Has anybody lost the oring that sits in between the outside surface of the collet and the inside surface of the collet nut? I think mine must have popped out of the 1/2" collet and I just did not see it fall. Any idea what size oring needs to go in there?
Oring for Festool 1/2" collets
- Thread starter jnug
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Bohdan
Member
I had a router that regularly popped the nut off the collet. If the collet is the same as all the other brands its not an O ring but a round spring clip with a cut in it. Mine had worn thinner and would not grip the collet. I fixed the problem by removing the clip, hammering it slightly to widen it and replacing it.
Check that its still not in the groove in the collet nut, if it is then the collet nut can be reinserted by compressing it with an appropriately sized piece of tubing.
Check that its still not in the groove in the collet nut, if it is then the collet nut can be reinserted by compressing it with an appropriately sized piece of tubing.
Actually you can download the revised Manual of the OF2200 which is I think an effort by somebody stateside to provide the kind of manual completeness that we are used to seeing this side of the pond. Europeans specialize in manual brevity based on the assumption that only professional woodworkers would buy tools like this and they already know everything. Sounds like the class system is alive and well somewhere in the world.
Anyway, that revised manual consistently calls it an Oring and in fact I think for once HD might be able to bail me out. It looks to me like a #12 Danco Oring is just about the only size that will fit in that spot. It will go over the collet taper itself and between the lock nut inner wall. A #11 is too small and a #13 is too big but just barely. I have to say I don't like the way one of my threads looks on the inside of the lock nut. Maybe these things all get beat up over time. The rest of them are fine. At $42 a copy for a collet, I might just live with it as long as I can get this Oring seated OK.
Anyway, that revised manual consistently calls it an Oring and in fact I think for once HD might be able to bail me out. It looks to me like a #12 Danco Oring is just about the only size that will fit in that spot. It will go over the collet taper itself and between the lock nut inner wall. A #11 is too small and a #13 is too big but just barely. I have to say I don't like the way one of my threads looks on the inside of the lock nut. Maybe these things all get beat up over time. The rest of them are fine. At $42 a copy for a collet, I might just live with it as long as I can get this Oring seated OK.
If you are really looking for the o-ring I might suggest that you call Festool and ask them to look up the part number. Yes, by the time you get the part and pay for shipping it will be the most expensive o-ring in the world, but you will have the correct part.
Peter
Peter
The only problem with that is..... put $20.00 at most on top of whatever you would pay Festool plus shipping and you have a brand new collet. So I think getting one from them is out. I seriously doubt the Festool Oring would fit better than this one is fitting. Now you would have a whole different deal with the 1/4" or the 8mm collets because that has to be a different Oring and you might not get as lucky as I appear to have gotten here.
But unfortunately, buying an Oring from Festool Parts makes no economic sense. If I end up not completely confident in this, I might buy a new collet and put this one in reserve. But it appears to fit fine and do what it is supposed to do.
Actually if you want to see something really dumb IMO, I have seen people using collets with nothing in there! No snap ring for those designed with snap rings....No Oring for those designed with Orings. Its like they have not realized the foolishness of that decision. So they are reffing down on the collet nut [they hope] enough to hold the collet in the nut and the bit on the collet.....The nuttiest, stupidest thing I think I have seen with regard to setting the tool up for a pass.
Brake pads are held on with snap rings. Would you drive down the road without the snap ring that should be holding your brake pads in place? I just don't understand the things people are willing to do with power tools seemingly without even the whim of a thought.
But unfortunately, buying an Oring from Festool Parts makes no economic sense. If I end up not completely confident in this, I might buy a new collet and put this one in reserve. But it appears to fit fine and do what it is supposed to do.
Actually if you want to see something really dumb IMO, I have seen people using collets with nothing in there! No snap ring for those designed with snap rings....No Oring for those designed with Orings. Its like they have not realized the foolishness of that decision. So they are reffing down on the collet nut [they hope] enough to hold the collet in the nut and the bit on the collet.....The nuttiest, stupidest thing I think I have seen with regard to setting the tool up for a pass.
Brake pads are held on with snap rings. Would you drive down the road without the snap ring that should be holding your brake pads in place? I just don't understand the things people are willing to do with power tools seemingly without even the whim of a thought.
I just gave you a suggestion. I actually went to the ekat to try and find the o-ring for you. I see o-rings for about 85 cents, but the collets aren't split out by size. That is why I suggested you call.
I didn't bother to check the prices for collets. I hope that your o-ring works well for you. I made a suggestion. Take it or leave it - I won't lose sleep over it.
Peter
I didn't bother to check the prices for collets. I hope that your o-ring works well for you. I made a suggestion. Take it or leave it - I won't lose sleep over it.
Peter
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Can I ask how your collet came apart?
I just grabbed mine and it doesn't readily come apart. I'm certain that I could make it part into pieces but it isn't wanting to do that.
Tom
I just grabbed mine and it doesn't readily come apart. I'm certain that I could make it part into pieces but it isn't wanting to do that.
Tom
I agree....they don't want to come apart it seems.
Seeing the maintenance direction in the manual I really did not think it was that big a deal. But they are very tightly in there. I saw something that just did not look right against one of the threads and seeing that there was a maintenance comment I decided to give it a try. It felt like the collet worked itself out through careful and constant pressure. It did not feel like it came straight out. Felt more like it came out at an angle. I can't be sure. I worked at it trying to get a feel for it and before I knew it, they were apart. But I am wondering if what I saw against the threads at the start was a piece of the original Oring.
Maybe it got damaged somehow and therefore did not fight me as much as it would have if it had been healthy. I wish I had not lost it but in fact losing it is what started the thread. I saw something flash past my eyes as the collet came out and last I saw whatever that was headed for a storage area in my basement and that was that. That might be a further suggestion that it was damaged ....possibly split. Seems to me that if it was healthy it would have stayed in there and if healthy may have made it much more difficult to get the collet and the nut apart.
I have the new Oring in there now and I would hate to try to get these two pieces apart with what I know to be a healthy Oring in there. I am not sure I could budge them without feeling like I was going to damage the collet....Maybe you could press one out like a bearing if you had the right tools for the job. In fact maybe that is the right way to do it. A healthy Oring would probably help you if you had the stuff to press that thing out like it was a bearing.
The instruction for installing an Oring is to put the collet and nut together and press the Oring between the collet and the inner wall of the nut. I wonder if that is how Festool gets them in there in a production environment. I sort of doubt that. By the same token the things that would work in a production environment suggest there is enough room in there to get the collet straight out of the nut if you have the tools for the job. I will say this, without the Oring, there is plenty of room between those two parts. It is a very loose fit. So again I suspect that in a production environment the parts are press fit with the Oring either sitting in the groove in the nut or on the collet.
Seeing the maintenance direction in the manual I really did not think it was that big a deal. But they are very tightly in there. I saw something that just did not look right against one of the threads and seeing that there was a maintenance comment I decided to give it a try. It felt like the collet worked itself out through careful and constant pressure. It did not feel like it came straight out. Felt more like it came out at an angle. I can't be sure. I worked at it trying to get a feel for it and before I knew it, they were apart. But I am wondering if what I saw against the threads at the start was a piece of the original Oring.
Maybe it got damaged somehow and therefore did not fight me as much as it would have if it had been healthy. I wish I had not lost it but in fact losing it is what started the thread. I saw something flash past my eyes as the collet came out and last I saw whatever that was headed for a storage area in my basement and that was that. That might be a further suggestion that it was damaged ....possibly split. Seems to me that if it was healthy it would have stayed in there and if healthy may have made it much more difficult to get the collet and the nut apart.
I have the new Oring in there now and I would hate to try to get these two pieces apart with what I know to be a healthy Oring in there. I am not sure I could budge them without feeling like I was going to damage the collet....Maybe you could press one out like a bearing if you had the right tools for the job. In fact maybe that is the right way to do it. A healthy Oring would probably help you if you had the stuff to press that thing out like it was a bearing.
The instruction for installing an Oring is to put the collet and nut together and press the Oring between the collet and the inner wall of the nut. I wonder if that is how Festool gets them in there in a production environment. I sort of doubt that. By the same token the things that would work in a production environment suggest there is enough room in there to get the collet straight out of the nut if you have the tools for the job. I will say this, without the Oring, there is plenty of room between those two parts. It is a very loose fit. So again I suspect that in a production environment the parts are press fit with the Oring either sitting in the groove in the nut or on the collet.
Bohdan
Member
To pull them apart you need to compress the collet with a thin walled tube.
Bohdan
Member
I had a faulty ELU MF177 (same as Dewalt 625) collet that I had to pull apart to fix. It is interchangeable with the OF2200 so I am assuming that the Festool one is built the same.
That is a great piece of information. That should also allow the collet to be taken straight out of the nut even if the Oring is healthy. Can you remember the dims for the thin wall tube? There are so many 1/2" collets out there, that I am sure that would be a much appreciated bit of information.
Since the walls of the cylindrical collet are actually tapered, knowing a dimension for the thin wall tube that actually worked would be very helpful as the diameter and wall thickness of the tube is going to govern how deeply it goes into the nut and where it actually squeezes down on the collet walls without damaging them. I would likely even try to find a correct tube and give it a go again myself just to see if I could get it to work and report back the result here.
Since the walls of the cylindrical collet are actually tapered, knowing a dimension for the thin wall tube that actually worked would be very helpful as the diameter and wall thickness of the tube is going to govern how deeply it goes into the nut and where it actually squeezes down on the collet walls without damaging them. I would likely even try to find a correct tube and give it a go again myself just to see if I could get it to work and report back the result here.
Bohdan
Member
It was a long time ago and I don't remember the tube size but I think that it was something that I had lying around probably a piece of copper water pipe.
I will hunt up some copper plumbing pipe. It is thin wall by design.
The only other thing I am wondering is if you compressed the walls of the collet with the thin wall tube and then actually pressed the collet out from the front side maybe with a second piece of tube or something else the right size to exert some force on the front end and push it out the back.
The only other thing I am wondering is if you compressed the walls of the collet with the thin wall tube and then actually pressed the collet out from the front side maybe with a second piece of tube or something else the right size to exert some force on the front end and push it out the back.
Bohdan
Member
I think that I just punched it out with a brass rod.
That also makes a good deal of sense to me. Again I am likely to do this as an experiment so we end up with a long term solution to getting those two pieces apart. As such I am not all that concerned with sacrificing the older 1/2" collet I have. I might like a new collet anyway. While I hate what new Festool collets cost, it would be worth it to me to make some sort of informational contribution here. These forums help people move projects forward, move forward generally but I prefer to pay that back with information in kind. So as long as I can find what I think will be the right tools to do it, I will likely try to press it out first just to see if that works and if not.....bonk it!
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jnug said:
There isn't really a danger to using the collet without the o-ring. It doesn't affect the clamping function of the router bit. The o-ring just captivates the collet for easier removal during bit change. Years ago, collets weren't captivated and you had to use the router bit to help get the collet out of the tapered spindle.
By the way, the clips on brake pads don't hold the pads to the caliper. They are just for vibration. I happen to have a set of Wilwood calipers on the floor of my office behind me. [smile]
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Well all I can tell you is that I have seen the surface of the collet after a pass without anything, clip or O-ring where it should have been and I don't think you would use that collet again after seeing what that surface ends up looking like. Although I would guess somebody using the tool that way will just keep right on using it oblivious to the damaged part. Surely won't be damaged every time. I don't think the O-ring sits right at the point of applied pressure either. But I do think it helps the collet and nut to apply equal amounts of pressure all the way around at the point where it is applied and if there is nothing there I have seen the consequences in some cases to the surface of the collet and in other cases to the surface of the collet and the nut. It is a very sloppy fit when those parts are not in there.
Equally disturbing to me would be the possibility that as those parts were damaged, during the pass, there would be less pressure on the bit and even a possibility that once a weak point had been established, if unnoticed might cause the part to really fracture depending on the bit in use, the type of pass and the wood one was cutting as well as the amount of time the issue went unattended.
This is frankly one of my biggest complaints about the way power tools are used in some instances, everything from a table saw to a drill. People let maintenance slide, try to take too much material in one pass, let parts go missing, use their tools in ways that have an established track record of problems and just shrug their shoulders or are completely oblivious until they are on the way to the hospital. The condition of some tools I see continually in use is in a word at times appalling, some filthy to the point where you could not see if a part was in proper condition if your life depended on it and oddly enough in some instances it does, certainly your livelihood may depend on it.
The components are there for a reason. If a component goes missing, replace it or if you don't want to replace the component replace the part effected. Don't just let it ride because I will assure you, human nature being what it is that eventually you will forget that you are operating your tool with a missing component and you will subject it to a high enough degree of stress that does make it matter. "The I should have known betters" don't count for much while you are being stitched up. It is very bad habit to get into and one that I try to dissuade people of regularly.
Equally disturbing to me would be the possibility that as those parts were damaged, during the pass, there would be less pressure on the bit and even a possibility that once a weak point had been established, if unnoticed might cause the part to really fracture depending on the bit in use, the type of pass and the wood one was cutting as well as the amount of time the issue went unattended.
This is frankly one of my biggest complaints about the way power tools are used in some instances, everything from a table saw to a drill. People let maintenance slide, try to take too much material in one pass, let parts go missing, use their tools in ways that have an established track record of problems and just shrug their shoulders or are completely oblivious until they are on the way to the hospital. The condition of some tools I see continually in use is in a word at times appalling, some filthy to the point where you could not see if a part was in proper condition if your life depended on it and oddly enough in some instances it does, certainly your livelihood may depend on it.
The components are there for a reason. If a component goes missing, replace it or if you don't want to replace the component replace the part effected. Don't just let it ride because I will assure you, human nature being what it is that eventually you will forget that you are operating your tool with a missing component and you will subject it to a high enough degree of stress that does make it matter. "The I should have known betters" don't count for much while you are being stitched up. It is very bad habit to get into and one that I try to dissuade people of regularly.
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jnug said:
I now realize that it may not have been obvious before, but I'm the person that created the information you are referencing.
The o-ring is not playing any sort of role in the interaction of holding the router bit. It is simply keeping the two pieces together when they are not holding a router bit. If it was a safety concern, I would have flagged it as such in the manual and given it much more weight.
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