Miter Saw selection

[iamnothim]

I purchased and have watched almost all the programs in the Gary Katz "Mastering Finish Carpentry" series.  Hours worth.  They are great.  In the series Gary uses Festool track saws, CXS, and Domino.  However his miter saws are Bosch.  Now I realize both companies are most likely providing the tools.  He mostly uses the 12" Bosch compound saw.  This is the predecessor to the Bosch GCM12SD  ($750).

After watching him use that saw on many different materials and trim situations, I can't rationalize paying an additional $650 for the Kapex KS 120.  The new Bosch saw looks even better and I'll have money to buy a Fastcap Best Fence rig.  BTW: anybody using it?

Unless a new Festool Kapex is coming soon I'm strongly leaning towards the Bosch GCM12SD.

 

[Mickfb]

I was in the same position as you a month ago. I was looking at the Bosch mitre saws. What made me choose the Kapex is the dust extraction, I only have a small workshop so a little dust goes a long way! For me that justifed the extra money. I am very pleased with the Kapex.
Mick

 

[iamnothim]

I was in the same position as you a month ago. I was looking at the Bosch mitre saws. What made me choose the Kapex is the dust extraction, I only have a small workshop so a little dust goes a long way! For me that justifed the extra money. I am very pleased with the Kapex.
Mick

Mick,
Good info.
I also have my eye on the Fastcap "Saw Hood"  It was also in the GK videos.  Although it's open vs using a sealed Festool CT vacuum system, it will A) save me from buying a lot of bags B) catch any chunks that fly off the saw.

As a retiree, I'm looking for the optimum kit for my needs.

 

[Stone Message]

You will find dozens of posts from me going back 3 years where I describe how I ended up with the Kapex 120. I spent about 8 weeks doing market research, agonising over this or that saw and at a time when there were new offerings from the other major players.

In the end I chose the Kapex, which was then full price before any discounts were allowed, and I have not regretted it for one minute.

The reasons - dust collection, wide angle range, accuracy, repeatability, ease of maintenance, great 3 year guarantee, safety, instant advice available at any time from the FOG and it is such a super saw to use.

The term "no brainer" was invented just for people making their minds up to buy a Kapex.

Peter

 

[mastercabman]

Also keep in mind that the kapex is lighter
So if you work on site it is much more easier to carry the saw
But the Bosch does a good job too

 

[shed9]

I was in a similar situation recently deciding between the Kapex and the Bosch.

The deciding factor towards the Kapex was that of superior dust collection, finish of cut, accuracy and blade deflection (or lack of).

That said, I've known people to buy the Kapex to return it to get the Bosch and I have to say I very nearly did this myself in the first few days. However, after using the saw for a few days, I saw and noticed the reason why, as Peter says, it's a no brainer.

I think you will get a lot more for your money if you get the Bosch and the fast cap fence but the bottom line is you will actually get less mitre saw for your money - if that makes sense.

 

[Ant]

I am in this situation right now, my old Elektra saw has served me well for the last ten years & for the past month have been looking for a replacement. I am erring towards the kapex & stand but keep looking at the Bosch glide. I'm going to w14 tomorrow at the nec to have a good look at them, I just hope it will help me make a decision rather than confuse the issue! Shed9 why did you nearly swap the kapex for the bosch? & what was the reason you kept the kapex?

 

[Throwback7r]

Also keep in mind that the kapex is lighter
So if you work on site it is much more easier to carry the saw
But the Bosch does a good job too

Right there, The weight! Also, the UG Cart and wings are really nice for onsite stuff. They take up less space as well.

 

[iamnothim]

Hmmmm    I Just Read This...

EDIT:  Weight is not a concern.  In fact I want it heavy.

 

[stvrowe]

I am a new Kapex owner (

 

[Dunn wood]

I have owned a Kapex for about 5 years now, one of the best decisions I made. Kapex will cut with a 10" blade that others need a 12" for. I still own a 12" saw with a expensive blade on it and in my experience the best 12" blade will still deflect as you are cutting. The 10" Kapex does not. I install kitchens and put up a lot of crown and with the Kapex the cuts are perfect.

 

[shed9]

Shed9 why did you nearly swap the kapex for the bosch? & what was the reason you kept the kapex?

Honestly, I was expecting something more rugged and felt at the time that the price tag did not match the machine. The saw I had been using up until delivery of the Kapex was a fairly old DeWalt slider and that thing is built like a tank, whereas I felt the Kapex was not. After using the Kapex though I kind of realised I'd rather have an accurate fairly dust free machine than a tank that spits sawdust over a two metre radius and gives way too much deflection of the blade.

 

[Just F Me]

I read a post about a member here (ScottGrimmRestoration) before that was not happy with his Kapex.  He says that the dust collection wasn't as good as they say it is.  He says he prefers his Dewalt DWS780.  This was the first time I've ever read something like this. 

I think like all things Festool, you have to play with it and learn it, then you'll have that eureka moment where "I should have bought this sooner"

 

[Worm Drive]

The dust collection on the Kapex wasn't quite as good as I was hoping it would be. Certain cuts, such as a sliding cut or using a zero clearance fence, don't collect the dust quite as well. I haven't tried a shorter hose yet, some swear it makes a big difference. Still my CT gets the majority of the dust. Occasionally I will make a cut without the vac hooked up, just for a comparison and realize how much it does capture.

In the past twenty some years, I've used many different scm saws.Coupled with a Tenryu 80 tooth blade, zero clearance insert and fence, the Kapex is hands downs, the best saw I've used for doing trim and woodworking. The accuracy and quality of the cut awesome. The bevel adjustment is the best on the market. Add the dual, adjustable  lasers and dust collection and this saw is hard to beat. The Bosch 10" glide was my second choice. After watching lots of videos and reading about both, I went with the Kapex and have no regrets.If I was going to be mainly doing framing, I would probably have gotten something cheaper and with a little more power.

 

[iamnothim]

This is very good feedback.  Naturally on a Festool forum the members will like the saw that they purchase.  Still there are a lot of pros here that depend on an accurate durable saw for their reputation.

I on the other hand am a retired guy that makes sawdust.  No matter what saw one buys after a decent stand and rails were are talking significant dollars.  That said, accuracy is paramount to me.  Errors drive me nuts.  My last project was remodeling my laundry room.  I posted a thread highlighting my mistakes.

I had one compound miter to make a shelf.  The joints fit tight in the test fit but I put in more dominos during glue up.  I panicked, couldn't figure it out and left the joint with a gap. Lesson learned.    I'm bringing this up because I made the compound cuts on my MFT/3 with the guide rail.

I am about to panel my daughters room in the same style.  It will have a lot more trim.  3 1/2" stiles and rails surrounding 4" bead board with a small "Z" panel molding trim.  New base, new crown, case the sliding closet doors.

Square room except for one small corner angle wall  (arghhhh!)

Here's my question.  Since I'm not ready to pay for a Kapex, I think I'm just going to use the MFT/3 and the TS 55REQ.  I watched all of Gary Katz videos including Conquering Crown.  I picked up the Bosch Angle finder demonstrated on the video and I'm thinking I'll just cut the crown on the flat as Gary showed and cope one end.  I've been practicing my hand coping and yesterday the Collins Coping Foot for my Carvex arrived.

Any thoughts on this approach?  It's supposed to work... right?

Here's a couple of pics from the laundry room thread....
Thanks guys

Luke

[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]

 

[wow]

FWIW, my Costco has the Bosch GCM12SD for $699.

 

[iamnothim]

I  started a thread under "Member Projects" to document my attempt to install bead board panels, case, base and crown in my daughters room making all the cuts using only the MFT/3 and TS55 REQ exclusively.  My fallback is a single bevel Hitachi 12” miter saw.

 

[P2P]

Back to one of your original questions - I have the Best Fence from Fastcap and love it.  I originally used it with my Hitachi saw, but that was replaced this year with a Kapex.  Great combination.  I posted a picture of my rig in another thread a few months back but don't have time to look for it at the moment.  I think it was a thread on the Best Fence system IIRC.

 

[iamnothim]

I thought so.
The Best Fence looks Awesome on the Fastcap web site.

 

[Wonderwino]

I've got an older Bosch 5412L and also have the Kapex which I bought on the brink of the price increase last spring.  The 5412 on the T3B stand weighs about 115# and is not easy to move.  The Kapex on the UG stand is MUCH lighter.  I had the Fastcap saw hood for the Bosch and it was only marginally effective.  I ended up adding a "skirt" to the back of the Bosch blade guard, which with a Festool CT-33, collected about 90% of the dust, including most of the fines that usually float around for a few days.  The Kapex dust collection is much better, right out of the box.  I'm on the fence about selling the Bosch, as I will use it mostly for framing cuts.  The Kapex is the better finish saw, for quality of cut and accuracy.

Luke, I feel your pain about the separated domino joint.  There is a solution: Cut the joint apart with a thin-kerf Japanese saw, flushing the faces with a hand plane or sanding block.  Re-cut the domino joints, shorten the domino and reassemble.  No one will ever know.... [wink]