Sander Foam Backing Pads - Life Limited to Five Years (According to Festool USA)

TinyShop

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Feb 5, 2017
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I am writing to air a (common) frustration, seek some guidance and also present an alternative.

First, in a phone call yesterday with Festool USA, I was told that I shouldn't expect the foam/plastic backing pads (the hook and loop covered disc that mounts directly to the sander - in my case an ETS 150 via an allen head bolt) to "last" more than five years. And by "last" I mean not blow apart under scant use.

I have a thirty five year old Porter Cable ROS still fitted with its original backing pad that's still going strong. Thus, as a consumer, I am insulted that Festool produces a component for its sanders designed to fail in short order (planed obsolescence anyone?). The Festool rep tried to tell me that the foam used is "super soft" to better absorb vibration and thus the negative side effect of this is that the foam degrades after only a short while.

I suppose I wouldn't mind if I used my Festool sander eight hours a day, five days a week. But it sees comparatively very little use. Hence, knowing that every five years I need to dump ~$40 into this tool is, well, disgraceful.

So, the primary reason I reached to Festool USA yesterday was to request guidance on what adhesive I should use to re-glue the two pieces that my backing pad broke apart into. The two parts mate up perfectly (once I properly oriented them in the original configuration) so I really don't see why a little adhesive designed to glue foam to itself and plastic shouldn't work to at least allow me to get a little more life out of this barely used part. So, has anyone tried this and, if so, what was your experience? The Festool rep suggested I not attempt this given how the end result would likely be an unbalanced machine. Another insult. After all, we're not talking nuclear centrifuges here.

Finally, given how the spare Festool-branded pad I (luckily) had (Festool Part# 202460) is not produced in Germany but instead in one of the "China of Europe" countries that manufacturers love to set up operations in to save $ (while not passing those savings on to consumers), I have no allegiance to buying another Festool-branded pad and, instead, am contemplating buying one of the many knock-offs that proliferate on sites like eBay and Amazon. Has anyone tried one of these far less expensive alternatives? And, if so, which one and what was your experience? I simply can't justify spending ~$40 on a spare pad that won't be reliable for when I find myself needing it and am hoping that the knock-offs use the kind of long-lasting foam that my Porter Cable's backing pad utilizes. I'll accept a little more vibration-transfer in exchange for a component that actually stands the test of time.

Thoughts?
 
The odds of success (gluing it back together) are very low. Even if you get glue on every square millimeter of the tear it’s likely to separate again just a mm over from there.

Go ahead and try an aftermarket pad and let us know if it’s works okay.
 
I'm sorry to hear about your experience and your frustration with EVA foam.

The longevity of EVA foam is a known factor in the sneaker world, where collectors will find that the shoes they paid well north of $500 for 20 years ago fall apart at the slightest touch:https://www.highsnobiety.com/p/sneaker-soles-crumbling-trend/

Our neighbor across the street is originally from the Czech Republic, and he is a wonderful human being.  Xenophobia or xenomisia has no place on the FOG, in my estimation.
 
Gluing the pad isn't going to work, the foam will break off in another area as soon as you put pressure on it. Festool should label the package to let people know the life expectancy of the foam pads. Had I known I wouldn't buy extra pads for all my sanders. I just found out recently about the foam when changing the pad.
 
I ran into this with a replacement pad for my RAS 115. Who knows how long it'd been on the shelf waiting for me. Also with the soles of a pair of dress shoes I hadn't worn in fifteen years. Bright side being that fifteen years is a long time to go between funerals.
 
TinyShop said:
Thoughts?

Well - since you asked ….. grow up and quit being an entitled Karen. Look at the news, imagine how your life would be if you and your backing pad were in Ukraine or Gaza right now, and show some basic humility towards the first-world ‘problem’ you’re so indignant about. You’re ‘insulted’ and having to throw out a ‘disgraceful’ 40 bucks every 5 years? 8 dollars a year? 2 cents a week?

Just buy a replacement buddy - and thank your lucky, lucky stars that you live in a situation where a few bucks sent to a tool manufacturer will fix all of your problems.

You have yourself a great day now.
 
As some of my Festool (Festo) gear is 40+ years old I've gone through a few pads over the years. I found if you applied a lot of pressure they tend to break up easier and faster. Having said that I did recently find in my stash a brand new unused pad I bought as a spare for my RS2E 1/2 sheet sander probably 25-30 years ago that the PU had just completely disintegrated.

I do know UV also affects the pad life so I was surprised given it was in a drawer it still fell apart. Still though, I think if you're getting less than 10 years use in a non-industrial, reasonably heavy hobby use scenario, I think there's other factors in play like UV/elements exposure, the way it's used, etc.

I have bought several of the knockoff pads, and have been using them quite heavily in place of the genuine ones the last year or so on my ETS EC's and I haven't found any real difference other than cost. The velcro on the genuine Festool is definitely superior, but if the pads are less than a 1/3rd the cost I can put up with that insignificant issue.
 
woodbutcherbower said:
TinyShop said:
Thoughts?

Well - since you asked ….. grow up and quit being an entitled Karen. Look at the news, imagine how your life would be if you and your backing pad were in Ukraine or Gaza right now, and show some basic humility towards the first-world ‘problem’ you’re so indignant about. You’re ‘insulted’ and having to throw out a ‘disgraceful’ 40 bucks every 5 years? 8 dollars a year? 2 cents a week?

Just buy a replacement buddy - and thank your lucky, lucky stars that you live in a situation where a few bucks sent to a tool manufacturer will fix all of your problems.

You have yourself a great day now.

With the greatest respect this is so far out of line it's unbelievable, and is completely irrelevant to the discussion. Since when did the Gaza or Ukraine become the new Godwin's Law?
 
[member=75217]squall_line[/member] - I'm going to assume you're more intelligent than your comment. Nothing xenophobic about not wanting to be taken advantage of by a "Made in Germany" company increasingly producing its wares in countries and by workers who they can pay far less than Germans (and often skirt the kind of environmental protections they would otherwise have to follow in their home country). The transition to "Made in Europe" is well underway and I, for one, as someone capable of holding two thoughts in my head at the same time am growing increasingly wary of what initially drew me to this company. I don't mind paying a premium when I know that workers are being supported and the environment is being protected (I know, this last point is mostly not true anywhere in the world). But a company that reduces its costs and doesn't pass those savings along to consumers is something I have no patience for.
 
[member=75780]woodbutcherbower[/member] - way to distract from my underlying point while also running defense for a multi-million dollar company.
 
[member=75933]luvmytoolz[/member] - my appreciation to you for staying on topic and providing your real world experience! I, for one, appreciate you taking the time to give me just the kind of feedback I was hoping for. I will definitely follow your lead. :)
 
While i get the frustration at having to replace a little worn pad, i think the ultimate response is a little OTT.
In my opinion, festool pads are the nicest I’ve used, and if the penalty for that is not getting a 20yr lifespan in the pads, I’m fine with it. 

I’m mostly glad i can get sanding pads at a reasonable cost, 10 years after i purchased my sander. Seriously, every sander i owned before festool i could never find a replacement pad for at all.
And external factors must affect this issue considerably, because i have a couple of rotex pads that are way older than 5 years and still going strong.
 
Please 86 the country, nationality , etc component of this discussion.

Seth
 
One thing to note / realize is that Festool (and likely no other company) will ever suggest how to repair something like a tool. If they tell someone to use 'X' glue and the pad comes apart and injury occurs ....................  law suit time.

Seth
 
Unfortunately, pads are just a consumable. I've replaced pads on a Porter Cable, a Dewalt and on 2 Festool's. The Dewalt lasted 2 years, the Festool lasted 6-7 years and the PC lasted about 10 years. All were kept in metal or plastic containers to exclude UV and stored in a climate controlled environment.

I've actually had to replace pads on the Festool's more often because of the hook & loop wearing away. I didn't have those issues with the Dewalt or PC sanders because the abrasive was PSA-backed.
 
TinyShop said:
Finally, given how the spare Festool-branded pad I (luckily) had (g) is not produced in Germany but instead in one of the "China of Europe" countries that manufacturers love to set up operations in to save $ (while not passing those savings on to consumers),
...
Thoughts?
/Apologies to mods, hoping to educate the person in Q, not open political discussions at all./

Preface:
None of us here are guilty of a "lack of knowledge" on our own volition. So I cannot be surprised by your lack of awareness about Festool the same way an American should not be bothered by my lack of awareness on how Milwaukee came to be a tool company. That is just the nature of the world being too big and diverse.

On topic:
1) The pads are made of the EVA foam which inherently degrades over time and which has no known subsitute (equivalent function at a sane price).

2) The pads are made in Czech Republic by TTS at their (Narex) Česká Lípa plant. A business/plant founded in 1930s that started making electric power tools in 1943. I am not sure bashing that business unit, as "Europe's China" is a good idea. Maybe you can accuse the Czechs for knowing how to make stuff and teaching the Chinese in the 1950s and 1960s on that. So their children can then flood the US market in the 1990s+. Guilty as charged!

[size=10pt]Now, how come "Narex" in Česká Lípa, Czech Republic, about 300 miles from Wendlingen(!), makes tools "for Festool"?
Guess what. Today's TTS Tooltechnic came to be what it is by the merger of Festo and Narex (and Holz-Her, etc.) operations when TTS acquired the Narex company in 1994. Narex was about the same size as the Festo business at the time. All the three plants of TTS today (Wendlingen, Česká Lípa and the new one in DE) are part of the same manufacturing chain. A chain which is in place for the last 25 years or so. No one "moved" or "is moving" anything anywhere as far as TTS production facilities go.

In the 1990s-2010s TTS had three brands as a result of above:
Festo/Festool - a global brand, based on the original Festo portfolio, expanded with Narex-designed tools
Protool - a global brand, based on the original Narex portfolio, expanded with Festo-designed and Holz-Her-designed specialist tools and having an extensive OEM program to complement
Narex - a local brand for Czech/Slovak market retaining the original Narex portfolio "as is" for the most part.

In 2013 the Protool brand was abolished and its in-house tools "became" either Festool (DRC/PDC, stone cutting, DR 20  etc.) or Narex (drills, some specialist tools).
Either way, no Protool or Narex power tools were ever distributed in the US, so it is absolutely understandable you would not be aware of their existence. But these were the chaps competing along the Metabo's and Makita's of this world no so long ago. Now their core tech is underwriting the Festool kit.
 
When I bought my RO 150 I also bought a spare pad so I had one on stock, obviously I didn't know at the time they had a shelf life.

The original pad lasted about 10 years before it started breaking up, you can imagine my surprise when I put the "new" one on and it only lasted literally 5 minutes!

I wasn't happy at the time but a quick Google and I realised the error of my ways, everyday is a school day.

 
Doug S said:
When I bought my RO 150 I also bought a spare pad so I had one on stock, obviously I didn't know at the time they had a shelf life.

The original pad lasted about 10 years before it started breaking up, you can imagine my surprise when I put the "new" one on and it only lasted literally 5 minutes!

I wasn't happy at the time but a quick Google and I realised the error of my ways, everyday is a school day.

Once I realised the effects of applying too much pressure or allowing the heat to build up when sanding, and adjusted my usage appropriately my pads started lasting between 10-15 years. I've got 11 Festool sanders (technically 10 + the BS105) so if I had to look at replacing pads every few years at a minimum cost of $105AUD each I'd be re-thinking things. But luckily with prudence they last quite well.
 
This thread jinxed me, I had to toss three pads today for my Rotex 150, switched to the RO125 and the armature gave up the ghost. Had to buy a new sander as I am in the middle of a project and cannot wait for two weeks for a repair. Frustrating...but life. Will never stock extra pads for any sander again....
 
I live with the fact that having Festool power tools the consumables and purchase price comes at a price. If the sand paper, sanding disc or blade gives me better results with less time or more time with perfect results than it’s worth it. I

We pay about $5 a gallon for gas in California this summer it got up to $6.50

Lastly, most of the jobs I do on repairing houses I expect to ruin sanding discs and go through a bunch of sand paper and that’s the tip of the iceberg. I somehow killed my Midi vacuum by doing a software upgrade. I’ve had the CT-MIDI 1 for almost 4 years, so yah it’s frustrating but stuff breaks and things wear out. It’s just the nature of synthetic materials.  Also dealers need to sell the stuff and make a profit, COGS and company profits, research and development, engineering. Support staff, sales and marketing staff, etc.  so that thing that cost $5 to make when produced in lots of 5,000 ends up costing more at the retail level.

While we are lamenting, I noticed that the jars of Tikka Masala and spaghetti sauce are getting smaller at Costco. Shrinkflation.
 
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