New Kapex Purchase Concerns

[hemlock]

Did you ask Festool about the oil and and other concerns you had?  Did they feel it was OK/normal or a problem?

I called Festool- they basically said that at this point I would have to deal with Hartville...  The person I spoke with said that when Festool sends out a Kapex to a dealer it is double boxed and they agreed shipping a Kapex cross country in the single box is really not appropriate.

So I called Hartville about the shipping issue.  They said that they bought hundreds of these 'discontinued' models, and since it was such a large order they were shipped to them on pallets instead of individual boxes like the person from Festool mentioned.  So they are just sending them out in the single box.

I am going to think about it for a day, but I will probably order another one.  They suggested I add a comment about the shipping situation and they would 'try' to do something about double boxing it or something

 

[pettyconstruction]

Tool nut has always had very good packaging and shipping for me,
maybe try them.
I don’t know if they are cutting the price like that ,but they may.
Good luck,Charlie

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[PeppaPig]

I have used ToolNut quite a bit also - but they are further away and they don't have the sale

hemlock - I don't think I was speaking with one of their actual 'technicians' but the person did agree that it was a problem and since I only had the saw for a couple of days, it would be best for me to just return it to Hartville

 

[FestitaMakool]

My 2019 REB had severe smudge of grey “exhaust” all over the back side of the saw.
I did wonder about this, as it was something I have never seen before. It was factory new, and not very clean..  [eek]. I guessed that the brushes was run in at the last production stage, which, if this is right, is a good thing. But a light clean before I was wrapped wouldn’t hurt.
It seems like, by the answers here, that Festool do run in these motors.

 

[hemlock]

Not to discount your concern, as Peter said and I agree, you need to feel good about your purchase; but maybe this will make you feel a bit better.  Here is a picture of how mine arrived which resulted in damage to the saw. Not one piece of packing foam was intact.  Yours looks pristine by comparison.  [smile]

 

[PeppaPig]

WOW

If I saw that,  I wouldn't even bother taking it out of the box.  It definitely would be going back (no brainer).  Was that from Hartville?

It's interesting - in the second part of the  Festool "Kapex Packing Instructions" video, they show a plastic crate being used and the Kapex gets strapped down inside of it along with Styrofoam inserts on top
=208

[attachimg=1]

 

[yangwoodworking]

I too ordered it from the same store. I also saw oil on the motor case but not that much. Your base is actually much flat than mine. Mine can easily put two utility knife blades under the straight edge! I do not even bother to measure the thickness.[attachimg=1]

 

[ChuckM]

[eek] [scared] [huh] [huh] [huh]

That's all I can say...as a Kapex owner for some 4 years with a dead flat table & square fence (as shown in photos shared in an old post).

 

[eeeesh]

^^^ This

Make sure the black blade insert is not sticking up from the center table causing a high point, but if it isn't, I wouldn't find that acceptable on a $300 saw let along a $1,500 one

Is there actually a spec for an acceptable tolerance regarding how flat the table and the wings are?

 

[yangwoodworking]

Absolutely, that was the first thing I ensured.

 

[hemlock]

I can't help but wonder if the poor packing, in a single box, shipped via ground; where its transferred multiple times to other trucks (and likely dropped, etc) isn't part of this problem .  The one I tried via mail order had alignment and other issues; the one I picked up at a retail location was in a crisp new box with foam intact and the unit is spot on in every way and rock solid.

 

[PeppaPig]

I shipped the one back yesterday and ordered another one today from Hartville.  In the comments I asked them if they could double box it and I got an email back stating

We have asked our management if there is anything additional we can do at this time to add packaging to the box and we were told that we are not.

If you go through with the order it would be shipped exactly as before.

If this is not acceptable, please feel free to cancel the order.


I also sent them the pic of your damaged Kapex and they replied:

Fortunately, the horror stories are actually quite small compared to the hundreds of saws we've shipped with no incident whatsoever. 

Accidents can happen anywhere, but we do suspect that some region's delivery personnel are more careless (to put it mildly) in some areas than others

So we shall see...  (fingers crossed)  I also called the 'legendary' Festool Service Center to ask about some tolerances, but nobody has called me back yet

 

[hemlock]

I had a similar discussion with Hartville when I was deciding what I was going to do. I have no issue with Hartville. I've purchased from them for years, and will continue to do so. They handled my Kapex issue very professionally.  The problem for me remains the combination of Festool's poor packing of this saw (the box for my new midi extractor was stouter/better) combined with the rugged handling it gets with the multiple stops and the loads and unloads onto trucks that it goes through en route to me. I just saw no reason why a new saw packed the same way, and sent the same way, would get here in better shape the second time. I just didn't want take the risk. So I sent the damaged one back for a refund and purchased one locally at a similar price. Hartville is probably right that the horror stories are rare (remember your packing looked very pristine except for the dented box as I recall) and it sure sounds like they are selling a lot of them.  I hope it all works out for you.

Try the supplemental manual for the saw if you haven't seen it.  Its downloadable on the festoolusa site.  It includes some tolerances for cut accuracy.  I don't know if it has table and fence tolerances in it too. 

I shipped the one back yesterday and ordered another one today from Hartville.  In the comments I asked them if they could double box it and I got an email back stating

We have asked our management if there is anything additional we can do at this time to add packaging to the box and we were told that we are not.

If you go through with the order it would be shipped exactly as before.

If this is not acceptable, please feel free to cancel the order.


I also sent them the pic of your damaged Kapex and they replied:

Fortunately, the horror stories are actually quite small compared to the hundreds of saws we've shipped with no incident whatsoever. 

Accidents can happen anywhere, but we do suspect that some region's delivery personnel are more careless (to put it mildly) in some areas than others

So we shall see...  (fingers crossed)  I also called the 'legendary' Festool Service Center to ask about some tolerances, but nobody has called me back yet

 

[HiCal]

Hi new guy here.

I just took advantage of Hartville's deal on the older Kapex with updated motor for $1106. and it arrived in perfect condition. Box was in good shape and the saw is very well adjusted as it came. I did adjust the LASER's. Very happy with this purchase! So I'm sure most of them arrive in good shape.

That all being said I think many retailers order products in bulk and are shipped in bulk on pallets from the manufacturers. The problem is that the dealers then just take the boxes and ship them as they come when they were not intended to be shipped in those boxes. They should be double boxed for shipping to customers. The same thing is often done with TV's, they come on pallets and some online retailers just ship them as is even though those boxes are not designed for direct shipping. And many are broken as a result.

Good luck!

 

[Cheese]

"Fortunately, the horror stories are actually quite small compared to the hundreds of saws we've shipped with no incident whatsoever. 
Accidents can happen anywhere, but we do suspect that some region's delivery personnel are more careless (to put it mildly) in some areas than others."

That's funny... [big grin] [big grin]...just change a few words around and it sounds almost verbatim like the same statements Festool management made when they were queried about the Kapex motor issues.

There's something in the Kapex DNA that just attracts statements like these to be made.

 

[yangwoodworking]

Thanks for the info. Congratulations!

For the record, my shipping box was damaged as well. [attachimg=1]

 

[ChuckM]

Shipping of anything involves risks including loss or theft, let alone damage. (A loss of a big amount Money Order could be the worst nightmare as it could take years to get the matter settled.) We all have seen youtube videos showing delivery people throwing parcels across fence, lawn, etc. Heavy items like a mitre saw have a higher risk of getting damaged even if properly packaged. Single box packing is ok...if it is handcarried by the buyer himself or herself.

Those who have to rely on a vendor's shipping to get their tools have my sympathy. I'm lucky to have a Lee Valley store (as well as two other vendors) in town to get any Festool or SawStop products I want (only money is an issue [tongue]). Not only that, I can even order products from Lee Valley that it doesn't carry as long as it has an existing business relationship with those suppliers. For example, LV does not carry all of Fastcap items, but it will get them from Fastcap for me. Same thing for Jessem products, Bessey, etc.This service is much appreciated by us customers.

 

[PeppaPig]

I wish I had a reliable dealer close by.  It would be great to be able to go to the store, and give it a good look over BEFORE paying for it

> What happens if you need to send a Kapex in for service during the 2nd or 3rd year and your box original shipping box got screwed up like yangwoodworkings?

I have 'heard' that Festool will send you a box, but do you have to pay for the box or shipping?  (Isn't the box worth something?)

 

[chinacap]

I received a Kapex 120EB from Hartville last week and the box was in fine shape as was the saw. There was a little oil seep on the motor casing and some black discharge which I just saw after reading this thread. Fence is perfect and the table has a .002" ddrop to the side wings which is fine. What wasn't fine was the accuracy. I could get the 90 dead on with the 5cut method but the 45s were off by .1 degree. After a lot of fussing and wasted wood I found that the miter detent plate (scale in Festool speak) was not seated up to the stop on the right side. With the scale seated and the saw retrued to 90 the miters came together perfectly. I put in the time getting that right because the saw was otherwise physically straight and true and gave superb cuts. Who knows what would have come with a return and replacement. I've waited a long time for the right deal to come along on a Kapex and I'm satisfied with what I have now.

 

[ChuckM]

Don't know about other brands, but for the Kapex always check and fix if neccedary the mitre cuts first. I shared that on LJ.