Kapex bed not coplaner

[ear3]

Got my Kapex earlier today and have been checking out the alignment.  Noticed that there is a potentially serious issue with the bed -- the swivel part of the bed is slightly higher than both the left and right sides.  It's not a huge issue at 0 degrees, but when I turn the bed to the full 60 degree miter on the right, a gap of about .022 opens up with the right side.  This means that the swivel bed itself is out of plane, and so what should be a 90 degree plumb cut may change depending on what miter angle or the size of the workpiece I'm cutting.  It's hard for me to believe that this saw made it out of quality control this way.  First here's the right side at the full 60 degree miter:

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

Here's the left side at 0 degrees.  Fortunately the extreme left of the left extension is coplanar with the swivel portion of the bed, and the gap is only at the transition point, appx. .012.  But If I were cutting short pieces this would likely cause some issues.

[attachimg=3]

 

[copcarcollector]

and so what should be a 90 degree plumb cut may change depending on what miter angle or the size of the workpiece I'm cutting.

But If I were cutting short pieces this would likely cause some issues

Have you tried out the saw yet making these cuts on some scrap? To see if this is indeed an issue?

If there is an issue with your Kapex, Festool and/or your dealer will surely make it right.

 

[ear3]

I'm sorry, but I didn't just spend $1500 on a miter saw to worry about whether I might have ill-fitting miters when I start cutting thousands of dollars worth of paneling and moulding next week. 

and so what should be a 90 degree plumb cut may change depending on what miter angle or the size of the workpiece I'm cutting.

But If I were cutting short pieces this would likely cause some issues

Have you tried out the saw yet making these cuts on some scrap? To see if this is indeed an issue?

If there is an issue with your Kapex, Festool and/or your dealer will surely make it right.

 

[copcarcollector]

All I was saying is... try it out. Use some scrap and test your theory, thats all. Maybe the issue will affect your cuts, but maybe it won't.

To assume that there might be a problem is unrealistic in my view.

I know how much the saw costs, I think there have been too many people recently taking a micrometer and feeler gauges to their Kapex looking for problems, or reporting 'possible' problems rather than 'actual' problems.

Bottom line is you have the 30 day return policy, so even if you dont want to keep it, you can still try it out. Make some cuts. Or, arrange an exchange with your dealer.

 

[teocaf]

i just checked mine and i'm not seeing the gap you're seeing.  my swivel part is indeed slightly higher (a very tiny bit--if i scrape the paint it would probably be even.)

however, i'm not sure that you can't make accurate cuts with your machine.  the money shot is the angle accuracy and consistency between the blade and the swivel platform in the dynamic mode of cutting.  like it's been suggested, you need to cut wood and see what the results yield.  (btw, in your last picture, I think that I may be able to get a more informative gap view if you held your square mirror image to how you're using it in the first image)

you may indeed have a problem, i'm not saying that you don't, but it's also true that this is not meant to be on par with a metal milling machine.  heck, on a humid day the dimensions of the material you're working with can change while you're on your lunch break. 

luckily you have some options.  i know it can be frustrating to get familiar with a new machine right before a big job.

 

[glass1]

Of course it will affect the cut, but probably just on short pieces that are no longer than the kapex from the blade to the edge of the wing. On longer pieces the overall flatness of the stand will matter more. If you can rock a piece of wood than the cut will vary. This gap will matter less when cutting on the flat. And yes often the wood one cuts could be less than perfect and affect the cut more. Still the bed should be flat. C'mon on people let's hold festool to higher standards. They need to get this stuff right!

 

[Serge]

Pull the saw towards you and push down and then measure again.
Most times when the mid section is higher it will be pushed down using the saw, then it will not affect the results.

 

[peter halle]

Of course everyone's expectations of a tool are different.  I would suggest that you try the saw and see if it will make the quality cuts you desire or are required for your high pressure high profile job.  If it doesn't then you have your answer.  But I offer that every single tool, widget, assembly, etc that has moving parts has to have some play in order to move.  The original batches of the Kapex that came to North America had issues - because parts were manufactured too high a tolerance and caused binding.

Only you can determine if the saw will be partner or a hindrance.  None of us here can make that call for you and there are times when too much advice can be a bad thing.

Peter

 

[tjbnwi]

As long as the turret of the saw is slightly higher then the bed everything will be fine. The only area that matters is the intersection between the blade and the turret.

All my other miter saws the turret is slightly higher than the bed.

Tom

 

[Cheese]

[member=37411]Edward A Reno III[/member]
FWIW...I checked mine and at 0°:
Left = .014"
Right = .008"

Left 45° = .022"
Right 60° = .023"

But as I stated in another thread, the saw cuts 45° miters consistently within 1/12°.

 

[ear3]

Thanks [member=44099]Cheese[/member].  Those are almost the same values as mine, so that's helpful.

[member=37411]Edward A Reno III[/member]
FWIW...I checked mine and at 0°:
Left = .014"
Right = .008"

Left 45° = .022"
Right 60° = .023"

But as I stated in another thread, the saw cuts 45° miters consistently within 1/12°.

 

[windmill man]

I would suggest you send your saw back to festool

 

[jeh]

I'm sorry, but I didn't just spend $1500 on a miter saw to worry about whether I might have ill-fitting miters when I start cutting thousands of dollars worth of paneling and moulding next week. 

and so what should be a 90 degree plumb cut may change depending on what miter angle or the size of the workpiece I'm cutting.

But If I were cutting short pieces this would likely cause some issues

Have you tried out the saw yet making these cuts on some scrap? To see if this is indeed an issue?

If there is an issue with your Kapex, Festool and/or your dealer will surely make it right.

Most people would not buy a new saw before starting such a high value job. You basically bet the farm on getting a perfect saw with no slack time to work with it or get it replaced if it was defective.

 

[mastercabman]

[member=37411]Edward A Reno III[/member]
FWIW...I checked mine and at 0°:
Left = .014"
Right = .008"

Left 45° = .022"
Right 60° = .023"

But as I stated in another thread, the saw cuts 45° miters consistently within 1/12°.

I like to know how you guys come up with those numbers? [big grin]

 

[Cheese]

Simple...feeler gauges are your friends.  [big grin]

Place a known flat rule/square across the surface to be measured (Starrett comes to mind) and try to slip different thickness feeler gauges into the gap. The correct "feel" is a very slight drag when you try to remove the feeler gauge from the gap to be measured. They aren't called feeler gauges for no reason...remember, just a slight drag is indicative of a correct "feel".

 

[mastercabman]

Simple...feeler gauges are your friends.  [big grin]

Place a known flat rule/square across the surface to be measured (Starrett comes to mind) and try to slip different thickness feeler gauges into the gap. The correct "feel" is a very slight drag when you try to remove the feeler gauge from the gap to be measured. They aren't called feeler gauges for no reason...remember, just a slight drag is indicative of a correct "feel".

I kind of knew how it was done!
I was just trying to pull your legs! 
But do you guys have nothing else better to do with a miter saw? [wink]

 

[Cheese]

But do you guys have nothing else better to do with a miter saw? [wink]

Well actually, that's a great distraction for me because I was going to turn the saw upside down and count how many areas had excessive casting flash. [eek] [eek]

Seriously, I was downstairs using the Kapex and I thought why not measure just for kicks. I've cut alot of stuff on it and have never measured anything on the Kapex after it was setup. So I pulled out the feeler gauges. Interestingly enough, I decided to take the feelers to a Milwaukee miter that I also have and the numbers were L = .002" & R = .003". [scratch chin]

Now where was I....that's right casting flash... [big grin]

 

[Birdhunter]

What all you guys are leaving out of the measurement is the Coriolis effect on the Kapex's structure. If you were to transport the Kapex to the North Pole, the distortion caused by the Coriolis effect would be eliminated and a true distortion measurement could be achieved. But, you would have to take into account the contraction of the metal caused by the very low temperatures.

 

[Cheese]

What all you guys are leaving out of the measurement is the Coriolis effect on the Kapex's structure. If you were to transport the Kapex to the North Pole, the distortion caused by the Coriolis effect would be eliminated and a true distortion measurement could be achieved. But, you would have to take into account the contraction of the metal caused by the very low temperatures.

That's a good point [thumbs up]...probably the reason Milwaukee doesn't recommend using their saw on the North Pole. It can only contract .002-.003" and the Coriolis effect would put it out of spec. [popcorn] [popcorn]

 

[Jonnio]

Hi I think you should just get another one without hesitation. After all, apart from innovative design and a tool that's at least on a par with other top brands quality wise, we pay extra for the privilege of being as fussy as we wish. Festool does make brilliant machines  especially in their investment into the design of such machines, but I think the manufacturing is still the same as other top brands. The benefit of festool is that you can can keep sending them back until your on 1 thou or less! And you know they will stay that way, unless of course you set up shop in the Antarctic.
Hope you get one soon..