Quick clamps vs threaded clamps for Festy rail system

[jnug]

Looking at Quick clamps vs screw clamps for the Festy Rail system. Have plowed quite a bit of money into my woodworking lately. So it is getting down to not just willy-nilly buying things because i want them. The Quick clamps have rather obvious attraction. But really not sure their advantages are that tied to the Festy rail system. If you are clamping the rail down, it seems to me, you will have two hands to devote to the job and while it will take longer using the threaded clamps, they are much much cheaper and the larger threaded clamps even giving you a little more space to use to the top of the rail. Just not sure the Quick clamps are a gotta' have for the rail system. But I would defer to you guys.

Also trying to avoid the large table (subbase) as a router accessory as it is not inexpensive. But if guys get a good deal of use out of it, well then it is not a luxury. Clearly it adds to the stability for certain jobs where the router is just right on the edge of the material. But if folks are not using it hardly at all, then I would guess that means the Festy router systems are for the most part stable enough without adding that larger subbase and its a piece I don't need to buy. Again something I am sure people here know more about at this point than me.

What do folks think, Quick clamps vs threaded? Comments on the usefulness of the Larger Table (subbase).

Thanks in advance.

 

[icecactus]

I originally thought I would only use the threaded since I didn't want to spend the coin on the quick clamp. I made the mistake of buying 1 quick clamp. I now have 3 more and will not waste my money on the threaded style. Worth every penny.

IMO, the threaded is overpriced for what you are getting. if you compare the quick clamp to other quick clamps on the market, the festool quick clamp is actually reasonably priced.

 

[AlexThePalex]

I prefer the quick clamp over the slow clamp. I have both and always go for the quick clamp. Also with my Bessy or Irwin clamps, I always take the quick clamps. The slow ones are a thing of the past as far as I'm concerned. The quick clamps work faster and more comfortable. If you have to make a lot of cuts with the TS the quick clamps not only speed up your work decisively, but can save you painful hands.

Only threaded clamps I still use are some big ones of 60 to 100 cm.

 

[jnug]

Well that takes question 1 off the board. So much for saving that money!

How bout' the Table Widener which is that subbase thing that looks like it provides a benefit for the times you would use it. Just not sure many folks are actually using it. Again for folks that are wondering what it is, it looks like those acrylic subbases that Pat Warner makes for Dewalt for example. But the Festy is made of as the same materal that the standard Festy base is made from.....I that one worth investing in or does it turn out to be s dust magnet sitting in your tool cabinet?

 

[Cheese]

I prefer the quick clamp over the slow clamp. I have both and always go for the quick clamp. Also with my Bessy or Irwin clamps, I always take the quick clamps. The slow ones are a thing of the past as far as I'm concerned. The quick clamps work faster and more comfortable. If you have to make a lot of cuts with the TS the quick clamps not only speed up your work decisively, but can save you painful hands.

Only threaded clamps I still use are some big ones of 60 to 100 cm.

I totally agree...
The first clamps I purchased were the screw version because of the price. However after I purchased the quick clamps, I've not used the screw clamps in over 4 years.

 

[jnug]

You guys have completely routed me on the Quick Clamps vs threaded clamps thing. I am starting to get the warm and fuzzies about the Table Widener though. Nobody is yet to post that its a solid add to your router tool kit...money well spent etc etc. Maybe I will be able to avoid buying that one.

I have to admit it looks like something worthwhile. Maybe it does not get used much because of the time it takes to go from your standard base to that base. I think it would be six screws to make that change. Maybe its something that gets avoided unless absolutely necessary.

 

[rvieceli]

it depends on what you are talking about. If you are going to use the clamps from below for clamping the guide rail to a piece to cut, then I like these from Dewalt. They fit the Festool rail and are very easy to snug up. Plus you get two for $40

http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DWS5026-TrackSaw-Track-Clamps/dp/B001J31PJM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1425504512&sr=8-1&keywords=dewalt+track+saw+clamps

What they don't do is fit the MFT very well without modification. The part that fits in the rail doesn't turn and fit the holes properly. You can make them work by removing the pin at the end of the rail and take them apart. Stick the end in from under the table and fit the clamp mechanism back on the rail.

 

[jnug]

That is quite a savings. I do notice that it is another quick clamp type. So as I said earlier, you guys are just slaughtering the idea of using threaded clamps even just for holding the rail in place.....pretty telling that.

Thanks for the suggestion on the Dewalt clamps. That is heck of a monetary savings.

Looks like I am still squeaking by on that Table Widener. If I end up having to buy that one as well the next question might be "Does anybody know a good divorce attorney?"

 

[icecactus]

it depends on what you are talking about. If you are going to use the clamps from below for clamping the guide rail to a piece to cut, then I like these from Dewalt. They fit the Festool rail and are very easy to snug up. Plus you get two for $40

http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DWS5026-TrackSaw-Track-Clamps/dp/B001J31PJM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1425504512&sr=8-1&keywords=dewalt+track+saw+clamps

What they don't do is fit the MFT very well without modification. The part that fits in the rail doesn't turn and fit the holes properly. You can make them work by removing the pin at the end of the rail and take them apart. Stick the end in from under the table and fit the clamp mechanism back on the rail.

I would steer you away from the dewalts...I purchased them a while back (for $35) and returned them. They are not worth the money. Below is the review I left on amazon for them.

I bought these knowing they wouldn't work in the 20mm holes on the MFT/3, but they will slide into the aluminum track on the sides. That said, they have very little holding power and will not hold a board with enough force so you could actually work on the board. I am actually surprised by how little holding power they have. Seems much less then my comparable Irwin clamps.

So, if your intent is to ONLY hold a track down, these will work fine. If you wanted a somewhat dual purpose clamp, these are not it. I will be returning these and buying the Festool Quick Clamps. While, twice the cost, they also can be used for MANY more tasks, and therefor in my opinion is money better spent. The Festool Quik Clamps are also easier to use under the track and have a ridiculous amount of holding power.

 

[jnug]

Well you know how it is. Initially I intend just using the clamps for the rail but that probably won't last. Honesty I was leaning toward the Festy's if only because the advantages of quick clamps are speed and one handed operation.....disadvantages, they sometimes don't hold. That can OK but if you really need them to hold and they don't...could be a bad day. Plus I have a bunch of quick clamps from other suppliers. So I am not wanting for quick clamps. A couple good ones won't be that painful.

Like I said its looking like the Table Widener is getting no love here. Avoiding that one helps. We will see if the suburban precincts come in with a late vote that pushes the Table Widener back up on the order again.

 

[Mismarked]

Maybe do a separate post on the table widener and you might get some responses.  You started with quick clamps and kind of shifted gears several posts down, and some viewers might not have read all the way down to that post thinking the quick clamp question had been adequately answered.  Come to think of it, I don't think I have ever used my threaded clamps.  I would like to hear about the widener.

 

[tjbier]

I don't clamp the rail down much, but I always reach for the quick clamp. I use them for glue ups to being a 3rd hand and holding up crown to everything in between.
Considering the Bessey welders quick clamp is ~$56 the fessy quick clamps are a bargian, yes at $40 a bargian  [eek]  for what they can do for you.

 

[peter halle]

Which router do you have?

Peter

 

[AlexThePalex]

Well you know how it is. Initially I intend just using the clamps for the rail but that probably won't last. Honesty I was leaning toward the Festy's if only because the advantages of quick clamps are speed and one handed operation.....disadvantages, they sometimes don't hold.

Indeed, once you get the clamps you use them for everything. The thin top is not as comfortable as with normal clamps, but it still works just fine.

Don't underestimate the clamping power of the Festool clamps, they hold very well and don't loosen up. They are all solid metal and very sturdy.

Like I said its looking like the Table Widener is getting no love here. Avoiding that one helps. We will see if the suburban precincts come in with a late vote that pushes the Table Widener back up on the order again.

The post is just 3 hours old, don't jump to conclusions, you'll get some response. I doubt as many people have the table widener as the quick clamps.

If with table widener you mean Extension Table - 488756 , the question has come up before.

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tool-problems/extension-table-for-of-1010-handy-or-rubbish/

Considering the Bessey welders quick clamp is ~$56 the fessy quick clamps are a bargian, yes at $40 a bargian  [eek]  for what they can do for you.

And considering the Festool clamps are made by Bessey and the Bessey model sells for $50 on Amazon while the Festool is only $38 it sure is a bargain. The Festool also has a much nicer finish.

 

[icecactus]

Are you referring to the Table Widener - 493233?

if so I have one, but haven't used it yet. I ordered it at the same time as my router, but it was back ordered. I tried using the rods and guide stop like paul marcel does for extra stability. Works really well.

 

[JeromeM]

I would steer you away from the dewalts...I purchased them a while back (for $35) and returned them. They are not worth the money. Below is the review I left on amazon for them.

I bought these knowing they wouldn't work in the 20mm holes on the MFT/3, but they will slide into the aluminum track on the sides. That said, they have very little holding power and will not hold a board with enough force so you could actually work on the board. I am actually surprised by how little holding power they have. Seems much less then my comparable Irwin clamps.

So, if your intent is to ONLY hold a track down, these will work fine. If you wanted a somewhat dual purpose clamp, these are not it. I will be returning these and buying the Festool Quick Clamps. While, twice the cost, they also can be used for MANY more tasks, and therefor in my opinion is money better spent. The Festool Quik Clamps are also easier to use under the track and have a ridiculous amount of holding power.

I disagree with the advice to avoid the DeWalts, also the advice to have no screw clamps.

I have 3 pairs of DeWalts, 1 pair of quick clamps, and 3 or 4 pairs of screw clamps. They were bought at different times, I originally bought  1 pair of quick clamps and 1 pair of screw clamps.

There are situations where the quick clamps won't work under the rail where the DeWalts will. There are also situations where the moderate holding power of the DeWalts is good enough. The ergonomics of the three types are different so no one type will be best in all situations.

 

[rvieceli]

I also like my Dewalts. I use them for clamping the rail and that's it. It holds the rail just fine for me, for sawing and for routing.

 

[jnug]

Quick clamps have their place. Heck we have some things out there for sale that are glorified paper clips. So quick clamps are a long way from the lowest form of clamping device out there.

To me, nothing holds like threaded clamps. So myself, if I am gluing something up and I am going to use clamps I am using threaded clamps....mainly larger than these but threaded clamps none the less. I have not seen a quick type clamp that I would trust in a glue up situation. These don't even look like they would make good glue up clamps. So it would likely never be an issue in my case.

I have nothing scientific to support this so its all opinion in my case. but I think if you really ratchet down a quick clamp chances are even greater that it won't hold that degree of pressure if you are using them to support a curing bond. I believe that is a problem. At least my opinion is that it is all or nothing with clamps and glue ups. Either you can hold the pressure that you started with and intended for the required time frame or the bond is not likely to last. I suppose you could use larger quick clamps in an effort to simply throw brute force at the problem. But I think the better idea in almost all cases would be to use threaded clamps.

Hold down a workpiece for a limited period of time or hold other fixtures for a period of time seems to me the application that the quick clamp was born for. Heck I even use them to seal up paint cans . May sound kind of silly doing that but it works well. Probably says something about the kinds of things a quick clamp can do well.

 

[Jaybolishes]

The dewalt clamps are awesome.  Never bought any festool screw clamps, didn't seem worth it. I have four quick clamps (491594) and usually only use them when utilizing 20mm holes above the table.  The dewalts  won't fit in the MFT  holes without significant grinding, but if I'm clamping a rail below the table I always use the dewalt clamps and for many other purposes without the rail. The dewalts have a ton of clamping power, more than the quick clamp I believe which still has plenty of clamping strength.

 

[jbasen]

I have both the Dewalt clamps and the Festool Quick Clamps.  I find that both are great.  I've never had an issue with the holding power of the Dewalt clamps; especially when holding a guide rail to a work piece for cutting with a track saw or routing

I have a home made MFT with 8020 extrusions.  The Dewalt clamps wouldn't fit in the 8020 tracks but a few minutes with a file and some spray paint easily fixed that problem.