Sawstop PCS 52" fence...Did you replace it or augment it?

[Festdewalkita]

I'm coming from a Dewalt DWS 7480 portable with rack and pinion, but the stars have aligned and I have a 3HP PCS on order.  I have an Incra LS router table and it was everything I thought it would be (with the exception of a need for a mod for the JessEm clearcut stock guides to get the full range).  The repeatability and accuracy is flawless.

I looked at the PCS 36" and ICS 52" at my Woodcraft before ordering, but afterwards found myself wondering if there's any way to avoid the set/tap, tap, tap.  That's really going to add up over time, especially since I'm a tad obsessive/compulsive.

Are people using the Woodpecker Rip-Flip, or Incra LS-TS?  The Woodpecker install is at least partially shown on their marketing video, but I don't see anything for the LS-TS in regards to a Sawstop PCS.

To do it well, what's the time/difficulty quotient for those that have done one of these mods?

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[rmhinden]

I have the 36" PCS with the same fence you refer to.    I haven't had any issues with it and find it easy to get to the measurement I want.

I think if I wanted to enhance it, I would go with the Woodpecker Rip-Flip.    I like that it can be used to get to the same measurement repeatability and it doesn't seem too hard to install.

Bob

 

[Alanbach]

Like Bob I have no issues with mine. I hear these tap tap complaints all the time but I just don’t get it. If the fence rails are properly installed and the fence itself is adjusted correctly you should have no issues at all. I have used some form of Besemeyer style fence for a really long time so I have practiced at getting the fence head just loose enough to slide smoothly with Ike being tight enough to not wobble much before lock down. I am also in the well established habit of pulling the locking handle towards me and checking the cursor before lock down.

Having said that there are many that have chosen to install Incra fence systems on their table saws. They swear by them. For me, they are big and bulky and take up way too much space to the right of the saw but that’s just me.

 

[twistsol]

I use a metric  Incra TS/LS on a Ridgid R4512 ... and yes the fence cost twice what the saw did. Before I bought the TS/LS fence, I verifiec that it is compatible with the SawStop PCS which is on my list of shop upgrades The rails for the TS/LS mount in t tracks on brackets that can be adjusted vertically so as long as you have holes in the side of the front and rear of your table, it can be mounted.

It took me less than an hour to remove the OEM rails and replace them with the TS/LS rails, mount and align the fence. The only thing I would do differently today is not by the 52" set (8" rails and leg set) since anything over 30" can easily be done with my TS75.

[attachimg=1]

 

[Birdhunter]

I have the 52” ICS SawStop. I recently added the Rip-Flip. It’s great for repeatability and for fine adjustments. The magnifier over the fence ruler makes setting the fence very accurate.

It is very critical to follow the Rip-Flip installation instructions exactly. You will be removing bolts that secure the fence rail. If you remove too many at the same time, you will have a difficult realignment task ahead of you.

I’ve had my saw for many years and I like the fence. It’s solid and I’ve had to adjust it only once. I’d suggest using the stock fence for a while before considering a replacement.

I have the saw on the SawStop mobile base. Works great. I added a dedicated Festool Mini to the overarm blade guard. The dust collection is excellent.

 

[mike_aa]

[member=74097]Festdewalkita[/member]  If you decide on the Incra LS TS, I believe the Sawstop can be ordered without a fence at a reduced cost.

Mike A.

 

[Festdewalkita]

...I hear these tap tap complaints all the time but I just don’t get it...I am also in the well established habit of pulling the locking handle towards me and checking the cursor before lock down.

I took a cabinet class at Woodcraft...the instructor using the ICS 52" was a contractor that had the Sawstop himself and built custom homes.  He was constantly tap tap tapping to get it where he wanted...it was only a few seconds each time, but...still.

I may get to where you are Alanbach, but I'm just starting and all I have to reference are the DWS7480's rack and pinion and the Incra router LS.  They are set, lever--done; I think the PCS 52" is going to be a big adjustment for me since I'm too picky.  At least it has mm (in addition to inches), and a built-in magnifier!

Having said that there are many that have chosen to install Incra fence systems...they are big and bulky and take up way too much space to the right of the saw...

Something I hadn't really considered, and which may end up pushing me to the Woodpeckers Rip-Flip to dial in what I want and for repeatability.  It seems slower-to-use than the Incra, but at least it's cheaper, available now (as of today, anyways), and doesn't take up more room when stowing (wife-and-my 'shop' is half garage, half equipment storage/workspace).  The Incra is advertising a 20-24 week wait, so that's why I'm even sweating this decision now (I was told it'll be 8-10 weeks before the Sawstop comes in at Woodcraft).

...The only thing I would do differently today is not by the 52" set (8" rails and leg set) since anything over 30" can easily be done with my TS75.

[attachimg=1]

I have the Makita short and long rails with Makita rail saw and TSO guide rails.  The short and long I stow on my garage door using the Fastcap rail stowing product.  I noticed breaking down sheet goods the other day that they are both straight longitudinally, but cupped transversely (if that makes sense).  I also noticed I stink at getting good cuts with the long one (the repeatability using the TSO is phenomenal, but I think part of the problem with *square* & straight cutting is that I'm still cutting on the floor with a piece of insulation).  I considered buying Festool replacement tracks, especially the FS 1900/2 (seems like a good medium size), but then threw caution to the wind and tacked to a TS upgrade.  I'll likely still use the Makita tracks to break down sheets into something more manageable.

I have the 52” ICS SawStop. I recently added the Rip-Flip. It’s great for repeatability and for fine adjustments. The magnifier over the fence ruler makes setting the fence very accurate.

It is very critical to follow the Rip-Flip installation instructions exactly. You will be removing bolts that secure the fence rail. If you remove too many at the same time, you will have a difficult realignment task ahead of you.

I’ve had my saw for many years and I like the fence. It’s solid and I’ve had to adjust it only once. I’d suggest using the stock fence for a while before considering a replacement.

I have the saw on the SawStop mobile base. Works great. I added a dedicated Festool Mini to the overarm blade guard. The dust collection is excellent.

Thanks for this!  I have no problem following well-written instructions to a T.  I'd seen your posts here, and got a lot out of them.  I ordered it with the industrial mobile base, due to inputs like yours.

[member=74097]Festdewalkita[/member]  If you decide on the Incra LS TS, I believe the Sawstop can be ordered without a fence at a reduced cost.

Mike A.

I'd read that somewhere, but didn't see that as an option when I ordered and forgot all about asking.  I don't know how that changes mounting the LS-TS, and now wonder about that.  It's only been a couple days...maybe I can  go back on Monday and mod my order, then put in for the Incra.  When you've waited 10 weeks for your saw, what's another 14 for a fence?  It gives me time to find someone else's solution to that problem, or figure out how to blaze that trail, if needed.

 

[Max Fracas]

Good luck on your decision.  I had a metric LS-TS on my old (80s vintage) Craftsman contractor saw.  Loved the Incra fence, and when I bought my Sawstop ICS my plan was to put the Incra fence on it.  Ended up liking the Sawstop fence too much.  Considered setting the Craftsman saw up as a dedicated dado saw, but with the Incra installed the footprint was too large to warrant it in my smallish shop.  Haven’t let go of the Incra yet and frankly wonder how it’ll sell given that it’s metric.

 

[bruegf]

Why not add the wixey digital readout.  You get repeatability and accuracy. 

Fred

 

[HarveyWildes]

I have the 52” ICS SawStop. I recently added the Rip-Flip. It’s great for repeatability and for fine adjustments. The magnifier over the fence ruler makes setting the fence very accurate.

It is very critical to follow the Rip-Flip installation instructions exactly. You will be removing bolts that secure the fence rail. If you remove too many at the same time, you will have a difficult realignment task ahead of you.

I’ve had my saw for many years and I like the fence. It’s solid and I’ve had to adjust it only once. I’d suggest using the stock fence for a while before considering a replacement.

I have the saw on the SawStop mobile base. Works great. I added a dedicated Festool Mini to the overarm blade guard. The dust collection is excellent.

Ditto on all points, except that I never use the mobile base and have it connected to a dust collector, which works great.

 

[Festdewalkita]

[member=74097]Festdewalkita[/member]  If you decide on the Incra LS TS, I believe the Sawstop can be ordered without a fence at a reduced cost.

Mike A.

Just got off the phone with Woodcraft...gal answering knew of no way to order without a fence.  I didn't see that as an option on the Sawstop website when I was tinkering there, either.  Maybe some of their retailers are doing their own thing, but as a TTS Tooltechnic Systems product, that would seem to be atypical.

Why not add the wixey digital readout.  You get repeatability and accuracy. 

Fred

That's reapeatable-ish and accurate to its tolerance, plus you're still tap-tapping.  I wanted dead-on repeatable, and quick...like a story stick or a locked-in rack & pinion fence or Incra LS.

I'm still curious if anyone has done a Sawstop & LS-TS and may eventually go that route, but for now it looks like the easy button Rip-Flip for me.

Thanks for all the inputs.

 

[mike_aa]

Just got off the phone with Woodcraft...gal answering knew of no way to order without a fence.  I didn't see that as an option on the Sawstop website when I was tinkering there, either.  Maybe some of their retailers are doing their own thing, but as a TTS Tooltechnic Systems product, that would seem to be atypical.

That's too bad [member=74097]Festdewalkita[/member].  When I asked at my local Woodcraft store they quoted me a price without the fence, but that was a while back so maybe it was a dealer thing specific to that store or the option is no longer available.  My plans changed so I never ended up making the purchase.  As [member=18240]Max Fracas[/member] said earlier, I too have my Incra on an old Sears contractor saw (12" blade capacity).  With the speed of setting up and precision I get I can't imagine using any other fence.

Mike A.

 

[serge0n]

That's reapeatable-ish and accurate to its tolerance, plus you're still tap-tapping. 

I have the Wixey installed on my PCS and it's dead on repeatable. Yes, tap-tapping is still there if you want it accurate to 0.1 mm, but the benefit of Wixey is that you can easily re-calibrate it to zero after any blade change. Saw kerf varies just slightly from blade to blade and I reset the fence to zero every time I change the blade unless I know for a fact that the blade I'm installing has teeth of exactly the same width.
How easy is it to zero in the Incra fence?

 

[rmhinden]

[member=74097]Festdewalkita[/member]

BTW, there is an active SawStop Users' Group on Facebook you can join.  Another good place to ask questions about Sawstop products.

Bob

 

[bruegf]

That's reapeatable-ish and accurate to its tolerance, plus you're still tap-tapping. 

I have the Wixey installed on my PCS and it's dead on repeatable. Yes, tap-tapping is still there if you want it accurate to 0.1 mm, but the benefit of Wixey is that you can easily re-calibrate it to zero after any blade change. Saw kerf varies just slightly from blade to blade and I reset the fence to zero every time I change the blade unless I know for a fact that the blade I'm installing has teeth of exactly the same width.
How easy is it to zero in the Incra fence?

I agree, mine is very precise and repeatable.  Accuracy is far better than using magnifier and scale or a tape measure.  In fact accuracy is far better than woodworking requires (.002" per foot) so with my 36" fence I can be off by less than .01".

 

[Christophl]

Ugh...I see what you all are talking about now, I dialed in the SS fence yesterday, and both faces are not flat.  It's undulating!  Has anyone just tried just mounting a 8020 alum extrusion mounted to the fence?  So crappy for such an expensive saw.

 

[ChuckM]

How old is your SS fence, Chris?

I know the very old fences (15 years ago?) were made of poor quality ply, but customer feedback resulted in improvement.

Out of curiosity, I went out and checked both faces of the fence (about 12 measurements at various spots) with a Veritas alum. 50" straight edge. I found my fence more than flat and straight for any woodworkers. The readings were between 0.001" and 0.002", mostly 0.001".

I hadn't checked the flatness before...but I have not had any issues with cutting results so I always presumed the fence was all fine. I was still surprised by the results because my shop undergoes extreme swings in humidity throughout the year. The saw has been subject to constant (hobby) use since it was bought 7 years ago.

 

[Birdhunter]

My ICS has some minor waviness in the white material lining the fence. It’s in the 1 to 3 thousandths so no measurable effect on cutting wood. I used the Woodpecker micrometer tool that rides in the T slot. I also used that tool to align the fence.  I used the same tool to check the table-blade squareness.  It was dead on.

I wanted to clarify that I use an Oneida cyclone dust collector but added a dedicated Mini to the overarm blade guard. It’s great for those cuts trimming off an edge. Usually, those cuts throw a lot of dust. Now, no dust.

 

[rst]

I have an 8020 1545 (1.5" x 4.5") 50" extrusion mounted to my Beismeyer fence.  This allows me to use the slots for attaching hold downs and other fixtures.  I too use two vacs for table saw dust collection.  I have an old 40-50s era Delta saw that has an integrated dust shoot that attaches to a Fein vac with an Oneida steel cyclone on a 30 gallon steel grease drum. The overhead collection is a cheap Penn State Industries over arm that I modified and is connected to another Fein.  Even with cutting plastics I have minimal chip escape, the sides of the over blade capsule has 4" brush rather than plastic for the sides and back.

 

[ChuckM]

I'm coming from a Dewalt DWS 7480 portable with rack and pinion, but the stars have aligned and I have a 3HP PCS on order.  I have an Incra LS router table and it was everything I thought it would be (with the exception of a need for a mod for the JessEm clearcut stock guides to get the full range).  The repeatability and accuracy is flawless.
Snip.

The SS PCS including its professional fence gives me everything I need from a table saw for fine furniture making. The only upgrade I made to the fence -- with no regrets -- is the Clearcut Stock Guides. Not only does the stock guides system add to the safety (no chances of kickback when it's used), it also allows me to rip a large ply sheet with ease. Because the stock's edge is kept tight to the fence at all times as it is being fed, the stock comes out as true as it can be.

I also have the Jessem's new miter gauge...very pricey, but crosscut results are consistent and reliable.