JULY 2008: PS 300 or PSB 300 Jigsaw

[dirtydeeds]

bob swenson's and micheal kelough's comments are TOTALY valid in my eyes

i was a judge in this contest

and on bob and micheal's reading, I came up short

being english

i might dissagree to a certain extent with your conclusions but will defend your right to make them, regardless of your views

you have been kind and cuorteous enough to explain your thaught processes

this is far more than some detractors, this makes me even more determined to to do better next time 

im human and will try to do better in the august competition

if "you lot"  :  will accept me

 

[Matthew Schenker]

dirtydeeds,
Well, let's resolve this.
Seems you are saying the results were a mistake.  Are you in favor of reconsidering the decision?
Matthew

 

[Frank Pellow]

I agree that more documentation on Paul's part would have been good and welcome Paul's promise to provide more.  But, it turns out that it was not necessary because what Paul provided was sufficient for me and many others to build systainer ports modelled upon his.

As for the contest win with minimal documentation: I view this as a "legacy" project that is so good and so influential that it won in spite of the dirth of words.  

We should probably think of this project as "grandfathered" and should not expect projects submitted in the future to win if they lack documentation.

 

[Frank Pellow]

dirtydeeds,
Well, let's resolve this.
Seems you are saying the results were a mistake.  Are you in favor of reconsidering the decision?Matthew

It would be a very big mistake to change the decision. 

 

[Bob Swenson]

Matthew,
Before you go stirring up the pot again let me
make my point perfectly clear ? I agree with
Michael that the judges did not follow the rules.
Paul  built his project long before there was a contest
so if the judges felt that they did not have to abide by the rules in this
case than so be it. Does this mean that the rules will be ignored
in the future?
Please don't expect me respond any further on this subject.

Bob.

 

[dirtydeeds]

THE JUDGES DESCISION IS FINAL

END OF

 

[dirtydeeds]

i have made a PERSONAL statement

i have accepted that i do need to read the rules a little more carefully

but i do not accept the critisism

HOWEVER the colective descision is FINAL

it will NOT be rescinded

 

[dirtydeeds]

NOR will the descision be re discussed by the judges

 

[Per Swenson]

Judging is hard!

I do not envy you fellas.

Congratulations Paul.

Now that we have all been reacquainted with the rules......

Lets get crackin on August.

Per

 

[Bill Wyko]

If I can stop screwin up veneers,  :-\I just might stand a chance again. ;D Festool sanders really take down material asap. The up side though, I got to use my DX-93 to fix my fork ups. So one more Festool to add to the job. If I get it right this weekend, I'll post soon.

 

[dirtydeeds]

one more point to those who would have liked a different descision

being one of a team of judges is a bit like being the referee and line judges in a football/rubgy game

WE are on the spot

WE make the descions

WE were appointed by our peers to do this job

believe me, i NOW know how hard the job is 

any number of armchair pundits / commentators / reporters can say anything they like BUT they are not on the spot

 

[dirtydeeds]

i too have watched football and rugby matches

(remember I mean english football)

i too have questioned descions, vociferously in some cases

NOT NOW ive been a judge

 

[Michael Kellough]

Michael and Bob,
So, are you saying Paul should not have won?  If not, what are you saying exactly?
We had a lot of reasons for choosing Paul's project, but it was a close contest, as I mentioned above.
Maybe the other judges can weigh in here, as I don't want to defend the decision all by myself.
Thanks,
Matthew

My position on the July contest is,

"Congratulations to Paul!

However, unless the link above to Paul's Sysport project is incorrect,
it sure looks like the requirements for documentation has swung as far back
in the opposite direction as is possible to go."

It isn't subtle or Kremlin-speak.

In my longer post explaining why I thought the requirements seem to have changed, I did note that the project didn't seem to meet the requirements, as written.

If you add "inspirational" as a big point gainer in the rules then Paul's Systainer project is a shoe in.

It would be great if Paul added design and construction info to the thread. A year ago he had already made five of them. He's got a lot of expertise so now that the Systainer thread is getting noticed again it is a perfect time to beef it up.

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Michael,
Again, I'm not claiming you used subtlety or Kremlin-speak.  Just the opposite.  What you said is crystal clear to me.

... this project did not meet the bare minimum for consideration.

I'm taking this at face value: that the project should not have even been considered.

Obviously, that's a direct criticism of the judges and the judges' decision.  If there's another way to interpret this, let me know.

Matthew

PS: I find it fascinating that the two people trying to invalidate this contest happen to both be active members of TalkFestool (a forum created for the purpose of undermining the FOG).  Is this just a coincidence?

 

[Brice Burrell]

The judging criteria changed a little with jigs being added as entries. We can't judge a project in the same way as a jig so we needed to be a bit more flexible in our judging this month. I was/am in favor of fairly informal rules and judging criteria for this contest. That way the judges wouldn't be too restricted, I feel great threads that add real value to the site should win. Remember one of the goals of the contest is to bring forward threads that inspire members to participate here and use their Festool tools. Paul's thread did that vary well.

While it's okay to discuss the judging it should be done in a productive way. I don't want to have the contest turn sour and I really don't want to take away from Paul's chance to enjoy his win.

 

[Per Swenson]

Let this go.

Lets celebrate the winner.

This contest is over.

Absolutely no reason to say anything here beyond

congrats Paul, you're gonna dance a jig.  heheh get it?

Per

 

[Bill Wyko]

Per, I elect you to be a judge this month. Whaddya say?

 

[Per Swenson]

No freakin way, I am cheaper then a ......Ice cream cone ;D

 

[Dan Lyke]

Obviously, that's a direct criticism of the judges and the judges' decision.  If there's another way to interpret this, let me know.

In one professional organization that I'm a member of, anyone questioning the decision making of the current meeting planning committee is automatically elected to run the planning for the next meeting.

Seems like something similar might be in order here.

Dan

 

[robtonya]

Congratulations Paul. I would like to make something like that someday. On the down side, I only have two Festool's though. On the upside my Festool collection recently doubled.  ;D ;D