Sander advice for beginner woodworker?

[tm3]

i've decided to inaugurate my move into quality tools by getting a Festool sander and dust extractor.

most of what i've read says, "if you do this type of work, sander X excels over sander Y."  but i'm not sure exactly what kind of use my sander will get, other than what i would call general finishing use.  i'm concluding work on a table for a charcoal grill (and need to sand it), with next project being a workbench but beyond that i'm not sure what all i'm going to do.  i don't plan on refinishing floors, steps, ceilings, boats, etc.

a review in Fine Woodworking ranked the ETS150/3 as the best 6" RO, and said that "you could rely on this tool as your only sander."  sounds good to me.

when i visited the Festool dealer however he seemed to be trying to steer me away from the ETS150/3 and was recommending what i think was the DTS400 (might have been the RTS400).

the "getting the most ..." guide seems to say that the RS2 is the best all around sander for finishing work.

obviously i'm confused.  5" or 6"?  ETS or otherwise?  i realize that i might end up with a stable of sanders but being able to get by with only one at least for a while sounds good.

any suggestions?

 

[Martin Johnson]

TM3,

Unfortunately, there is no easy answer...there are a lot of variables that you should consider.  Do you need to remove material quickly? Are you going to be getting into corners?  Are you going to be straight line sanding?  Do you already own a sander (belt or random orbital)?  This would probably explain why so many different recommendations.  I am familiar with the Fine Woodworking review, but I'm not sure if I completely agree with the conclusions they drew.  For example, The Rotex can be as aggressive as a belt sander, or as smooth as a finish sander when used correctly.  In the aggressive mode, it acts like a grinder with a rotary motion, and the user most control it, as you will be removing material quickly.  In the fine sanding position with the dust extractor set to low speed, it will float over the material and produce excellent results...in training classes we bring rough sawn mahogany to a polished finish with only the Rotex and abrassives.  OK...enough with the critique of the review...Here is how and when I personally use the different sanders in order of preference and how often I use them.  However, based on what you might currently own...I would recommend you get a sander that fills any voids first, and then work on replacing the others as you are able.  This will give you the quickest bang for the buck:

1)  Rotex 150 6" - I reach for this sander more often than any other...it is so versatile...I use it to quickly bring joined parts flush (i.e. rail and stile frames), then switch to finish mode and 150 or 180 grit to prep for staining...I like the 6" because it covers more area, and I can use the same paper on my ETS 150.

2) DTS 125 - I like this sander, because it lets me get into corners and tight spots where the round pad of the Rotex won't go.

3) ETS 150-3 - This is smaller and easier to handle than the Rotex, and has a tighter Random Orbital Pattern (3mm...thus the"3" designation) for scratch free sanding...don't get me wrong...the Rotex can give you scratch free sanding...I just reach for this out of convenience and smaller size

4) LS130 - Straight line sanding on frame and narrow stock...I like the back and forth motion which eliminates the need for hand sanding, particularly helpful when working on large bookcases.  I also like the versatility of the contoured pads for specialty applications.

Hope this helps or at least gives you something to think about.

regards,
martin

 

[bruegf]

I'll second the Rotex recommendation - this was the first Festool I purchased and have never regretted it.  Its not the perfect sander in every situation but I think its the most flexible.  I went w/ the RO125 because I needed to sand some ceilings and the smaller size/lighter weight was a definite advantage when working overhead for several hours, plus most of my projects are relatively small.  If you do a lot of large panels I'd go with the RO150 instead.  Once you have that you can diversify to others as you have the need.

Fred

 

[bonesbr549]

Well I just went through the same decision process.  I was considering the rotex and ended up  with the ets150/3.  The rotex is sharp but for me the seller was that the ets is geared at one handed use which I like (i've owned tons of sanders over the years).  The Rotex is more of a two hander.  I don't think you can go wrong with either, but due to the size of parts I use it for the ETS was a better overall.  I'lll definately add a rotex at some point in the future, but If I had only one I'd still go with the ets.  TM2CW

 

[tm3]

thanks very much for the comments!

as far as filling in any holes in my arsenal, consider my quiver empty at this time.  except for a sanding block, of course.

i thought about the Rotex, but am concerned about repeated comments regarding its "learning curve" that i have read.  plus i figured that for the difference in price for the Rotex, if large stock removal is ever needed (and at this point i don't know how often that will be the case) i could pick up a belt sander and really do some damage.  bonesbr549's comment about one handed use makes sense, also.

not that i've ruled out the Rotex, just sharing why i didn't have it on the short list to begin with.

maybe since i don't foresee building bookcases or doors i should lean towards the 5" size?

on my current project, i can see how the utility of the DTS would come in handy.  would that be a reasonable starter?

 

[tvgordon]

I don't know how much experience you have at woodworking or what type of projects you are planning to build, but I use random orbits sanders far more often than I use use orbital sanders.  I think they remove material faster and leave the wood ready for finishing, but you can't sand into corners and have to be very careful sanding up against another board.
I wouldn't hesitate to buy a rotex or one of the ETS 150 sanders.  But if corners or large flat surfaces are in your future, a DTS or RS2 might be the way to go.
Which ever sander you decide on - you will be amazed at how little dust escapes the vacuum.  I noticed a huge difference going from a DeWalt sander hooked up to a Sears vacuum to the Festools.

Tom.

 

[Martin Johnson]

The DTS is great for getting into corners and does fine on smaller sanding jobs as tvgordon notes...I would not want to use it on a large project like a bookcase or cabinet, as it would take a long time to sand, but I do use mine for tight spots. 

 

[Brice Burrell]

TM, I'd agree with Tom about a random orbit sander being the workhorse of finish sanders. Anyone into woodworking or carpentry needs at least one. What like about RO sander is just how easy they are for anyone to get great results with. If your project are generally smaller then the ETS125 may be a better fit and for larger project the 150. I have both the ETS150/3 and ETS125 sanders. What surprised me was how ofter I found the ETS125 to be the right sander for my jobs, I really expect the 150 to be the sander I reached the most often. Turns out I used the 125 so much I bought another, seems we have both 125s going all the time on our sanding jobs. My point is it can be hard to know just how your work flow is going to play out and which tool(s) fit it best. The good news is Festool offers a 30 no questions asked return policy so if tool you buys doesn't work out, for any reason, you can try again. Good luck and let us know what you decide.   

 

[Jesse Cloud]

For what its worth, I'm retired, spend about 1/3 of my time in the woodshop, build dressers, chairs, tables, cabinets, the whole range of stuff.  I have the Rotex, the 150/3, the LS130, and the RTS300.  The 150 gets used 95% of the time and on every project.  The others are great, but I use them for special purposes (fast removal, polishing, corners, straight line sanding.  If I were going down to one sander, there is no doubt it would be the 150/3.

A few random thoughts:

Compared with the cost of the dust extractor, the sander's are relatively cheap.

Buy sandpaper sparingly until you can tell what you will actually be using.  In most cases its a lot of the lowest grit you will use, and a little of a few finer grits.  If your local dealer doesn't have small packs of paper, try one of the on-line dealers.

I find that the paper lasts way longer than other brands.

The 6inch sander is muchfaster than the 5, almost 50% more area on the disc.

Whatever you decide to do, do it soon.  Your lungs will love you for it.  The dust collection is just unbelievable.

 

[ForumMFG]

Whatever you decide to do, do it soon.  Your lungs will love you for it.  The dust collection is just unbelievable.

I will second that, I bought my CT 22 last monday.  I hooked my RO125 up and went thru the grits.  Starting at 80 and moved all the way up to 4000.  Now I did this before with my RO 125 without the CT.  All I can say is that when it is hooked up to a CT, there is extremely little to no clean up.  After each grit, I ran my hand across the wood and I only collected a very small amount of dust on my hand.  Just amazing.  And it's true that your lungs will love you.  Any of the dust that there might be will not go air born.  At least from my experience.

By the way,  after going up to 4000 grit, the RO125 turn this piece of wood into a mirror.

 

[tm3]

thanks for all the additional comments.  jesse your breakdown of how and how much you use the 150 is especially helpful.

i'm going to go with the 150/3 and either a ct22 or ct33.  leaning towards the 22 and using the difference to buy the hose caddy and/or handle attachments as both look like they would be good to have.

 

[Jesse Cloud]

...  leaning towards the 22 and using the difference to buy the hose caddy and/or handle attachments as both look like they would be good to have.

I think you are leaning in a good direction.  I have the CT22 and love it.  The main difference between it and the 33 is capacity.  But I only empty my CT22 about every 6 weeks or even longer.  The dust from sanding and sawing take a long time to fill a bag.  Routing can fill it faster, but it still takes a long time. 

 

[Tinker]

For me, the Ro 150 is the workhorse.  For many jobs where I can use an inline sander, i like the versatility of the variable pads of the LS 130.  Especially where all grain heads in one direction. 

i am surprised nobody has mentioned the Deltex DX 93.  i do not use it very often, but there are the few times it becomes inexpendable for tight spots and close corners.  I don't have the DTS mentioned, so can't say one way or the other on that one.  I can see it probably can be perfect for most corner work, but with the ones i already have, I don't think i need it.  I am gravitating to much smaller projects, so the DX 93 serves m well in those tight corners.  I might eventually get one of the ETS models.

Tinker

 

[Tinker]

i have one further comment about the RO sander.
I recently did a small lazy susan made up of locust, red oak and white pine.
I had the sanding pad that came with the sander.  It was soft.
I ran into a lot of problem when trying to level going from the very hard hard woods to the softness of the pine.
Before i realized what was happening, i had made a couple of deep scollops into the pine.
I found out there were stiffer pads available.When i put the stiffer pad onto the sander, i was able to flatten the surface.
Original pad>>> 493 916  medium softness
second pad>>>  493 915  stiff pad
Those are for the RO 150

 

[Greg_R]

I have the RO150 and ETS150/3.  Since you are a beginner and new to Festool, I would recommend that you get the ETS150/3.  At maximum speed + low grit paper it has plenty of oomph to smooth down a rough board yet it can produce very fine finishes at lower speeds.  Yes, the RO150 would be a better option for rough sanding and polishing but I would claim that you can get into trouble very quickly with the RO150 (sand right through plywood veneer in 1-2 seconds, etc.).  It is also heavier which plays a factor during long term use.  As mentioned above, also get the stiff pad for the ETS sander (better leveling of the surface).

 

[Mac]

For what it's worth, I'm a relative newbie too, and have been really pleased with the ETS 150/3 and CT Midi combo...it's done everything I've asked of it with ease and is an absolute pleasure to use. I creep around the house when my wife's asleep looking for things to sand...

Another thing I've really enjoyed so far is learning about the range of abrasives available, and trying them out for different tasks. So many choices, so little time..!

Mac

 

[Joe Jensen]

I have the RO150 and ETS150/3.  Since you are a beginner and new to Festool, I would recommend that you get the ETS150/3.  At maximum speed + low grit paper it has plenty of oomph to smooth down a rough board yet it can produce very fine finishes at lower speeds.  Yes, the RO150 would be a better option for rough sanding and polishing but I would claim that you can get into trouble very quickly with the RO150 (sand right through plywood veneer in 1-2 seconds, etc.).  It is also heavier which plays a factor during long term use.  As mentioned above, also get the stiff pad for the ETS sander (better leveling of the surface).

I agree completely.  The 150/3 is my absolute favorite sander.  I also have and RO150, RS2E, RTS400, and LS130.  The RO150 is very versitile, and but it's also much more agressive, and more work to use.

 

[Dan Clermont]

I like the ETS 150/3 as well.

Although, if I am feeling aggressive and am in a hurry I will use the RO 150 for stock removal.

The ETS 150/3 is so smoooothhhh and quiet

Dan Clermont

 

[Mac]

Is it right that we're getting so excited about a sander?
:-\

Mac

 

[justinmcf]

hi tm3, the answer is easy, go for an ets 150/5. great all rounder.  i would think twice about the hose caddy. i made my own for $30 based on photos of what i saw on this forum. in australia the boom arm sells for $500. thats a lot of cash for a couple of pieces of pvc pipe and a few 22.5 degree bends. diy. happy days!
regards, justin.