RO125 Swirl Marks / sander pad scuff marks

[bkharman]

Are you in Rotex mode?  It almost sounds like you are in the aggressive setting and when you are switching directions, you are getting those swipe marks.

 

[Sparktrician]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.  You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

 

[Stephen B]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.   You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

+1

With my RO150 (and I suspect a 125) it is important how it is held, particularly as you get experience. During the learning phase, and often since, I found it best to have one hand down near the plug it connection, the other either on top or in front of the sander head.

If you decide to swap, apart from the ETS 125 (which is great by the way), also look at the ETS 150/3. Although I do not have an R2 I certainly respect the recommendations from those above who do. Have a talk with your dealer, give them all a try, and get a Festool vac. This makes the critical difference.

Best wishes.

 

[Rutabagared]

I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

I agree.  You can also try the ETS 125 on your material while you are there.  The RO 125 should deliver excellent results with 400 grit.  I use my RO 150 from start to finish (ending at 220 grit, usually) on many projects, and honestly can't distinguish the surface I get from it versus my ETS 125.  Good luck.

 

[cahicks]

Are you in Rotex mode?  It almost sounds like you are in the aggressive setting and when you are switching directions, you are getting those swipe marks.

Nope it is in fine sanding mode

 

[cahicks]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.   You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

We even tried it without the shop vac, it don't chatter like it use too. Yes it is hard to balance and kind of awkward to use.... We bought it online from a Festool dealer so we will have to just ship it back. The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct? That us what have done but have not tried moving it in clockwise circles... THanks for the input. I do think that we can downsize to something that is not as aggressive  and use just a finish sander...

 

[cahicks]

Are you in Rotex mode?  It almost sounds like you are in the aggressive setting and when you are switching directions, you are getting those swipe marks.

Yes we have been using it in the fine sanding mode and have not used the more aggressive mode on this piece of wood

 

[cahicks]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.   You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

+1

With my RO150 (and I suspect a 125) it is important how it is held, particularly as you get experience. During the learning phase, and often since, I found it best to have one hand down near the plug it connection, the other either on top or in front of the sander head.

If you decide to swap, apart from the ETS 125 (which is great by the way), also look at the ETS 150/3. Although I do not have an R2 I certainly respect the recommendations from those above who do. Have a talk with your dealer, give them all a try, and get a Festool vac. This makes the critical difference.

Best wishes.

We even tried it without the shop vac, it don't chatter like it use too. Yes it is hard to balance and kind of awkward to use.... We bought it online from a Festool dealer so we will have to just ship it back. The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct? That us what have done but have not tried moving it in clockwise circles... THanks for the input. I do think that we can downsize to something that is not as aggressive  and use just a finish sander...

 

[cahicks]

I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

I agree.  You can also try the ETS 125 on your material while you are there.  The RO 125 should deliver excellent results with 400 grit.  I use my RO 150 from start to finish (ending at 220 grit, usually) on many projects, and honestly can't distinguish the surface I get from it versus my ETS 125.  Good luck.

I wish we had a local dealer here, but we are in a remote part of Colorado and had to order it online. I think we will get the ETS 125 with the dust collector, since it will be fairly close to the same price that we paid for the RO 125, I can also order some the the Granat paper, I think it is more what we are looking for..

Thanks everyone for the information it has been a huge help

 

[overanalyze]

The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct?

It has RO in fine and agressive modes. On the top the switch has small "dots" and larger "dots". The smaller dots are fine mode.

 

[peter halle]

I think that based on your described usage and also your tool use experience that a more "traditional" finish sander like the ETS lineup would be better for you - and also less expensive if you don't count the CT dust extractor.

In order to minimize sandpaper between different tools, if you call a $600 sandpaper order minimizing, I went to the ETS 150/3.  Absolutely nothing wrong with the 125, just didn't seethe need to have a lifetime supply of two sizes.  The experience of sanding with a tool that does indeed glide over the surface - once you learn to turn down the dust extraction suction is pretty cool.  You can steer the sander by the hose.

Good luck and can't wait to hear about what you ultimately end up trying out.

Peter

 

[Sparktrician]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.  You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

We even tried it without the shop vac, it don't chatter like it use too. Yes it is hard to balance and kind of awkward to use.... We bought it online from a Festool dealer so we will have to just ship it back. The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct? That us what have done but have not tried moving it in clockwise circles... THanks for the input. I do think that we can downsize to something that is not as aggressive  and use just a finish sander...

Untidy Shop is correct, and I forgot to mention it.  With the RO 125 and RO 150, it is much better to hold the sander by the Plug-It connector rather than by the handle grip because it helps to balance the tool and helps you to not get the chatter and jumping around.  Don't discount the RO 125.  It's a great tool.  Just note that the Festool product line is a system, not just a collection of tools.  By this I mean that the Festool abrasives are designed to be used with specific sanders and Festool dust extractors as a system, so to use the sanders with non-Festool abrasives and dust extraction will result in you getting less-than-optimal results and being disappointed as you are.  Are you near a brick-and-mortar Festool dealer where you can try your RO 125 with the Festool abrasives and dust extraction as I mentioned earlier, even if you didn't buy your RO 125 there?  I think that if this is a viable option for you, you'll see an immediate improvement in the tool's performance.  And yes, the true RO mode is the fine sanding mode.  Your comment that using the tool without dust extraction reducing the chatter confirms my suspicion that the full power suction is sucking the abrasives into the material. 

 

[cahicks]

The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct?

It has RO in fine and agressive modes. On the top the switch has small "dots" and larger "dots". The smaller dots are fine mode.

Yup we have it in fine sanding mode

 

[dltflt]

Sooo.... I guess we don't have a way to control the amount of suction..... we were using a shop vac.... I think the RO 125 is more of a sander than what we need. I think we can use the makita until we are ready for the super fine sanding.... New plan is to send back the RO 125 and replace it with the ETS 125 5-inch Random Orbit Sander plus 583360 CT MINI Dust Extractor Package   what are any ones thoughts on this?

That will definitely make a big difference.  You will also enjoy the quiet DC, so much better than any shop vac I have ever owned.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

Don T   yes I hear ya about turning the suction low....... have to see if that helps...

When we are sanding we make a straight "swipe" then move over to the next section with a slight overlap... going back and forth or up and down..... these marks arent scratches its more of a lighter color "line"/ "swipe mark" / "track" from where the edge of the sander passed over......  even using makita or dewalt that comes with the dust collection bag and not suction for dust collection we still get these marks......

I do appreciate all the input, its frustrating to spend almost $500 to not get any better results than what we were getting with a $50 sander...

I have a feeling a lot of people overlooked this comment. So I highlighted it to stand out.

If you are getting similar marks with your other sanders, then you should be looking at what possible technique problems you may have. These are very unusual marks. It almost seems like you are putting a roll-bias into the sander.

I don't have a specific answer for you, but knowing that this is not unique to the current sander may help others come up with some additional ideas.

 

[bkharman]

Sooo.... I guess we don't have a way to control the amount of suction..... we were using a shop vac.... I think the RO 125 is more of a sander than what we need. I think we can use the makita until we are ready for the super fine sanding.... New plan is to send back the RO 125 and replace it with the ETS 125 5-inch Random Orbit Sander plus 583360 CT MINI Dust Extractor Package   what are any ones thoughts on this?

You could get a blast gate on there, not sure it would even work that well to tell you the truth.

I was using my ETS 150 and RO 90 tonight and it is a great thing with the CT dust extractors. I also use Granat almost exclusively. Great stuff!

Hope you make well on this.

Cheers. Bryan.

 

[cahicks]

The marks you're getting indicate two things to me.  First, you have mentioned that you have a shop vac that can't have its suction reduced the way a Festool dust extractor can. That's a problem because it will suck the abrasive down into the wood without your pressing on the sander.   You also said, "it also tends to walk/chatter across the wood".  Second, the pattern of the swirl marks indicates that perhaps you've got the sander imbalanced on the material.  Ever use a 18-24" floor buffer?  They will throw you across the room until you learn to balance the machine on the brush or pad, then you can handle them with one finger.  The principle is the same.  You have to find the balance point of the sander to get it so it just dances on the surface of the material.  I'd suggest you take it back to your dealer (if it's a brick-and-mortar dealer) with some of your material and try it again using a Festool dust extractor turned down to no more than 1/3 power, and be sure you're using Festool abrasives, like Granat.  Also try it in true RO mode, not Rotex mode.  Move the sander CLOCKWISE in 6-8" circles, constantly moving.  I think you'll see a major difference in the results.  Best of luck whichever way you go. 

We even tried it without the shop vac, it don't chatter like it use too. Yes it is hard to balance and kind of awkward to use.... We bought it online from a Festool dealer so we will have to just ship it back. The "true" RO mode is fine sanding mode correct? That us what have done but have not tried moving it in clockwise circles... THanks for the input. I do think that we can downsize to something that is not as aggressive  and use just a finish sander...

Untidy Shop is correct, and I forgot to mention it.  With the RO 125 and RO 150, it is much better to hold the sander by the Plug-It connector rather than by the handle grip because it helps to balance the tool and helps you to not get the chatter and jumping around.  Don't discount the RO 125.  It's a great tool.  Just note that the Festool product line is a system, not just a collection of tools.  By this I mean that the Festool abrasives are designed to be used with specific sanders and Festool dust extractors as a system, so to use the sanders with non-Festool abrasives and dust extraction will result in you getting less-than-optimal results and being disappointed as you are.  Are you near a brick-and-mortar Festool dealer where you can try your RO 125 with the Festool abrasives and dust extraction as I mentioned earlier, even if you didn't buy your RO 125 there?  I think that if this is a viable option for you, you'll see an immediate improvement in the tool's performance.  And yes, the true RO mode is the fine sanding mode.  Your comment that using the tool without dust extraction reducing the chatter confirms my suspicion that the full power suction is sucking the abrasives into the material. 

No we are not near a brick and mortar store that sells these products, I sure wish we were. After thinking on it overnight I feel going to a smaller finish sander is what we need for the type of work that we do. We rarely need to heavy duty material removal setting. Also after pondering the dust/scuff marks on the wood it seems like it is more of a dust track than anything which could be from not having a dust collection system that works properly when using the sanders. We will order the ETS 125 with the extractor and see how it turns out. I will definitely let everyone know how it turns out.

 

[cahicks]

I think that based on your described usage and also your tool use experience that a more "traditional" finish sander like the ETS lineup would be better for you - and also less expensive if you don't count the CT dust extractor.

In order to minimize sandpaper between different tools, if you call a $600 sandpaper order minimizing, I went to the ETS 150/3.  Absolutely nothing wrong with the 125, just didn't seethe need to have a lifetime supply of two sizes.  The experience of sanding with a tool that does indeed glide over the surface - once you learn to turn down the dust extraction suction is pretty cool.  You can steer the sander by the hose.

Good luck and can't wait to hear about what you ultimately end up trying out.

Peter

We are looking forward to not having to hand sand out the "dust tracks" left by the sanders.... also with the work that we do a smaller finish sander is exactly what we need. We are self taught wood workers and pretty much all that we have learned is from trial and error. Now that our business is getting more towards the "high end" type of work we would like to speed up the process but also not compromise the quality and finish..  I am going to exchange the RO 125 for the ETS 125 and extractor package..... since we really need the proper dust control

 

[bkharman]

I think that based on your described usage and also your tool use experience that a more "traditional" finish sander like the ETS lineup would be better for you - and also less expensive if you don't count the CT dust extractor.

In order to minimize sandpaper between different tools, if you call a $600 sandpaper order minimizing, I went to the ETS 150/3.  Absolutely nothing wrong with the 125, just didn't seethe need to have a lifetime supply of two sizes.  The experience of sanding with a tool that does indeed glide over the surface - once you learn to turn down the dust extraction suction is pretty cool.  You can steer the sander by the hose.

Good luck and can't wait to hear about what you ultimately end up trying out.

Peter

We are looking forward to not having to hand sand out the "dust tracks" left by the sanders.... also with the work that we do a smaller finish sander is exactly what we need. We are self taught wood workers and pretty much all that we have learned is from trial and error. Now that our business is getting more towards the "high end" type of work we would like to speed up the process but also not compromise the quality and finish..   I am going to exchange the RO 125 for the ETS 125 and extractor package..... since we really need the proper dust control

If you do a lot of large areas (as you indicated before), perhaps you should go with the 150. The ETS 150 is one of my favorites.