Recommended Hardwood Decking

[phmade]

I'm re-decking a deck for my parents' home in southern Indiana; the deck is adjacent to a large pond and fully exposed to rain and sun.  The original structure is oak and we have cleaned and treated all of the structure with a penetrating epoxy to resist rot.  Now we're ready to put the decking on and we're trying to decide on a material.  I want to use a hardwood (not a composite).  We don't mind annual maintenance but we want it to be look and feel nice.  Right now we're looking at Garapa, Cumaru, and Ipe.  I thought the Garapa looked nice but I've never used it before.  Does anyone have any opinions on these or other species?  Also, I like the idea of using concealed fasteners so that we're not screwing thru the face.  Any suggestions on those? 

Our structure is 16"OC and the dealer claims that 3/4" material will be adequate, but they offer 1" thickness as well.  I'd feel better about the 1" because I don't want any sag.

Thanks for your opinions.

 

[Kevin D.]

I've been debating what to use for decking to be built for a few years.  Recently I decided it will be Ipe.  Lasts forever, needs an oiling once a year to keep it's beauty, strong and hard as heck.  Get the Ipe Clip buiscuiting out your grooves rather than buy the pre-grooved boards, use 5/4 boards, wax your freshly cut butt ends (only needs to be done once).

http://www.ipeclip.com/index.html?pk_campaign=PaidAdWords&gclid=COyf2uHdurICFaY7OgodJy4AMQ

http://www.advantagelumber.com/decking2.htm?gclid=CKenkP_durICFYw-MgodhgYApg

 

[nickao]

Cumaru and none of the others you mentioned need the 5/4" thickness(though its nice), even on an angle. All of those are good.

You can also take a look at Massarunduba for a totally different color option. It is just as durable as the woods you mention. It can be used inside or out. I had it everywhere at my old house in the Chicago area and its the only flooring my dogs could not scratch. Massarunduba is  stronger than Ipe and performs just as well or better outside.  I got mine for 40% less cost than Ipe on sale. Even regularly it should be about 25% less than the cost Ipe. I love the deep red.

Massarunduba decking is generally  5/4" and for me that was total overkill. It's just another option, everything you are looking at is great for a deck.

This site is linked for general info, you can probably get better pricing if you shop around:

http://www.advantagelumber.com/massaranduba_decking.htm

 

[mastercabman]

Here, in SE VA I see a lot of IPE.
It will turn gray(ish) if you just leave it without any treatment.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

5/4 is a waste.  They will all turn silver with no maintenance.

I have done tigerwood one's, Garapa and Ipe.  Can't sell a Massaranduba one, no one likes the blood red color.

I like the look of Garapa and the price.  Ipe is sweet too.  

I like the extreme Ipe clips and Messmer's natural UV oil for hardwoods.

 

[nickao]

Well outside that blood red really turns brown and then ultimately grey. I love brand new Massarunduba, had it through my entire  house..

 

[phmade]

Thanks for the replies - it sounds like it's going to come down to the color preference of the owners.  I really like those clips too.  I noticed all of the images show a border around the deck (like a picture frame).  Is this just for aesthetics or are you joining all of the ends to prevent cupping?

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

Thanks for the replies - it sounds like it's going to come down to the color preference of the owners.  I really like those clips too.  I noticed all of the images show a border around the deck (like a picture frame).  Is this just for aesthetics or are you joining all of the ends to prevent cupping?

Two things with the picture frames, it adds detail and it hides all end cuts. 

I have started using dominos on all my but joints and miters.

I used to get my lumber from advantage, but they dropped the ball a couple times on me. 

I would suggest calling George at East Teak.  It will come freight and it will save you some money if there is a terminal close by you can go pick it up at.

Saves me a few hundred bucks each time.

 

[phmade]

Thanks for the info.  I don't have a domino- but I'll just use a slot cutter on my router and put in a spline.  Or maybe this is an excuse to buy a domino?

 

[jeep jake]

has anyone used this. http://www.camofasteners.com/
Also I saw quarter sawn ceder that looked pretty sweet.

 

[Kevin D.]

Also I saw quarter sawn ceder that looked pretty sweet.

May look nice, but beware.  While I don't personally have the experience myself, there's a lot of reputable experienced guys who've used cedar outdoors for decks and whatnot who've said that the cedar largely in the past couple of decades is not nearly as durable rot-wise as the cedar of much older.  Seems this is a wood that the cultivations are either fast grown or cultivated too young, and rotting can happen as soon as a decade down the road versus the 25 to 30 years as one's dad could have claimed of the jobs he did many years before.

 

[Deansocial]

has anyone used this. http://www.camofasteners.com/
Also I saw quarter sawn ceder that looked pretty sweet.

Jmb has used them,

Sure he will come along and say what he thinks

 

[jmbfestool]

Did you not use them on the job with me Dean?!  

Thought you had.  

Well the two secret fixing methods I have used so far ARE

Camo Fasteners

AND

TigerClaw TC1-S Softwood Fastener  

For speed I found Camos where faster method of fixing then Tigerclaws.

Also Camos gave me a consistent gap as Tigerclaws depending on how hard you hit the board would vary your gap slightly.

Thing I disliked about Camos is the gap it set between each board and I think is far far to big of a gap for my liking and their is no way to reduce the gap.    

The tigerclaws I could get much smaller gaps between the boards which is what I prefer but again it took longer to fit.

Main benefits about the Camos is your able to remove a board if damaged or needed access for some reason later on with ease.  

With other secret fixings like tigerclaws its not possible with out cutting the board.  

Another benefit of Camo fixings is when you get to the end and you have a trapped board between posts Tiger claws and groove fixings require you to have space to slide the board into the fixing   Camo fixings you can cut your board neatly and drop it from the top straight in.  

This might not be as big of a problem for you Americans as you fit your newel posts after you fitted your decking boards but in UK and I think rest of Europe we fit the newel posts first bolted to the joists.

I wouldnt use  TigerClaw TC1-S Softwood Fastener  again my self mainly because  
1. Not as quick as I thought!  
2. Inconsistant gaps so again slows you down.
3. You can't slide the board left or right once the spikes have located thats IT so if you have two boards joining to make a full length you can end up with a slight gap between the two. IF you doing fancy mitres or running boards difference directions or notched a board around a post you got to make sure when you start knocking the board into the tigerclaw spikes that its in the correct place as their is no moving it into position after
4. You need space to knock the board in which is rubbish when you have a trapped board  (between posts)

I will be using the Camo fixings again but only for standard decking where the client would be happy face fixing the decking but I would never do that as would insist on Camo fixings.
Reasons
1. Gaps little to big
2. You can just see the fixings holes so its more of a discreet fixing method than secret

I my self next time on a higher end quality decking would go for router or biscuit jointer method  Or get pre grooved boards  and use fixings which fixed grooved boards like ones already mentioned.  

I did think of the TigerClaw TC4-S Stainless Steel Ironwood & IPE Fastener
http://www.deckbrokers.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=42&product_id=97
BUT even though these ones might give me a smaller gaps over the other ones which fix grooved boards from above and you can get to them at all times
these  TigerClaw TC4-S  fixings would not allow me to remove a board in the future easily if required because you screw from an angle and wont be able to get to the screw.

JMB

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I have to completely disagree.  The Camo system is slow, cumbersome, hard to keep a consistent spacing and you can see the screw.

Now this is all with hardwood and not PT junk or any man made crap.  Yeah, it is a cheap tool but, it really sucks.  I don't like the TC's for hardwood decks, the extreme Ipe clips really do work the best. 

 

[jmbfestool]

I have to completely disagree.  The Camo system is slow, cumbersome, hard to keep a consistent spacing and you can see the screw.

Now this is all with hardwood and not PT junk or any man made crap.  Yeah, it is a cheap tool but, it really sucks.  I don't like the TC's for hardwood decks, the extreme Ipe clips really do work the best.  

Why is it inconsistent?  As it has a solid metal spacing so unless you dont push the board in place then your not going to get consistent spacing.   Its like sticking a 5mm packer in and then screwin the deck board down.  Tell me how that cant be consistent.

I said you could see the screws  hence why I said it was for people who where happy to see face screws so how is that completely disagreeing with me?

Speed I was comparing with Tigerclaws didnt say it was the fastest method! I have not used other methods to say its the fastest!  Jeep asked has any one used Camos and I answered what I thought

and I said I would go with the groove fixings method which are  extreme IPE clips being one of them type of fixings.  

So completely disagreeing....... I complete disagree with you COMPLETELY disagreeing with me

 

[hockey_magnet]

I have to completely disagree.  The Camo system is slow, cumbersome, hard to keep a consistent spacing and you can see the screw.

Now this is all with hardwood and not PT junk or any man made crap.  Yeah, it is a cheap tool but, it really sucks.  I don't like the TC's for hardwood decks, the extreme Ipe clips really do work the best.  

Why is it inconsistent?  As it has a solid metal spacing so unless you dont push the board in place then your not going to get consistent spacing.   Its like sticking a 5mm packer in and then screwin the deck board down.  Tell me how that cant be consistent.

I said you could see the screws  hence why I said it was for people who where happy to see face screws so how is that completely disagreeing with me?

Speed I was comparing with Tigerclaws didnt say it was the fastest method! I have not used other methods to say its the fastest!  Jeep asked has any one used Camos and I answered what I thought

and I said I would go with the groove fixings method which are  extreme IPE clips being one of them type of fixings.  

So completely disagreeing....... I complete disagree with you COMPLETELY disagreeing with me

+1

I used the CAMO sytem and really liked it except for as JMB said, I think the gap is too wide, The screws are certainly not highly visible and overall do not look bad. Certainly the spacing is perfectly consistent unless you don't use it properly. I would probably not use it with IPE but it is fine for cedar

 

[phmade]

Just wanted to let you all know that we ended up purchasing ipe decking from advantage and the ipe clips.  Hopefully we'll be installing this within the next couple of weeks.  I'll post pictures when it's installed.