Milwaukee 12V CXS Copy
- Thread starter SonOfMI
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I used my left hand, wasn't super ideal, but to this point not a big deal at all. But I don't think I really change direction a lot, and haven't but a few times yet. If it would mean a thicker grip I wouldn't want it moved, and I suspect that is how/why they made the call on design.
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Svar said:
Has the LED, bit holder, battery gauge and belt clip. But more importantly, I think this is where they are housing the electronics.
Regarding the fwd/reverse switch, it's not actually as bad as you think. When you're holding the tool "Festool proper" you will note that you can trivially work the button with your thumb. I, too, think it's an oddball decision but it's an awful small thing to get worked up about. That said, I will say that unlike the normal toggle switch you can't see whether the drill in is forward or reverse without either pressing the button or pulling the trigger if you pick it up off your bench.
In all, I like it significantly more than I liked the CXS. Part of that is that it fits my m12 line up. Part of that is that it expects 1/4" shank bits. Part of it is that those bits don't wobble all awful (which I find much more upsetting than the fwd/rev switch but maybe that's my being nuts) like the centrotec ones do.
I've mentioned this before but I think drills are one of the most love em/hate em tools based on the subjective end user's "feel." This is a strong entry from Milwaukee. It's certainly a worthy competitor to the t/cxs and flexiclick. I can't imagine trying to convince someone to use one vs the other if they just like the feel of one more than the other and, in the end, I think that's all a manufacturer can do.
In all, I like it significantly more than I liked the CXS. Part of that is that it fits my m12 line up. Part of that is that it expects 1/4" shank bits. Part of it is that those bits don't wobble all awful (which I find much more upsetting than the fwd/rev switch but maybe that's my being nuts) like the centrotec ones do.
I've mentioned this before but I think drills are one of the most love em/hate em tools based on the subjective end user's "feel." This is a strong entry from Milwaukee. It's certainly a worthy competitor to the t/cxs and flexiclick. I can't imagine trying to convince someone to use one vs the other if they just like the feel of one more than the other and, in the end, I think that's all a manufacturer can do.
I should add that while I really like this drill I have 2 gripes. Both come from my prior Milwaukee experience.
First, the case is just embarrassing. I also happen to have the NAINA Milwaukee M12 drill that has been around for a while. The drill motor on that one pales in comparison to the new offering but the case is great. The folks at Milwaukee that decided to take their normal carry bag and add a ton of poor hook and loop straps and call it good should all quit their jobs or be fired. I know us NA folk often don't get great bags, let alone hard cases, but this is truly a joke. All that said it lives on my bench so I could care less.
The second is that it is designed with the little m12 battery in mind, not the larger. If you buy the kit with batteries you will get 2 of the smaller batteries and it will be balanced perfectly and you won't care. If you're in the habit of using the big batteries, as I am, you will put one in and wonder why on earth they didn't balance it to stand on the big battery as all of the other m12 tools are. Oh wells, I should probably be laying it on it's side anyway because I have tipped a drill over and marred a work piece 10000 times when standing them up but never once when laying it down.
Lastly, and this is just information, the NAINA kit and the new kit have slightly different attachment mechanisms and the attachments aren't interoperable. Clearly that's not important but I figured I'd share that in case anyone was wondering.
First, the case is just embarrassing. I also happen to have the NAINA Milwaukee M12 drill that has been around for a while. The drill motor on that one pales in comparison to the new offering but the case is great. The folks at Milwaukee that decided to take their normal carry bag and add a ton of poor hook and loop straps and call it good should all quit their jobs or be fired. I know us NA folk often don't get great bags, let alone hard cases, but this is truly a joke. All that said it lives on my bench so I could care less.
The second is that it is designed with the little m12 battery in mind, not the larger. If you buy the kit with batteries you will get 2 of the smaller batteries and it will be balanced perfectly and you won't care. If you're in the habit of using the big batteries, as I am, you will put one in and wonder why on earth they didn't balance it to stand on the big battery as all of the other m12 tools are. Oh wells, I should probably be laying it on it's side anyway because I have tipped a drill over and marred a work piece 10000 times when standing them up but never once when laying it down.
Lastly, and this is just information, the NAINA kit and the new kit have slightly different attachment mechanisms and the attachments aren't interoperable. Clearly that's not important but I figured I'd share that in case anyone was wondering.
CarlsonCarpentry
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I was all set to get this drill when it released. But the forward and reverse thing is too much. Some engineer really let that slip by any testers? One a tool we will use daily and frequently no one wants a feature that “takes some getting used to”.
I have 4 drills and 4 Impact drivers lol all with trigger switches. I can’t see being able to retrain my hands for only one tool in the arsenal. Even if you get used to it what about when you switch back to another style drill?
I have 4 drills and 4 Impact drivers lol all with trigger switches. I can’t see being able to retrain my hands for only one tool in the arsenal. Even if you get used to it what about when you switch back to another style drill?
CarlsonCarpentry
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Reed Hoyer said:
Hm not exactly a good comparison. That’s an accessory button. Like if the drill speed button where moved to a different spot. This is more like if the gas and brake where reversed. Of course you can get used to it if you’re driving the same car all day but switching back and forth rapidly is what I mean. Installing a closet door yesterday I was using three drills. If I added a drill to that mix that had unconventional controls it would be a pain.
Michael Kellough
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Over the years I’ve developed a habit of automatically reversing the direction of the drill/screw gun every time I use it. Don’t quite know how that happened.
This tool would probably be the cure.
This tool would probably be the cure.
So, given that my answer to "which drill is best?" is always "whichever one feels best in your hands" I feel silly defending this stupid button but I did come to two conclusions about it last night. One I know to be right and the other someone with a Festool C1# can chime in on if they want.
The first is that not being able to feel whether or not the drill is in forward or reverse the moment you pick up the drill is weird. When you pick up a drill with the standard slide toggle it's trivial to just feel for where that switch is and know if it's in forward or reverse. Maybe Milwaukee could've made the light light up when the drill feels itself being moved (like lots of TV remotes do) but I'm not one to generally ask for more stuff that can break to be added to a tool.
The second is that I feel like the position of this switch might actually be the "right" place for the switch if you hold a C style drill with your middle finger on the trigger as Festool always tells us is proper (at least their ad photos show this). When I bought my c12 and c18 and gave them the good ole college try I had already committed to holding a drill with that hand style. When I returned them I even felt it was more natural to hold my T style m12 tools in this manner. Now that I'm on this C style m12 drill it's the natural way to hold it and my thumb just naturally gets to the top to push the direction button. That said, when I use the middle finger trigger grip it's kind of awkward to slide the standard toggle switch because my index finger is resting above the switch on one side and my thumb is above it on the other. I imagine with a middle finger trigger grip the c12's and c18's toggle switches are much less convenient than if you were holding them with that standard, American, index finger on the trigger grip. I admit that if you use the index finger on the trigger grip then the slide toggle is the obvious solution. Anyway, YMMV, I just don't see it as a stretch for someone to find that location to be a better location for that style of drill.
The first is that not being able to feel whether or not the drill is in forward or reverse the moment you pick up the drill is weird. When you pick up a drill with the standard slide toggle it's trivial to just feel for where that switch is and know if it's in forward or reverse. Maybe Milwaukee could've made the light light up when the drill feels itself being moved (like lots of TV remotes do) but I'm not one to generally ask for more stuff that can break to be added to a tool.
The second is that I feel like the position of this switch might actually be the "right" place for the switch if you hold a C style drill with your middle finger on the trigger as Festool always tells us is proper (at least their ad photos show this). When I bought my c12 and c18 and gave them the good ole college try I had already committed to holding a drill with that hand style. When I returned them I even felt it was more natural to hold my T style m12 tools in this manner. Now that I'm on this C style m12 drill it's the natural way to hold it and my thumb just naturally gets to the top to push the direction button. That said, when I use the middle finger trigger grip it's kind of awkward to slide the standard toggle switch because my index finger is resting above the switch on one side and my thumb is above it on the other. I imagine with a middle finger trigger grip the c12's and c18's toggle switches are much less convenient than if you were holding them with that standard, American, index finger on the trigger grip. I admit that if you use the index finger on the trigger grip then the slide toggle is the obvious solution. Anyway, YMMV, I just don't see it as a stretch for someone to find that location to be a better location for that style of drill.
I got my m12 installation driver last week, it has some serious wobble/runout, particularly with the jacobs chuck. Otherwise the power is there, it feels good in the hand, and having up to 3.0ah compact batteries and 6.0ah xc batteries is nice. I wish the cxs had as much power, as it is the nicer drill imo, but this is close- if you can get one with an acceptably true chuck anyway.
Mike Goetzke
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How does the Bosch Flexiclick stack up to these?
Plus, What is the function of the bar if front of the handle on the Festool & Milwaukee?
Thanks
Plus, What is the function of the bar if front of the handle on the Festool & Milwaukee?
Thanks
Sanderxpander
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My only gripe with the flexiclick is that if you're using to tightening a Jacobs chuck by running the drill and holding the chuck, it's easy to accidentally loosen the entire chuck because it's basically a twist fit.
Other than that I really couldn't be happier with it. I use the off-center chuck more than I thought I would and you can even combine it with the 90 degree chuck.
Other than that I really couldn't be happier with it. I use the off-center chuck more than I thought I would and you can even combine it with the 90 degree chuck.
Love this thing. I don’t seem to have any run out issue with mine. I mean maybe a few thousandths with the hex chuck, but pretty much every drill has that. Hold it with your index finger pointed down the side and the fwd/rev switch is easily accessible. Tons of power for a 12v and the small size batteries last a very long time on this thing. Hung an entire room of drywall and still have over half the battery. Can’t wait to use this to assemble some upcoming wood working projects.
This will also be fantastic around the house with the right angle and offset chucks.
Took me about 10min to “get used to”. Switched back and forth with drills all day and no issue. I have to say after having this drill and being able to hold it with my index finger on the side, which also allows you to hit the button with your thumb, I wish I could hold all my drills like this. It gives far better balance with a fastener to have the force applied directly from the back vs eccentric to the fastener like a traditional drill.
It keeps the drill balanced when setting it upright with the chucks attached. It also has a magnetic strip that is amazingly useful.
This will also be fantastic around the house with the right angle and offset chucks.
CarlsonCarpentry said:
Took me about 10min to “get used to”. Switched back and forth with drills all day and no issue. I have to say after having this drill and being able to hold it with my index finger on the side, which also allows you to hit the button with your thumb, I wish I could hold all my drills like this. It gives far better balance with a fastener to have the force applied directly from the back vs eccentric to the fastener like a traditional drill.
Mike Goetzke said:
It keeps the drill balanced when setting it upright with the chucks attached. It also has a magnetic strip that is amazingly useful.
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