Kapex vs Makita LS1013

Fred West

Honorary Member
Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
Messages
652
I have had my Makita for approx. three years and with Forrest's Miter Saw blade on it I have been absolutely thrilled with it. SO, what I need from at least those of you overseas is the whys and wherefors as to why I should replace the Makita when the Kapex finally arrives. Truly, what are the differences and other than the typical high tolerances and standards that all Festools are built with why WILL I buy this. ;D Please make your arguments as convincing as possible otherwise I may lose another wife or a minute or two of sleep.  :D Thank you in advance, Fred
 
Fred,

You'd be better asking for a comparison b/t the Kapex and the LS1214, I don't think the LS1013 does 300mm wide 120 high cuts does it? In any case, dust is the number one issue. The Kapex fitted to a CT22 leaves very little dust and gives a slightly better cut face. I'd also say that cutting trenches is like slicing ham off the bone at the deli. Its just soooo easy and clean. All you do is rock the saw back and forth across the timber.  No need to lift the blade at all. Also, it's light enough to move from one place to the other in the workshop to give me more workspace, without girding myself with a back brace. That said, don't look for me selling the LS1214 too soon. Apart from sentimental value, I love the way it works.

Regards,

Rob
 
Rob McGilp said:
Fred,

That said, don't look for me selling the LS1214 too soon. Apart from sentimental value, I love the way it works.

Regards,

Rob

Rob,

I'm interested in that statement. Could you expand on that? Maybe give us a head to head comparison of Kapex and LS1214. A real workshop review.

Thanks,
Eiji
 
Difficult choice there Fred! (Wife or sleep that is!) ;D

I do not have a Makita saw but did consider it when the Kapex was announced. I thought it was a smashing saw and at around USD 880 (here in the UK), it was a fair bit cheaper than the Kapex (USD 1400). I was in Germany at the time and the dealer had both Makita and Festool on sale. What swayed me to pay USD 520 more? ( and in no order of importance)

Capacity:      cut hight up to 120mm

Tolerance:    100% accurate cut at any angle and easily adjustable should it go out of true

Laser:          (extra cost on Makita) superbly accurate, exact curf cut position.

Vertical mitre adjustment:        The dogs danglies for ease and accuracy.

Trench:        Once set it does not move and as Rob says it is like slicing ham. Instant adjustment, no bolts/screws to work free. Micro adjustment using a twist

Blade:          Superb finish. Cuts like butter, motor does not baulk at dense woods but just keeps 'a cutting.

Quality/solidity of manufacture:          Not a lot between the two on the surface but time will tell. Not convinced on plastic guard on Kapex but I have 3 years to prove myself wrong! The Kapex slide is smooth, the Makita I tried might have had a bit of ball bearing grumble and did not feel as smooth. Both are good looking saws with a quality of manufacture which eclipses the current offerings from the Far East ( though they are catching up very, very fast). I like being able to park the Kapex up to a wall so the slide operation for me is a bonus.

Warranty:    Makita UK 1 year with return to dealer. Festool 3 year with courier pickup.

Portability:    Not a lot in it but cable tidy is clever. Weigh about the same, Kapex (seemed) bigger.

Robustness:        The Kapex blade guard is not my favourite and seems flimsy to me and I much prefer the metal cover and ball bearing lip of the Symetric. I wouldn't lend the Kapex to anyone and would not throw it in the back of a pickup. The Makita seems a very robust saw and were I a contractor I would not hesitate to use it on a building site. Not so sure about the Kapex though I must admit to being a tool tart who cleans and cherishes them before putting to bed!

System:    The angle guide supplied with the Kapex is superb as is the hold down clamp which you can fit either side of the saw. The side extension system is well engineered, functional but so expensive. I do not have that yet but have seen it in action and it is very impressive.

Noise:        Kapex is a noisy saw as are all brush motors but the Makita sounded noisier and less smooth. ( This is hard to quantify and is a personal thing so you do need to try before you buy)

Dust extraction:      No contest, Kapex is 90% there though I do not use my CT Mini which struggled with the amount of dust produced by the Kapex. I use a Fein Turbo and it gets most, a Midi would be much better. Can be used indoors with confidence.

As I said at the start I do not have a Makita but was very impressed with it when I was comparing. I have an old and faithfull Elektra Beckum SCMS which I would never get rid of as it was built in Germany and is so much more solid than their new Far East offerings. The Makita is made in Japan ( at least the one I tried back to back with the Kapex was) and looked beatifully made.

So apart from the bits above why did I choose to spend USD 550 more on the Kapex as both cut wood in two accurately and speedily?

Well this probably sounds daft but when I used the Makita it was just that, a saw which cut wood in two. When I used the Kapex I had a grin as wide as the Grand Canyon and felt 'bugger the money' this is the man. It did everything in such a precision way that struck a cord in my heart (and wallet) which is hard to quantify. It just felt right and the laser, the angle guide, the rapid adjustment, the total lack of movement once adjusted and locked, and the beatiful cut softened the blow and USD550 seemed a small price to pay for that feeling you get when you are in the company of a great piece of machinery. Plus the fact that you can build a support table around the saw using Systainer boxes, (same height) is indicative of careful thought and a bloody clever idea to boot.

Plus, once I had totted up the cost of a laser, angle guide and applied Chapter 1 of  "Pats Creative Accounting Techniques to convince the COS that in the long run Festools are cheap."  I managed to reduce the cost differential by USD 120 which I used to take the COS out to Dinner. I sleep soundly at night with a clear conscience. Content that not only do I have a beautiful saw in my shed but I was able to say to the woman of my dreams, "You see my Love, had I bought the Makita we would not have been able to afford to have Dinner in this lovely Restaurant." 

Who said Romance was Dead?

I rest my case M'Lud.

 
Hi Eiji,
I've promised Brice a review of the Kapex and have decided to do a comparison with the LS1214. I want Tezzer to be involved also, due to his experience in esoteric joints. This should be available soon. :)

In the interim, himself (Pat) has given an excellent overview of the Kapex and solid reasons for buying one over a 10" SCMS of any breed, along with a thorough care and feeding guide. I would say that I would have no hesitation moving the LS1214 around, though I now think I have reservations about letting anyone else use either of my SCMS'sss
There is one thing that worries me though about Pat's earlier saw. I seem to recall a movie regarding faults in woodworking tools, with a chapter titled "Bend it like Electra Beckum"

Regards

Rob
 
You Sir are a twisted example of a Scot who has been brainwashed by out-of-the-box thinking and Australian humour . And I love it.  ;D

But it was cruel of you to bring up any association with Englands finest export since the Triumph TR7.

I am gutted that David and Victoria have moved to LA to rob sorry play for the Galaxy. They are now NAIUK and cannot be discussed on this forum.  :'(

Heartbroken
Wales

 
My last saw was a Dewalt Compound miter, no slider, so adjust my opinion accordingly. I loved that saw and thought it was great but probably didn't know any better.

The Kapex (IMO)

-Hold down really kicks ass. Can be operated with one hand quickly and will hold an eight footer straight out so you can shave the end. So fast and easy to be safe.

-The laser is spectacular on both sides of the kerf and mine for one was on the money right out of the box.

-dust collection is pretty great. Not 100 percent, but you could use it inside definitely. I trenched a bunch of 2x4 the other day without the CT22 hooked up and was appalled at the amount of dust on me without extraction. Took me forever to clean it off. Yes, I used baby wipes.

-on that subject, trenching feature. works well. you need to flip the work or use a sacrificial piece to get it all good. but it is super accurate and clean, or fast, your choice. I clean up with a chisel but you don't have to.

-stow and carry is ergonomic. It's not light, but it's lighter than most, and if you grab the drop handle and the handle at the back when it's swiveled, it feels almost as easy to carry as the it is for the 18 yo kid they have carrying it on the box.

cons
-wish it had a plug-it
-I like a horizontal drop handle better. Personal preference.

I'm sure there's more, but if I don't go change a diaper, I'm going to be sleeping with the Kapex for a long time.
 
Hi Eli,
I haven't found it necessary to use a sacrificial piece necessarily, but I'm convinced that with the way the Kapex is designed, placing timber fence blocks against the metal ones is almost a must. The only down side is that you then need to use some other method of holding/guiding the workpiece. I used a piece of 32mm deep red gum to move the workpiece far enough forward to be able to cut a tenon shoulder on 150mm width using one pass. The holddown doesnt reach that far out. Using a roller stand to rest the workpiece on was most statisfactory though. The LS1214 is a little clumsier in this regard.

Regards,

Rob
 
Hey Guys, thank you very much and after those glowing reviews and well thought out comments I can plainly see that I will NEED to buy the Kapex, keep the Makit and dump the wife. :o) Fred PS Truly thank all of you for your insight.
 
Rob McGilp said:
placing timber fence blocks against the metal ones is almost a must

Hey Rob
I didn't use sacrificial pieces the other day, because I did want to use the hold-down. It's just so easy to use. I was making a small ladder for a treehouse, and I almost considered angling the backs of the treads themselves to account for the trench getting shallower at the back. But in the end it was still less work to flip the piece and cut them again from the back. For innocent bystanders, we're talking about maybe 2-3 mm of lost depth at the back, where the curve of the blade prevents cutting clear all the way across.
-e
 
That definitely qualifies as taunting ;D
I have been really, really pleased with the saw. I have no idea how much it cost me anymore.
 
Rob McGilp said:
Fred,
........I'd also say that cutting trenches is like slicing ham off the bone at the deli. Its just soooo easy and clean. All you do is rock the saw back and forth across the timber.  .....

"Trench"="dado" ???

[..always interested in learning more about exotic foreign languages....]
 
I guess so.
More of a wide rebate for another piece of timber to notch into for example in something like a square lattice.

Regards,

Rob
 
Yeah, I'd say a dado would be a longer version of a trench. That's Festool Kapex terminology. I think of dados as being in the field of a panel, whereas like Rob said, a trench would be in lumber. Half lap joints and all that.
 
Greg

I use the trench facility to take out a dado = trench = notch = slot in beams or battens for cable or pipe runs. This English language is mighty confusing!

It is, as Rob and Eli say, very effective at lap joints, and is superb at tenon shoulders.

Pat

 
Dave,

I hate to do this, but guess who's first on Bob's waiting list?!?  Neener, Neener, Neener!!!  (Or is that NAINA, NAINA, NAINA!!!)  ;D

Dan.
 
Back
Top