.  My guess is that the internal electronics are toast.

Getting a replacement, but I now have my doubts.

It seems that you and I are the only people in the world that have had problems with the Bosch! Everyone raves about this jigsaw, but I had problems with mine (a D-grip version, equivalent to the 1590EVSK) and sent it back too.

For photographs to illustrate problems 1 to 3, see here.

Problem 1. Thicker genuine Bosch blades (eg the 1.7mm thick T144DP, supplied with he saw) didn't fit into the groove in the support roller. This meant that the "Precision Control System" (PCS) guides on either side of the blade did not give sideways support to the blade when pendulum mode was off, as the blade could not move back far enough to fit between the guides. Since neither the support roller nor the PCS guides properly supported the blade, there was very little lateral support at all.

Problem 2. Because the blade wanted to seat itself in the roller, but couldn't, after less than a minute of running, the support roller has started to wear a groove in the back edges of the blade.

Problem 3. This happened when the saw was put into any of the three pendulum modes with the 1.7mm thick blade and the PCS guides were engaged. The blade started to move back, but was obstructed from doing so by the PCS guides which had clamped shut behind it (see Problem No 1). However the blade continued to push back until it sprung the guides apart, and the blade then entered the gap. When the pendulum action moved the blade forward again, the guides clamped together, only to be forced apart again on the next cycle. The PCS guides ended up being continually forced back and then apart, and this repeated movement, at up to 2,800 times a minute, would have damaged the mechanism very quickly, as the guides are designed to remain stationary.

Problem 4. In the case of thinner blades, which did fit into the roller, the PCS guides clamped onto the side of the blade but pushed it to one side, resulting in a 1mm movement at the tip of the blade. The guides did not seem to be centred on the blade.

Problem 5. The soft-start feature was almost undetectable, and the saw jerked due to torque reaction every time I started it.

Problem 6. Whilst smooth and quiet at speeds 1 and 2, at speeds 3 to 6 the saw got rattly and I started to worry that there was something wrong inside. Vibration was also increased, and overall I was disappointed by the smoothness, vibration and noise. At speeds above 3, it felts and soundeds rougher than the 10 year old jigsaw I had previously. Oddly, the rattles and vibration were more severe when the pendulum action was off, which is the opposite of what I'd expect. I noticed all this before fitting any blades at all.

Problem 7. On two occasions, the T144DP blade refused to eject, and only did so when I gently started the saw.

Problem 8. On several occasions, the blade release mechanism got stuck in the open position, and pressure had to be applied to close it, rather than it springing shut on its own accord.

All in all, I was majorly disappointed in this much-heralded saw, which was the UK D-grip version of your 1591EVSK, called the GST135.

I replaced it with a DeWalt DW331K which works brilliantly and is one of my favourite tools:

41SD3W7HC2L._AA280_.jpg


The only reason I didn't recommend that you might like to get the DW333K barrel-grip version...

423011_DW333K_1.jpg


...is that it doesn't seem to be available in the USA. My DeWalt is super-smooth, with no torque reaction, practically zero vibration at speeds 1-3 and minimal vibration at speed 6, and it purrs along rather than rattles. I would have liked an LED like the Makita, since I sometimes use the jigsaw work in dingy conditions, but I'd happily get another DeWalt one and would recommend it to anyone.

Forrest
 
has anyone ever seen any dust collection shrouds for dewalt? i haven't been able to locate one??
 
roblg3 said:
has anyone ever seen any dust collection shrouds for dewalt? i haven't been able to locate one??

I've got the bow handle DW331K and it has a front plastic shroud. I've never used it myself as it obscures the line too much IMO.

Which model have you got?
 
shed, i have the exact same model, D handle and all.  I don't remeber there being a piece like you described included in my box.  Although when i purchased it, i wouldn't have ever cared about the collection aspect since i was all field work at that time.  Did you purchase your piece seperately? and if so, can you tell me where you acquired it from? it can't be so expensive that it's not worth a try.
 
roblg3 said:
shed, i have the exact same model, D handle and all.  I don't remeber there being a piece like you described included in my box.  Although when i purchased it, i wouldn't have ever cared about the collection aspect since i was all field work at that time.  Did you purchase your piece seperately? and if so, can you tell me where you acquired it from? it can't be so expensive that it's not worth a try.

It came with the saw but you can buy spares, it's part 18 on the diagram below;



The full part number is DW331-1-18-581239-01

I got the above from a UK parts website and the cost is £2.99, so about $5 (not including shipping);

http://toolsandpartsdirect.co.uk/DeWalt-Spare-Parts/Wood-Working/Jigsaws/DeWalt-DW331-Type-1-Jigsaw-Spare-Parts__p-170-185-192-3643.aspx

You should be able to find a Dewalt spares supplier in the US though with the above info.

As an update, I should mention that I took delivery of a Carvex last week and I can't see the Dewalt being used as much going forward.
 
i have recently spent waaaaay tooo much to replace a perfectly functioning saw.  Thanks so much for your incredibly detailed reply!  If i can't find it with all the direction that you've given, i really need professional help [eek].  I appreciate your effort very much.  This site has been great!  It's a pleasure to be able to communicate with clearly knowledgeable individuals like yourself.  Let me know how the carvex works out for you.  Part of my marketing plan includes a homogenous presentation of tool and materials when arriving on the job site, so i will be replacing many more tools with appropriate substitutions from fes.
CHEERS [thanks]
 
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