Miter Gauge Angles: Clockwise or Counter-Clockwise?

[smorgasbord]

Assuming you use your miter gauge/sliding table/cross-cut sled on the left of the blade (like on a CSC SYS), which way do your rotate the head for angled cuts, and why?

I most often see a clockwise rotate, so the blade contacts the trailing end of the workpiece, like so:
[attachimg=1]

But, I've heard/read that some people prefer to rotate counter-clockwise so that the leading edge of the workpiece contacts the blade first. One rationale is that this way the cutting action is trying to push the blade into the fence stop so it's not totally up to your hands to stop workpiece sliding during the cut. However, this is apparently not very popular as I had trouble finding images demonstrating it:
[attachimg=2][attachimg=3]

I suspect the main reason for this is that the "normal" clockwise rotation optimizes table support for the stock at the beginning of the cut. That is the rotation moves the stock at the left onto the table before the cut starts, so it feels better. And since many woodworkers have built outfeed table supports, the stock is still supported pretty well after the cut, too.

This guy, however, likes to run his miter gauge backwards even at 90º cuts to optimize stock support (short video):
Miter Gauge Backwards Video

There are even some tablesaw sleds made for cutting angles (Rockler, Woodpeckers, etc.), and they all rotate the stock clockwise:
[attachimg=4]
[attachimg=5]

Now, there are picture frame sleds, and they typically run the stock the other way, perhaps because the frame sides can be long and it'd be weird having them so far in front? Or maybe because they're compensating for not being able to cut an accurate 45º angle by doing the both sides of a right angle thing:
[attachimg=6]

Note that this requires a shorter back fence (nearer the operator) so that the stock doesn't hit it. But, on the Woodpeckers/Rockler angle sleds, there is no back fence so they could have just as easily set up the pivot the other way.

I'm redoing my angle cross-cut sled yet again (this will be the third iteration). My two prior versions all rotate the "normal" way, but as I was laying out my design, I realized I could add a pivot point at the top right to accommodate rotating stock counter-clockwise. Is this something worth doing - to have the option? Or am I just complicating things unnecessarily?

 

[usernumber1]

i think you are overthinking this. there's less support on the table of the saw in the "pointy end up"

also if you've ever cut aluminum profiles you would never want to push it to the blade like that. I'm getting tense just looking at that picture.

 

[smorgasbord]

i think you are overthinking this. there's less support on the table of the saw in the "pointy end up"

Overthinking is what I do best. And often, of course.  [blink]

But, yeah, like I said "optimizes table support for the stock at the beginning of the cut." The trade-off being support at the end of the cut, and most saws have more support in front than in back of the blade, but again, like I said, some/many have outfeed tables added.

also if you've ever cut aluminum profiles you would never want to push it to the blade like that. I'm getting tense just looking at that picture.

Tell me more, please. I think most of us have experienced stock sliding on a miter gauge when cutting at an angle. I would think the "pointy end up" with a stop would prevent that.

One more question - does anyone here run their miter gauge on the right side of the blade?

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I do it the same as I do with a miter saw, cutting toward the long point of the piece. This is mostly because of the grain direction of the timber itself. You are cutting with it, rather than against. You will get far less tear-out and a smoother feeling cut.
I see it as similar to a router bit cutting "down hill" versus " up hill". You know, like routing a radius edge, where you start the bit on the long grain and go around the corner to the end grain.
The example of petting a cat always comes to mind. Start at the front and smooth it down....going the other way ends badly, with the wood or the cat  [big grin]

The disadvantage is the tendency for the saw to pull the piece with it. The greater the angle, the worse this becomes, but it is mostly a dull blade problem. A good sharp blade doesn't do this or at least, it is minimized.

 

[jeffinsgf]

One more question - does anyone here run their miter gauge on the right side of the blade?

I have an old European table saw (KITY K5) where the miter gauge is somewhat optimized to be used on the right side of the saw. I like it a lot, and use that saw and its factory miter gauge any time I am cutting 45-degree miters.

 

[smorgasbord]

This is mostly because of the grain direction of the timber itself. You are cutting with it, rather than against. You will get far less tear-out and a smoother feeling cut.

I hadn't thought of that, but makes sense as the cross-cut becomes somewhat of a rip cut.

 

[smorgasbord]

Looks like I posted a couple days too soon. Andrew Klein just released a new video where he's using his miter gauge "pointy end first":



[attachimg=1]

 

[Crazyraceguy]

That ^^^ looks like one of those "DON'T DO THIS" type warnings. Even if I was going to cut long end first, I would want a whole lot more backing board on the miter gauge. If that would snag, the whole mess comes right back toward you.....at a high rate of speed. Who knows what happens to your fingers, when it rips out of there.

I'm not that against cutting long point first, just not unsupported, like that.  [eek]

 

[smorgasbord]

That ^^^ looks like one of those "DON'T DO THIS" type warnings.

Yeah, I was pretty scared watching the video, too. He obviously takes the cuts slow and has a sharp blade, but still with stock that thin your point about having at least a longer fence to support the work is the least of what I'd do if I were to do that.

 

[PaulMarcel]

You'd have to move slowly just to kill the vibration. Makes for great glass-smooth cuts /s