Small table saw options?

[jimmylittle]

I am a custom cabinet and furniture maker in New York.  Obviously, I work in small spaces.

I'm looking for a small table saw.  It doesn't need to be too powerful, or have a huge capacity.  I currently use the 10" Bosch GTS1031Bosch which is small, can be carried in one hand by its integrated roll cage, and has an 18" official rip capacity. (can be stretched to 23" by removing a set screw).  I like it, but it's still too big to drag onto a job site to rip an occasional filler strip or to rough out a scribe.  It also has a terrible 1/16" thick metal throat plate, so making zero-clearance inserts is not really (safely) possible.  If I need zero-clearance, I usually just double-stick a sacrificial piece down, and raise the blade through it.

I was hoping to get the TS55REQ insert and a CMS.  I rarely use a portable router table (I have a stationary one in the shop), but it can't hurt to have it, especially if I can pop the track saw in for an occasional rip.  Alas, the insert is NAINA, so the CMS won't be of much use...

So, back to square one.  I'm looking for a small (6-8" blade) table saw with a small (6-12" max) rip capacity that can go through nothing more than a ¾" piece of hardwood.  Decent dust collection is a huge plus.  Does anybody on the FOG have a suggestion?

 

[NYC Tiny Shop]

It's funny that you're asking this because I was recently in a similar situation where the space was too small and the job too brief to warrant shlepping my new DeWalt DWE7491rs table saw.  (It's a nice saw, with a deeper throat.) I had a few rips to make and was happy that I thought of bringing some hand saws with me.  Happy that I can cut a very straight line and occassionally walk one, too!

 

[elfick]

Unfortunately I don't have an answer to your actual question, but I do have a counter-question...
I know these type of cuts are much easier on a table saw, particularly if you are doing more than one, but for the occasional one-off cut, why not just use the TS55?

 

[deeka]

although the table saw CMS insert is NAINA, you can easily buy one on ebay. I have one, use it with the TS55 and TS75 and love it.

 

[w802h]

I think there is probably a lot of room for improvement in this market.  My jobsite saw is a Bosch 4100 w/Gravity Rise Stand and I certainly wouldn't want to trade lower performance for a smaller footprint.  With only a couple of cabinets, there isn't a lot of room for the saw in my truck.  Yet there is always a shelf cleat or piece of trim that needs ripping.  I'd like to see something with higher cut quality, greater portability, and a soft start motor than currently available.  If I'm going to pay CMS prices, I want the controls easy to get to.  I may be asking too much of a small machine.  The best table saws are cast iron for a reason. 

 

[jimmylittle]

Unfortunately I don't have an answer to your actual question, but I do have a counter-question...
I know these type of cuts are much easier on a table saw, particularly if you are doing more than one, but for the occasional one-off cut, why not just use the TS55?

That's what I do now, but there are situations where I can't have the MFT/3 with me, and I just set up on top of the kitchen island or something, with 1" foam as a sacrificial table.  Balancing the track on a 1-¼" stile to rip it is next to impossible.

Also, there are situations where the rip is not exactly straight, and a little free handing is necessary.  I find it a lot cleaner and safer (for me, anyway) to do these sorts of things on a table saw, then clean it up with a hand plane or a little sanding.  I've tried with the Carvex, but even with the zero-clearance inserts, I get some tearout on the top side in pre-finished material. 

I know a lot of people don't like the idea of free handing on a table saw, but it has been working for me for 20+years.  I would never do anything big freehand.  To me, shaving a few mm of the edge of a stile is much safer when you know the blade is not going to move out of position.  On a table saw, the blade is where it is, and you can be safe enough to move around it if you go slow and pay attention.

i may take deeka's advice and hit up eBay and see what I can find.

 

[tiralie]

To me, shaving a few mm of the edge of a stile is much safer when you know the blade is not going to move out of position. 

I just use a jigsaw, and clean up the edge with a block plane. easy, quick and light to carry around.
Tim

 

[Len Coleman]

might fit all your requirements except cost.

http://www.jlconline.com/saws/mafell-erika-pull-push-saw_o.aspx?playlist=playlist____96_2106899&plitem=1

 

[w802h]

The Erika looks like an inspired machine that could fit my needs.  I think the others are looking for even smaller.  The price is certainly hefty, but it's hard putting a price on a machine that's a joy to use.  With most of my commutes within 15 minutes, I could more readily afford two trips to go process something in my shop or bring back the saw to the job even if I was off the clock during that time.

I might try a power plane for some of the mentioned tasks.  I frequently use downcutting blades in my jigsaw.  They require patience cutting (slow), don't hold a line as well as upcut blades, and are more prone to bending and deflecting, but they don't tearout the top surface.

 

[tiralie]

While I would have bought an Erika before I bought my Bosch I would still like to have one and I think it's a great machine but when I was looking for a portable saw it really didn't meet the requirements. While the design makes it portable, it is hardly usable on site because it's only available in 220. There really is no clear service/repair in Canada. If the machine ever needs service (and they will sooner or later) or parts how long and where do you go?

We take it for granted that we can just send our Festools for service or order parts but it's part of the benefits of owning and using Festools.
Tim

 

[TelcoRandy]

Tim, you can get a 120V Erika EC70 from Timberwolftools.com as stated in Len C's link above.
But I do agree, with Festool everything is easier when it comes to getting accessories, consumables, services, etc. Timberwolftools is the only Mafell dealer in North America and I imagine the service/repair would somehow go through them or directly back to Mafell in Germany.

 

[NYC Tiny Shop]

Jimmy,
Maybe this could work?

http://www.amazon.com/Electric-Speed-Table-000rpm-Included/dp/B00GKRON1E/ref=pd_ys_ir_all_475

 

[Colonel Panic]

Jimmy,
Maybe this could work?

http://www.amazon.com/Electric-Speed-Table-000rpm-Included/dp/B00GKRON1E/ref=pd_ys_ir_all_475

Cool little saw but max cut is only 3/4 inch. Might work for Barbie cabinets.  ;D

 

[NYC Tiny Shop]

Jimmy,
Maybe this could work?

http://www.amazon.com/Electric-Speed-Table-000rpm-Included/dp/B00GKRON1E/ref=pd_ys_ir_all_475

Cool little saw but max cut is only 3/4 inch. Might work for Barbie cabinets.  ;D

That's what Jimmy said he was looking to cut..."  that can go through nothing more than a ¾" piece of hardwood"

 

[NYC Tiny Shop]

Maybe this one is better?

http://www.amazon.com/Proxxon-37070-FET-Table-Saw/dp/B005FI3MKC/ref=sr_1_9?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1399701174&sr=1-9&keywords=Mini+table+saw#productDetails

 

[jimmylittle]

After some searching, and following links posted here, I think I may have a contender...

I read a review of the Proxxon saw, and someone in an Amazon review said "don't get it, get the Byrne instead"

Here is the Byrne

Apparently, Byrne is well known for their small machines in the model-making world.  This one has a precision fence, indexed miter gauge, and can cut up to 13/16" in hardwood.  It also advertises a dust collection port and uses standard 4" blades on a 1/3HP motor.

The specs say it's 12"x18"x7", so I may just be able to wrangle it into a Sys5...

 

[jacko9]

I'm not sure if you can find one but, the Swiss made Inca 10" Major Table saw is a gem.

Jack

 

[gimima]

Inca 259 -
Yes, wonderful small machines, but not portable by any means.  Great for a small shop.  Have to get used to the tilting table.  Very nice Swiss machine.  I have one now.

 

[juststartingout]

I just bought a Bosch 4100 for my garage workshop.  As previously mentioned it's a great saw but not exactly super portable.  The gravity rise stand helps stow it a way when not in use in my shop.  I'm a hobbyist so taking it from site to site is a not something I do but space is a premium in my San Francisco garage  :-\  If you've got a couple of folks in your crew its an easy lift to on and off a truck.  If you're working solo it might not be such an easy lift especially after a long work day.

As for the quality of the saw my initlal reactions are good, but def not a festool as it required some assembly and adjustments out of the box.  I had to put the stand together and once that was put together when i fired up the saw the riving knife was misaligned, so I had to adjust that too.  Cut quality on the stock blade leaves lots more tear out than I was expecting.  This is my first experience with a non festool saw outside of a sawstop with a freud diablo blade. 

Once I replace the blade with a higher quality Diablo I'm sure that will change.  Overall though I would recommend the Bosch 4100.

Cheers,

Oscar

 

[gimima]

I know this isn't exactly what you need but I think it is worth mentioning to those out there who haven't seen this.
Check out Bridge City Tool Works and look for the JMPv2 Jointmaker Pro.
http://www.bridgecitytools.com/default/tools/in-production/jmpv2-jointmaker-pro.html
What a nifty little saw.  Look at the demo video.  What you can do without electricity and  you have to love the build quality.
If they can only provide greater ripping options.