New DTS 400 REQ Plus purchase - Disappointing

[grbmds]

Thanks for the responses. After sleeping on it,  I've decided to return the sander. I don't know what Festool's intentions are here, but life's too short for me to sort it out. It's a shame, because my Domino XL is one of my favorite tools. It's amazing. Oh well...

There are tools that Festool makes that are unmatched by tools from any other manufacturer. The Domino is one of those. Then, there are Festools that, while good quality tools, just don't seem to be worth the price as they aren't any better than another tool on the market. At least, right now, in the US, we have enough choices and Festool allows return within 30 days, that we can determine which tools are worth it.

 

[Debug]

I got the new DTS 400 and am happy with it, but did think it came with a dust bag.  The website I ordered from said it did (won't mention who the dealer was, so I don't light any fires).  What it looks like happened in the US is that several dealers lazily cut and paste the description from the old DTS 400 model to the new one (the old one included a cheap dust bag), which did lead to some confusion.  Almost wish they named it the DTS 410, probably would have helped. 

I did send a note to the dealer telling them that the dust bag was omitted from my systainer (since I thought it was included).  I just got a response that said "Thank you for pointing out the error on our website.".  No apology for the mistake or anything.  I wasn't sending a note to tell them about an error.  I did send them another note about it and was told I had to buy it and that they were sorry that their prior note to me misunderstood what I was saying.  They thought I was reporting a website error.  Found that a little silly that they would think I was saying "hey, the bag was missing, your website must be incorrect."  I didn't even know it was a mistake and just wanted something that the website said I was supposed to get.  Within moments, the website was corrected.  Oh well.

 

[jimbo51]

Festool is at risk of being penny wise and pound foolish by decreasing the scope of delivery to hold down price and maintain profit margins.

The safety argument does not make sense if a person needs to use the product very soon and Festool does not supply a dust bag. Festool prices are so far above most competition that increasing the price to include a proper dust bag would seem to make sense. Some market survey told them that pricing above x would be an issue and cost them sales. Well, the current nonsense also costs them sales.

That being said, in the US at least, can't these relatively low cost types of purchases can be expensed if the person's taxes are set up properly? If a Festool sander provides any level of better performance or even satisfaction in use, the small difference is cost after tax considerations can easily be justified I would think.

 

[HarveyWildes]

By packaging separately, Festool has also incurred additional packaging (plastic, printing), stocking (additional warehouse space) and shipping costs.  Also, they can't lowball the bag as an accessory without devaluing the cloth bags for the vacuums.  So I think the price is not surprising, given Festool's overall pricing approach.  Putting it in the box with the sanders would have saved the extra expenses and avoided devaluing the vacuum bags.  Given the fact that the new sanders have hopped up specs, they could have charged everyone $20 more for the sander with the bag in the box and probably made more money on it in the long run.  Instead, you only need to pay the bag penalty if you are going to use the sander with a bag.

Most of the time I use my sander with a vacuum, and don't need the bag.  That said, occasionally I take my sander where it would be awkward to take my vacuum, so I went ahead and bought the bag.

 

[antss]

Peter and Tyler  - you seem to be saying that Festool's lawyers are somehow better reader of the tea leaves with respect to RRP than all of the big players I mentioned that also sell sanders here - with dust bags included.  Or, maybe you're saying they aren't as good and are recommending playing it safe because they can't figure out or quantify the risk ? 

That's not a dig, it's just difficult to know what you're really trying to say.

Perhaps you can explain how not shipping the bag with the sander shields FT's exposure if the bag itself is a conduit for risk with respect to RRP ?  Does the bag come with a disclaimer in the retail packaging ?  I just cannot see how charging xtra for it eliminates exposure.

Tyler - I understand corp. risk mgmt. decisions, but when you mentioned the price differential of the package without the bag ; it sure seems like this was not a just risk / RRP decision, but a marketing one as well.

 

[Teakdust]

So, just to put this posting to rest. I took the DTS 400 REQ to my shop to try it. I had a 7” wide board of 5/4 black walnut that was left over from a job. It still had a face that was rough sawn from the mill. Just as an experiment, I slapped the one included piece of P120 Granat paper on, connected it to my  central cyclonic collecter for hand tools and went at the rough surface. I was surprised at how quickly I was able to level the surface given it was P120 and an orbital sander with only a 2mm stroke.  Impressed by the results, I grabbed one of the sheets of P220 Granat from the box I’d bought with the sander. I’d never normally jump that many grits, but it was what I had on hand. The DTS 400 REQ was even smoother handling with the finer paper than it had been with the P120. I did a few cross grain strokes. Then several overlapping passes with the grain. I ran my hand over the surface and was surprised by how little residual dust remained. It was silky smooth as well. I grabbed some BLO and saturated the wood. After a good long soak, I wiped it off. With a really bright LED flashlight, I shined a beam across the surface at the lowest angle possible. I’ve found this to be a good way to test for swirls and finishing flaws. I was unable to find a single problem. Which is especially impressive on a darker wood like walnut which tends to show scratches more than a lighter species.  I had a few of the guys in the shop run their hands over the surface. Every one of them smiled when the felt the result. One of them asked if I had sanded it to 800 grit or higher. He was shocked when I said P220. Well now there is no way I can return this thing. It just works too well. I’ll just get ahold of the bag down the road. 

Kevin Reed - Annapolis Harbor Boatyard