New Fein 2015 models

[pingvinlakrits]

Yetihunter: have been absent for a while - busy with work - but saw your reply just now.

As it happens all three drills are under the same roof at the moment as I just got back from a project so I will take som photos tomorrow and post them. It will be about mid day my time, so about eighteen hours from this posting - whatever your time zone might be.  [smile]

I brought the ASCM 12 C on a large decking build up on a roof together with the impact. The impact is very basic, a good enough machine but very loud. We used it very sparingly... ...it turned out the ASCM 12 C was plenty strong and my colleague was very impressed. He really liked it. He thought it was as powerful as his 18V Panasonic (a few years old) and then he realised he was running the Fein in 2nd gear [eek] and hadn't even tried 1st gear. And then he was told it was a 12V machine with four speeds.

The drill was a pleasure to work with both driving small screws and larger ones - no problem at all and very agile.

The only small gripe is that you run through batteries rapidly driving 6x90mm screws (no pilot holes) - but to be fair we were running those screws non stop for a few hours so maybe not so surprising. I had three 2,5Ah batteries and the one in the charger was always ready to go before the second one ran flat and there was one to spare.

Superb little unit. I missed the opportunity yesterday to meet up with the Fein rep at a store event - I would have liked to know if he had any info on the two things I am waiting for: the right angle chuck and a larger battery. Considering how light the small battery is and the overall ergonomics I would have no problem with a 5Ah battery at twice the weight of the 2,5Ah battery as the 2,5Ah battery weighs next to nothing. 

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Comments on the machines CXS vs Fein ASCM12C and T18 vs ASCM12C:

As you can see the CXS is easily the smallest and it is also the lightest. It has the best belt clip. AFAIK it is the best belt clip on the market unless you jam it down the backside and squat down where the tongue can get too close for comfort. But the Fein is the shortest in head length with chuck removed.

Drawback for the CXS is the limited power compared to the Fein. The difference is not small, the Fein is simply put a much stronger machine and has four speeds - all of them usable. In gear two the Fein is a lot stronger than the CXS in gear one. For drilling the Fein is a clearly better machine. Chuck is better, speeds are better. For fine driving the Fein is more tactile than the CXS. The only thing the CXS has over the Fein is the compact form factor and belt clip.
Batterywise they are somewhat equally capable with a slight nod to the Fein for being brushless and more forgiving with larger screws.

The CXS with the Fein power and speed would be a carpenters dream machine. The CXS is one of those drills that I can't be without - despite lack of power and not being brushless. But if I didn't have any of the two and was in the market for one small-ish drill/driver I would choose the Fein. The right angle chuck hasn't hit the market yet but it will surface when the new 18V line is hitting the shelves as the chucks are compatible - a few specialty chucks will and have hit the market for the ASCM12C. 

Powerwise it is hard to tell but the Fein ASCM 12 C is rated at 40NM torque and feels as strong as the T18. After using it for decking I would say it does not cut off as early as the T18 so it feels stronger in actual use.  [eek]

The Fein ASCM12C isn't all that much smaller than the T18 but it is a little smaller, lighter and handles better than the T18 which isn't a small feat as the T18 is a brilliant drill. For gentle driving I would say they are equal - very smooth.
For power they are equal. Though I haven't run them the same way I do think the T18 with the 3,1Ah would last longer than the Fein ASCM12C when driving larger screws. Even with the older 2,6Ah Festool battery I think the T18 would come out on top.

The Fein battery is extremely light and very small so a 5Ah battery, twice the weight and larger would be hardly noticeable on the drill in use. I hope they will release a 4/5Ah battery as it will definitely help with run time - the drill does so well that it just breezes through for the most part. For finer drilling I think the Fein has the edge with more speed for smaller drill bits and a very high quality metal chuck. Festool of course has the Centrotec system. I find that the bitholder on the Fein seats the Centrotec drill bits very securely but not deep seated as on Centrotec. In tight spaces (furniture/cabinetry) this gives Festool the edge of course.

Festool of course has the 18V line going for the T18 and Fein has only a few tools in 12V: four are varieties of drills
and the last one is the Fein MultiTalent multicutter. 

It is very easy to recommend the Fein ASCM12C to everyone interested in a compact and high performance drill. It is on par with the T18 and is very compact and oozes quality in fit, feel and use. For people that would like only ONE drill/driver - the Fein drill could very well be "it".  It doesn't really fit in my arsenal since I run Festool in the workshop and Mafell/Metabo in the field but the Fein is so good it is a keeper too... ...and I find I am happy to reach for it as often as I can. I wasn't expecting it to do as well as it did in the field with larger screws and decking but it is really impressive.

 

[Tinker]

A great review and comparrisons Henrik.
Tinker

 

[yetihunter]

[member=2085]Henrik R / Pingvinlakrits[/member]

Thank you!
I was not expecting such an excellent in-depth comparison.
My wallet is crying, as you have me interested in buying yet another drill.

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Hello Tinker - I hope all is well with you!

Yetihunter: no worries.

Drawbacks: The Fein drill is "yet another" battery platform if you have a widespread variety of tools.
It is however one of those drills that definitely grow on you the more you use it.

When the right angle unit arrives I can see myself bringing just the Fein drill instead of bringing _both_ the CXS and the T18. The Impact tags along in the same SYS. And if you consider that the CXS and T18 are not battery compatible and have different chargers the Fein ASCM12C does save both space and weight and hassle on the job site. Also, Festool does not have an Impact (the old Ti15 does not count ).

The thing that the CXS has going for it is the agility and size but in terms of performance and delivery of performance the Fein ASCM12C is truly top notch.

The siblings of the ASCM12C (I don't have all the acronyms in memory) are different.
The ASCM12C is a silent drill, it does not make that "beepy" sound when you run the motor and it feels great.

The compact bit chuck Fein (no drill chuck) is a decent machine but it feels a lot more plasticky and has that cheapo beepy sound in action.  It does not rev the motor very high and it is a brushed motor. The fixed drill chuck Fein is the same machine and would feel the same although both the bit holder on the compact Fein and the drill chuck on the regular drill Fein are good quality.

The Fein Impact is a pretty decent machine and considering the price w/o battery charger I find it a good addition to the kit. It is a bit loud but it feels decent in use. It is a brushed machine but has good eonugh power for a small unit.
I have only used it occasionally - I have nothing bad to say about it. It is a just one of those "ok" machines that most other manufacturers make. It is a keeper for those times that an impact is handy to have. For me, not so often but it takes up very little space and it does the job.

The MultiTalent I was hoping would be a keeper as it too would fit in a single sys with the Fein ASCM12C and with three-four batteries, the charger and the ALED light. I forgot to mention the little LED battery light. It is handy and, again, takes up very little space and is nice to have around.

The light and the ASCM12C is a great combo. In tight spaces I just leave the ALED light on. The Fein drill LED is "ok" but not that powerful and I usually prefer constant light over drill lights except for quick jobs.

The MultiTalent feels (to me) a bit underpowered though it does the job. It is however quite a rattler. The old Supercut (and the Vecturo) are both more powerful and less strainous in use. The MultiTalent vibrates quite a lot. That and being underpowered made me choose to sell it instead of thinking it too would fit in a SYS with the rest of the Fein gear. I have a Metabo 18V multicutter which is decent compared to the Supercut and does the job a lot better than the Multitalent both for power and vibration.  If you don't have any multicutter and only have limited use for one then the MultiTalent is an "ok" machine. I am spoiled by my Supercuts performance so I am not that impressed though.

The recent MultiMaster machines seem to be significantly vibration reduced I have heard but I have only tried a "dry run" with them. They seem very nice and that is why I ordered the MultiTalent unseen. I was a little underwhelmed by it. I don't use multicutters as much as I used to due to a slight shift in profession but they are still an essential part of my kit.

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Edited the above post with some conclusions on the versatility of the kit.

In hindsight I have arrived to the conclusion that I am still a gear head and probably always will be.  [big grin]

The only "regret" that I have is that I repurchased a T18 recently. Considering the T18 and the BHC18 are currently the only Festool 18V machines I have, I could very well do without them.  Great drills, for sure, but I have an even better drill in my Mafell A18m bl and the Mafell is compatible with my other Mafell and Metabo 18V gear which now encompasses all my sawing and drilling needs on the job site.

Sometimes it takes a full circle to arrive at a conclusion. For me it takes up to two full laps and a relapse.  [big grin]

 

[yetihunter]

You also have the 18V Mafell?  I am so Jelly.

 

[pingvinlakrits]

...you should be - it is a superb machine.

VERY powerful so pretty much everything large is driven - easily - in second gear and the impuls function is great to have too. I have been swinging it all week building decks with the 3,1LiHD batteries. I have a Metabo impact but only needed to pull it out when my colleague snatched the Mafell. The Impact is great for those moments where wrist torque is a risk though. Great combo.

 

[yetihunter]

North American dudes on the Mafell Users Forum seem satisfied with the Metabo branded version it's built upon.
I'm all like, "nah, man, it ain't red."

I've got a feeling it's also improved in many other areas.

Alas, I'm completely satisfied with my T18 and PDC.  Every time I get drill envy (Fein, Mafell, Metabo),
I remember that I'm the one guy that loooooves the electronic clutch. 

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Metabo vs Mafell drill? I can answer that with personal experience. The differences is that Mafell has tweaked the motor, through programming the electronically controlled torque curve as I understand it. One difference in favor of Mafell is that the Metabo drill makes a droning beepy sound when driving screws, same as say many other drills do.

The Mafell drill is silent. I don't know how they did that but it is very welcome. Driving screws inside a cabinet that droning beepy motor sound isn't very nice. The Panasonic drills are even worse. Hate that sound.

It has a different belt clip which I find better. In use they feel the same though. There is otherwise no quality difference.

As for batteries the Mafell ships with the older 5,2Ah batteries. They are very good batteries. The new Metabo 5,5 LiHD batteries are even better so I have replaced most of my 5,2Ah batteries.

My understanding is that from later on this year Mafell saws and drills will ship with LiHD batteries. I replaced my Mafell KSS 40M batteries with the 5,5LiHD batteries from Metabo.

I only use Metabo 3,1 LiHD batteries for the Mafell drill, Metabo hammer drill, jigsaw and Multicutter. They are super and very lightweight. The Metabo sticker in front peels right off and the color scheme is black and red so actually looks perfect on the Mafell drill. 

 

[Tinker]

[member=2085]Henrik R / Pingvinlakrits[/member]
Henrik,
I was just reviewing some of the rpies to this thread.  Way back in Reply #41, you showed pics of three drills including the CXS. I have the CXS with all of the  hucks including the offset. With carpel tunnel problems I find that chuck is easier for me to use than the angle chuck in most situations where the choice to save space is needed. does the Fin drill have an offset chuck such as Festoy.

I also have an old CD 12 Festoy with all of the chucks. The straight chuck will fit on my CXS but the angle and offset do not.
Tinker

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Tinker; I am not sure I follow you. The CXS does not have an off set chuck. Do you mean the right angle chuck - especially since you mention working in limited space.

If so, Fein is due to release that right angle chuck this summer.

There is not one available at the moment but the Fein rep has been showing the sales rep pictures of the right angle chuck and has confirmed it. Fein will freshen up their 18V line up this year with new machines and new specialty chucks. All chucks will be compatible with the 12V Fein. 

I think in one or two weeks time there will be more info as there seems to be a large trade fair in Germany and both the info on the new chucks and the new line up has been floating around some time.

I did get the new bit chuck, the 1/2" chuck and the Fein 12V drill chuck is the new fit and style too. For people working metal there is a tap chuck that seems very nice too and there is a tapping kit available for the Fein 12V and presumably the new 18V line up.

According to the sales rep the right angle chuck seems really solid.
Things are looking good.

As an update we are mid way through a large deck build and the Fein ASCM12C gets very high praise from my colleague. The little Fein Impact does a good job too. The 2,5Ah batteries are zipped through two to three in a day in continuous use but they charge faster than we deplete them so with the three batteries and one/two drills in action there is always one fresh off the charger to grab.

I would really like a 5Ah battery though. The 2,5Ah weighs like a mock up / toy so a battery twice the size and weight would still be a very small and light weight battery so I hope they will have one soon. It would not compromise the ergonomics on this little beauty. 

 

[pingvinlakrits]

Fein has now officially announced the new 18V line up and they seem to start shipping in July this year.

There are some very interesting options, including multivoltage machines that run on both the 12V and 18V battery.

I started a thread on this topic in the same sub forum.