Planning purchase Repetitive cuts of more than 27 inches how to

[firepilot]

Hi All,

Researching my first Festool purchase. I have a table saw to cut rips on and am comfortable doing that. I am looking at the Festool system to square and crosscut material for cabinet sides tops and bottoms.

I am looking at the ts 75 and the "Drill guide" to supplement the track that comes with it. I was looking at the parallel system as well and it would work great but is limited it looks like to 27 inches with stops. My cabinet sides are 610mm (rip) by 768mm Crosscut. What is the best way to set up and cut using a stop of some kind. Ready to get these items ordered for a kitchen I am building.

Former cabinet shop owner who is getting back into it for the fun and to build a house full of cabinets for my own home for a change. Last big saw was an Altendorf F-45 which made cross cutting easy.

I'm sure there is a simple solution. I tried the search button but must not have asked the right question. Thank you.

Phil

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

get an mft and a super set from qwas.  or, if you're planning on getting the LR32 hole drilling system anyway, make your own mft.

the super set from qwas includes 4 precision bench dogs for 20mm holes and 2 rail dogs for same.  using this setup, you can make accurate repeatable cuts of any length.

if you make an mft top with an offset row of holes along each long side, and you space the offset row such that, with the rail dogs in, your rail lies dead center of all of the middle rows of holes, then you'll have a setup where you can move in 96mm increments very quickly and with superb accuracy. 

alternatively, if all of your holes have the same spacing, you can just make a couple of offset blocks according to sizes you'll need to cut repeatedly.

if you search mft on here, you'll find a whole bunch of ideas for mft top workbenches which you can easily modify to suit your needs.

also, if you're getting the LR32, there's a series of youtube videos covering pretty much every facet of how to use it.  it's a little long-winded, but totally worth watching if you want to get the most out of your investment.

 

[peter halle]

Most important!!!!   [welcome] to the forum!

It looks like you are willing to use your table saw to do rips and then segway into the Festool system.  One way would be to integrate a mft/3 and use those to set up your crosscuts.

The typical (for many) work flow would be to do your rips using the parallel guides or pencil marks and a rail and then take those to a trusted cross cutting mechanism.  The MFT/3 has achieved that for many either using the Festool parts included in the full package or by using any of the after market accessories that rely on the accuracy of the grid pattern of the MFT table.  There are many other ways; I am sure others will offer their favorite.

Peter

 

[firepilot]

Thanks for the information.

I think I will use the LR32 and build a custom table on the back side of the table saw as a work bench/outfeed.

I found the right drill bit it looks like on the forum here and will probably get all this stuff ordered and headed this way today or tomorrow.

Really great resource here.

Thanks again

Phil

 

[Slappy]

to make multiple parallel cuts on a TS75 these work well on wider panels
http://www.senecawoodworking.com/products/parallel-guide-system-for-incra-t-track-plus

you get the  36" Incra index rails to get more width

 

[panelchat]

heres what i did for cabinets, it worked well:

long rail for 8' cuts (the rail connectors work ok but if you are coming from an altendorf you will find them fussy, delicate, annoying for repeat use)
mft for x cuts- qwas dogs behind the fence to help quickly register it to exact 90, using the cnc cut hole pattern for its squareness (there's a lot of debate on square MFT x cutting here, this is a fast no brainer solution that works for great me)
- also i put a starrett right to left tape on the fence, with a home made plexi hairline attachment on the flag stop for fast/repeat/accurate cuts, no fusing w measuring tape.
- and a clamp-on attachment as an extension to the fence, with a tab on the end, as a temprary extension to the fence for x cutting long boards to final dimension.
long boards, like 8' or so, can be supported by a stack of systainers off to the left while cutting, if you want a quick, on the spot solution for that. plus its an excuse to get more systainers ;D

i used RMW's aftermarket parallel guides- they use incra track, so you can set up to do any width of cut, depending on the length of track you use with them.
most of my cuts are for shelving, and i use very short tracks that only hang off the rail about 8 inches, which is a very convenient setup for handling the rail/guide assembly.

good luck!

 

[panelchat]

oops slappy posted while i was writing- thats basically the same parallel guide setup i was describing...

 

[firepilot]

Thanks guys

Headed to Seattle tomorrow to pick up my table saw. 3hp 220 single phase Jet cabinet saw with 50" exacta II fence from Craigslist for $800. Will hit the Woodcraft store and see feel and touch the Festool series. Been a long time I have actually looked at the tools. They said they sell a large Festool volume. They only had one TS 55 in stock.  I hope to pick up as many tools on my list as I can and then order the rest Monday. Awesome winter storm advisory this weekend to make the 10 hr drive lots of fun.

Submitting drawings from my old but good Cabnet ware design program circa 2000 for permits next week. Sure is fun planning, drawing and getting ready to set up another shop. Only have 388 sq ft this time instead of 3500 but thats cool.

Will order the parallel rails and the pieces from Seneca looks like exactly what I need. Going to build my own MFT and I think I have it all figured out system wise.

I am thinking that for the price of the original Cabinet bids We are going to have a really great kitchen and I get the stuff left over to keep my re-kindled love of wood working going.

Thanks again for all the tips and advice.

Phil

 

[firepilot]

Hey all,

A few more questions. We survived the trip over hill and dale. The folks in Seattle were great to deal with. Came away with a TS-55 (Well ordered one for later this week), the big rail and the shorter "holey" rail. Picked up the OF 1400 router, LR-32 system and CT-26 vac. I found the incra rails and got a pair of 36".

I also ordered the qwas dogs and the set above to make the incra rails work for my parallel cuts.

I ordered the 20mm bit from Bob Marino this am and am working on getting the shop set up.

I see the common flow is to break up panels using the Long rail and saw. I am just so used to using the table saw or panel saw. I have no problem rethinking my methods so I have been watching youtube videos, and Festool videos at all hours of the day. I got a good deal on the Table Saw but I am starting to second guess that decision a bit.

If a guy is gong to use the system to make rips is anyone doubling up sheets of material? I have watched some different videos where they are mirroring parts but not yet any where they are stacking parts. It seems like if you are ripping 24" or 610mm wide rips as long as you are setting up why not do two sheets.

I have a week until the saw shows up so I am still gathering info. My router bit for the MFT should be here Friday so I can start playing this weekend.

Thanks in Advance.

Phil

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

I stack pieces for cutting with my track saw on a pretty regular basis.  When you need mirrored pieces there's no better way.  I wouldn't go too crazy with it, but 2 pieces of 3/4" ply is no problem at all.  Samesies for making MFT tops with the lr32; if you have 2 separate tops to make, stack away!

 

[wrightwoodwork]

I stack sheets all the time if they are going to be the same. In fact I heard of one boy who had got one.of the large mafell carpenter saws and was stacking 10 sheets of mdf together and was cutting in 1 go

 

[firepilot]

Sounds great. Just make sense for making rips for cabinet sides that are all the same depth and height.

The table saw is looking more and more like a work bench. May have to put it on wheels and move it out of the way :-\ :-\

Phil

 

[Tinker]

With the space you have, i am suspecting that once you have tried the MFT/TS 55/Guide rail approach, you will be looking for a new owner for your tablesaw.
If you have a large space to work in, you might keep the table saw, but for small area, you can't beat bringing the wood to a stationary location (MFT) and put saw to the wood with rail to guide.  Your idea to stack will work so much easier as well.

Tinker

 

[firepilot]

Thanks,

I'm thinking so as well. I got it for the right price, may be able to sell it and make it into a Kapex I have the big 12" Bosch SCMS but it is huge. Have to get the measurements out and see if I can justify/rationalize selling the bosch and getting the Kapex to fit my space better. It is a little bit more time consuming figuring out how to lay out the shop with the space I have.

I think instead of an out feed table now I am thinking a 4 x 8 MFT would center in the shop and cover as a cutting table as well as a building table.

I will get my saw on Tuesday and hope to have the MFT table done by then.

The router bit for the 20mm hole will be here today and my Qwas dogs hopefully by Tuesday.

Tough having to piece things together via the internet.

Thanks

Phil

 

[MahalaHomecraft]

depending on your table saw, you might want to consider running pipes through your MFT a la ron paulk workbench.  the pipes can pull out and your table saw can rest on them, then you have the MFT as your outfeed.  when you don't need the table saw the pipes tuck back in.  having had a track saw for a few years now, i find i still prefer the table saw pretty much only for extension jambs and other very thin pieces, but its still great for that.  I have a dw745 which is nice and portable.  also, if you wanna make toe kicks, for example, and you need to run out lots of feet all at the same width, if you cut a 48" sheet into maybe 3 strips and then rip those down to exact size with the table saw, it's just faster that way.  especially if, like me, you don't have a long rail.

 

[Tinker]

Thanks,

I'm thinking so as well. I got it for the right price, may be able to sell it and make it into a Kapex I have the big 12" Bosch SCMS but it is huge. Have to get the measurements out and see if I can justify/rationalize selling the bosch and getting the Kapex to fit my space better. It is a little bit more time consuming figuring out how to lay out the shop with the space I have.

I think instead of an out feed table now I am thinking a 4 x 8 MFT would center in the shop and cover as a cutting table as well as a building table.

I will get my saw on Tuesday and hope to have the MFT table done by then.

The router bit for the 20mm hole will be here today and my Qwas dogs hopefully by Tuesday.

Tough having to piece things together via the internet.

Thanks

Phil

I have about 1/2 the space that you have and i sill can find places where my feet can find the floor.  [wink]
Tinker

 

[Baartman]

Keep the table saw! I am running a similar setup, a small shop building kitchen cabinets. The table saw is invaluable for ripping upper cabinet sides, drawer boxes, stretcher material, rails and stiles etc. I rip up the material on the saw which ends up on the outfeed that has a crosscutting function using a ts55 and parf dogs. With only the rails, you're constantly removing sheets from the bench to continue a batch of cuts.

 

[leer]

firepilot,

My shop is just a little over 400 sq. ft., so I'm in the same boat as you.  I struggled with the decision to get a larger table saw (more powerful), so I could break down sheet goods.  The I discovered what people were doing with the Festool track saws..  Here is a pretty simple MFT-style workbench I built recently.  It doubles as my outfeed tabe for my table saw.  I am in the process of building a cart for my planer that will enable this table to be used as the outfeed for it.  It will be on casters so it can be rolled out of the way when not in use.  Maybe this will give you some ideas.  I struggled with having enough length in my shop to provide both infeed and outfeed clearance for sheet goods, at least without constantly moving other tools out of the way.  This bench, and going to a track saw, has changed my whole approach to woodworking.  

I picked up the Incra T-Track Pluses over the weekend, and just ordered the Seneca Parallel Guides last night. I am anxious to try those.  Next purchase -- a Domino!

http://festoolownersgroup.com/member-projects/home-built-%27mft-xl%27-workbench/

 

[firepilot]

Lee,

Thanks. Your bench is almost exactly what I am building. I have my dogs incoming on Wed and the rest of the week off. I have about half my table drilled and the size is about 82 by 48 as of now.

I figured I should get the top done and square and then build the base to fit. I picked up some nice 4x4 clear fir legs at the Orange store and will put a sheet of ply in the bottom for a floor. Then want to make some boxes under that are sustainer depth and width for storage. It will be the right height to use as an out feed for the Table saw. To cut full sheets on my table saw the garage door will have to be open.

Just hav to work with the space I have but I think it is going to work. I have dry storage so as I build the kitchen I can put the boxes there until install.

Thanks for the tips

Phil

 

[firepilot]

Hey All,

Good progress. I have the MFT table up and running. Just finished machining the cabinet sides for a couple upper shop cabinets. They look as nice as anything that ever came off my old point to point. I really like the LR32. That system combined with a iPad in the shop helped the learning curve a fair amount.

My dad was here for the holiday and I built him a nice shadow box. Nice to exercise the shop. I did use the table saw quite a bit I must say, so I think I'll be keeping it for the time being.

Having fun and will cut the backs and stretchers tomorrow and get some cabinets hung hopefully.

Thanks again for the help and encouragement.

Phil