Quangsheng low angle vs Lie Nielsen low angle block plane.

[derekcohen]

I don't like the answer about the DX60 ergonomics because now I'm really interested in trying it. The problem is I already have the Veritas LABP and the Quangsheng LABP and I don't need another one.

I have broad hands (100mm across the palm), but I find the Lee Valley LABP too wide for comfortable holding. The Stanley #65 is the same.

By contrast, the Stanley/LN #60 1/2 and the Veritas NX60/DX60 are the same widths, and these are a good fit for me.

I use the LN #60 1/2 and both the Veritas NX and DX60 (I work with Lee Valley to test run their planes prior to final production, and so have a bunch of their planes in my shop).

In use, all these planes perform exactly the same as one another, that is, to the highest standard. All are very comfortable in the hand. I would not want to separate them in that regard.

However, when it comes to ergonomics - adjusting the blade laterally and for projection, removing and re-inserting the blade when sharpening, and opening and closing the mouth - then the Veritas planes are in a class of their own. They just make these tasks easier.

Lastly, one gets a few choices of blade steel with the Veritas, and their PM-V11 steel is simply better in every way to A2, which is the only steel offered by LN. It hones like O1 and has several times its edge holding.

I wrote up a comparison of these planes in 2008: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/VeritasPremiumBlockPlane.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Lemwise]

This caught my eye, and although I had an idea to get the ECE wood block plane, I've had som doubts about it.

One of my co-workers has the ECE block plane specifically for the most difficult of woods and it's actually a very nice little plane. He made a small metal adjustable mouth plate for it and he put a 10 degree back bevel on the blade. Combined with the 50 degree seating of the blade that gives him a total angle of 60 degrees. The only downside is that the big depth adjuster knob has a tendency to come loose because the palm of your hand rests on it.

I have broad hands (100mm across the palm), but I find the Lee Valley LABP too wide for comfortable holding.

My hands are slightly smaller with 95mm across the palm but the Veritas LABP is the most comfortable to hold for me compared to the Quangsheng which is the same size as the LN 60½. The Veritas fits my hand better than any other block plane I've ever held (apart from the LN 102).

And you're absolutely right about PM-V11. It's the best blade steel on the market, even better than Blue or White Paper steel imo. It sharpens easily and holds the edge for a long time. I also replaced the A2 blade in my Veritas No.4 with a PM-V11 blade.

 

[Lemwise]

I visited a wood working show and I got to hold the Veritas DX60. I have to say this is without a doubt the most comfortable and ergonomic block plane I've ever held in my hands. I'm strongly considering selling the Quangsheng and replacing it with the DX60.

 

[Holmz]

Thanks [member=60576]Lemwise[/member] good to know.

 

[derekcohen]

I visited a wood working show and I got to hold the Veritas DX60. I have to say this is without a doubt the most comfortable and ergonomic block plane I've ever held in my hands. I'm strongly considering selling the Quangsheng and replacing it with the DX60.

See - I told you so! Listen to me

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Holmz]

I visited a wood working show and I got to hold the Veritas DX60. I have to say this is without a doubt the most comfortable and ergonomic block plane I've ever held in my hands. I'm strongly considering selling the Quangsheng and replacing it with the DX60.

See - I told you so! Listen to me

Regards from Perth

Derek

Please keep talking Derek, I am all ears.

 

[Lemwise]

See - I told you so! Listen to me

Regards from Perth

Derek

I was surprised by how comfortable it is to hold because I've gotten so used to the width of the Veritas LABP over the years. It's just as wide (or narrow) as the Quansheng yet it feels completely different.

And speaking of premium planes, I don't get why Lee Valley still has the NX60 on its website. It's pretty clear by now it will never again be produced so why are they misleading potential customers into thinking something else? I think that's rather deceitful behaviour from an otherwise excellent company.

 

[junk731]

I have a lot of things that I would call Lee Valley but deceitful doesn't even enter my mind. Great service and great reputation are the first thing that comes to mind.

"Due to a manufacturing delay on the body of the NX60 Block Plane, these products are temporarily unavailable."

They don't do in house casting, its outsourced. They are very fussy about who does their casting and have been having trouble finding good foundries in NA since the major exodus of manufactures offshore. This info came from Rob Lee who is the owner of LV. He was doing a talk for a local furniture making guild that was extremely informative including several prototype for future release.

If they were going to discontinue the NX it would say so in a message. If you have to have one right away get the DX, if not wait until the NX is back in production.

I got my son a NX60 when they were first released, it is a sweet little plane.

John

 

[Lemwise]

The NX60 hasn't been in production for several years now. Also, George Hammond from Veritas told a furniture maker I know that he doubts it will ever be produced again (nickel resist ductile iron is also very difficult and very expensive to machine). At some point they have to be honest and just say the NX60 is discontinued. I mean, how much longer can they continue to say it's delayed? 2 years, 5 years? And don't get me wrong, I love Veritas planes but this is pure nonsense.

 

[derekcohen]

John is correct. The plane remains in production as Lee Valley have every intention of manufacturing more, as far as I am aware. I do not know when it was last offered.

The DX version is exactly the same plane. In some ways it is the better model since the ductile iron is more grippy. I was chatting to Rob Lee about this (and other planes) the other day, and he bemoaned the difficulty in manufacturing the nickel planes.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Lemwise]

The plane remains in production as Lee Valley have every intention of manufacturing more

I have every intention to stop paying my taxes. That doesn't mean it's going to happen. Like I said, the NX60 hasn't been produced for several years. There comes a point when they have to accept reality and discontinue it. Leaving it up on their website is misleading imo.

 

[ChuckM]

I have been a Veritas customer for over a decade and I do not consider its leaving a product on its website that it has every intention to manufacture again anything wrong. Neither is it misleading nor is it deceitful by any definition. Many supply factors are outside the control of a manufacturer and when a company is sure that there is no hope that a product can be reproduced again, it will then make the market decision not to make it and withdraw it from its catalog. Simple business practice and there is no need to make any conspiracy theory about it.

On the other hand, a company that says certain of its products are one-time only but then reproduces and sells them again (and again) due to customer requests, in my view, fits the bill of being misleading. I have found two such examples from two different vendors recently.

Chuck

 

[Lemwise]

The NX60 hasn't been produced since at least 2012. Saying there's a manufacturing delay for at least 5 years is misleading in every sense of the word. There's no delay here, it's a full production stop. I don't doubt their desire to produce it again but they need to call it what it is.

 

[ChuckM]

A delay it is. Misleading it is not. Nothing intentionally deceiving on the part of Veritas as I see it. The Am Heritage Dictionary defines "mis·lead (mĭs-lēd)" as:

tr.v. mis·led (-lĕd), mis·lead·ing, mis·leads
1. To lead in the wrong direction.
2. To give a wrong impression or lead toward a wrong conclusion, especially by intentionally deceiving.

No words on that product page about the NX60 lead in the wrong direction or suggest a wrong conclusion. We can complain about any product delay, but we should not imply any deception or guilt on the part of the retailer/manufacturer without proof.

Chuck

 

[junk731]

Lemwise I think you should contact Rob Lee directly, he's a member here any tell him how to run his very successful business, I'm sure he would love to hear from you.

John

 

[Corwin]

... The Am Heritage Dictionary defines "mis·lead (mĭs-lēd)" as:

tr.v. mis·led (-lĕd), mis·lead·ing, mis·leads
1. To lead in the wrong direction.
2. To give a wrong impression or lead toward a wrong conclusion, especially by intentionally deceiving.

...

Then, one might argue that the only thing misleading here has been the derogatory remarks leveled at Lee Valley.  [sad]

 

[Poindexter]

Lee Valley is pretty transparent in their online shopping cart.  If a product isn't available you can't even select it.  The NX60 is not:

[attachimg=1]

And then the cart will show when something will be available:

[attachimg=2]

Maybe this is a recent change to the website.  And maybe this isn't retail practice within the stores, but I can't fault them for their online practices.

 

[Holmz]

I'll go one, or maybe two.

 

[Lemwise]

From Lee Valleys website:

Due to a manufacturing delay on the body of the NX60 Block Plane, these products are temporarily unavailable.

Temporarily suggest it's available again shortly. But it's not. Like I said, it hasn't been produced since at least 2012. How many more years can they keep saying it's temporarily unavailable? I think this is a very misleading statement. You guys don't. Lets agree to disagree.

 

[Michael Kellough]

From Lee Valleys website:

Due to a manufacturing delay on the body of the NX60 Block Plane, these products are temporarily unavailable.

Temporarily suggest it's available again shortly. But it's not. Like I said, it hasn't been produced since at least 2012. How many more years can they keep saying it's temporarily unavailable? I think this is a very misleading statement. You guys don't. Lets agree to disagree.

We have a new President in the States. The consequences could be a lot more significant than not being able to buy a shiny block plane, but it is temporary.