Thoughts on Osmo Poly X

[Cheese]

I am considering trying to adapt the Festool Surfix system to use with various Osmo products. Since both are hard wax finishes, differing in oils used and waxes used, I am interested in seeing how the process works with Osmo. Essentially the process is to sand raw wood to 180, apply the first coat of finish, let it soak in for fifteen minutes and then use a ROS (for me an ETS EC 150/5) with the green vlies pad to buff the finish in. Then, use an absorbent cloth to wipe off excess finish. After a cure time of eight hours (or more for some conditions), sand with Granat 220 followed by another thin coat of finish....let it absorb for fifteen minutes and buff it with the white vlies (non-woven abrasive equivalent to 0000 steel wool without the metal bits) and wipe off the excess. The actual Surfix oil I like OK but it's a bit too matte for my tastes

Whenever I've used Surfix, both Outdoor & One-Step, I've always used the green pad & the white pad on a Rotex 125 in the gear driven Rotex mode. That seems to produce a bit more sheen especially when using the white pad.

 

[hdv]

I had contact with the people from Woca. They advised me to use the red pads after the first coat, and the white pads after the second coat. Or, if I can't find white pads, fleece pads. Meanwhile I found a source for both red and white pads (non-3M) for about €1 a piece. I am planning to try those pads, as well as the huck towels.

 

[jcrowe1950]

I am considering trying to adapt the Festool Surfix system to use with various Osmo products. Since both are hard wax finishes, differing in oils used and waxes used, I am interested in seeing how the process works with Osmo. Essentially the process is to sand raw wood to 180, apply the first coat of finish, let it soak in for fifteen minutes and then use a ROS (for me an ETS EC 150/5) with the green vlies pad to buff the finish in. Then, use an absorbent cloth to wipe off excess finish. After a cure time of eight hours (or more for some conditions), sand with Granat 220 followed by another thin coat of finish....let it absorb for fifteen minutes and buff it with the white vlies (non-woven abrasive equivalent to 0000 steel wool without the metal bits) and wipe off the excess. The actual Surfix oil I like OK but it's a bit too matte for my tastes

Whenever I've used Surfix, both Outdoor & One-Step, I've always used the green pad & the white pad on a Rotex 125 in the gear driven Rotex mode. That seems to produce a bit more sheen especially when using the white pad.

Hi Cheese,

    Using the Surfix oils I've never had an issue getting a dead smooth finish. I use the supplies from the kit which includes Rubin 180 for the final step before the first coat of oil followed by the green Vlies pad. Then after proper cure time, comes a light sanding with Granat 220 and followup with the white Vlies pad. It just does not work with Osmo Polyx. For Osmo products I am going back to using small cut up either white non-woven pads or the Festool gold P1000 vlies pads....202307. BTW, thanks to everybody for all the fantastic comments.

 

[ChuckM]

On sanding, I stop at 220X as per the Osmo instructions:https://osmo.ca/information/how-to-guides/

I also do not sand between coats...if there're small particles (nibs?) on the surface, I remove them with a razor blade. But like many other things in woodworking, there're always various ways to achieve the same kind of result:
https://www.finewoodworking.com/2017/05/31/osmo-oil-durable-easy-use-non-toxic

Note the comments to that article about using thin coats only -- the same advice given to me by the furniture store owners who sold the oil and one that I take to heart.

 

[ear3]

[member=59039]mrFinpgh[/member]  I've finished a few things with Osmo that were smooth planed, though mostly smaller items like drawers or boxes.  I wouldn't say that the results are great.  If the grain is not that complex, it comes out ok, but I find the Osmo (maybe because I use matte?) does dull the surface relative to other oils I've used on plane finished wood.  If the wood has complex grain, though, there's definitely some funkiness in how it absorb/reflects the light.  You can kind of see this on the drawer face and sliding door I made out of cherry for a small cabinet that had some interesting grain patterns.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

But again, maybe this effect is exacerbated by my choice of matte, and a satin or semi-gloss might look better?

 

I doubt it would be possible to "resaw" the pads in half, but you can cut them up into much smaller squares -- a tiny pad still goes a long way.

Some people like to use the slightly abrasive red pad to apply Osmo as well.  I've never tried it, since I'm usually finishing stuff at relatively high grits and don't want to risk marring the surface, but supposedly it works.

The red pads work great for the first coat of Osmo.  Especially if you stop sanding around 150.  I always do a 2nd coat w/ the white pad.

I think in general the HW Oils seem to be better suited to finishes where the sanding stops around 150/180.  What I'm curious to see is whether you could do a 100% planed surface and whether the finish would do better, worse, or the same.

 

[mrFinpgh]

[member=59039]mrFinpgh[/member]  I've finished a few things with Osmo that were smooth planed, though mostly smaller items like drawers or boxes.  I wouldn't say that the results are great.  If the grain is not that complex, it comes out ok, but I find the Osmo (maybe because I use matte?) does dull the surface relative to other oils I've used on plane finished wood.  If the wood has complex grain, though, there's definitely some funkiness in how it absorb/reflects the light.  You can kind of see this on the drawer face and sliding door I made out of cherry for a small cabinet that had some interesting grain patterns.

....

But again, maybe this effect is exacerbated by my choice of matte, and a satin or semi-gloss might look better?

 
/quote]

Thanks, [member=37411]ear3[/member]  for sharing these images.  I wonder what the outcome of this would have been if you had sanded the wood to 150 and then applied it instead?  There's a lot of funk happening in the grain.  I'd guess any penetrating finish might have a similar effect, if the grain is changing directions or there's bits of end grain happening along the way.  I definitely find a difference in film finishes vs oils when it comes to the weird stuff.  I suppose the prismatic effect of a smooth film might lead the brain to 'process' the surface differently than a simply 'wetted' surface.

I have some Ash and some Rubio color oil I want to play with. I'll try to remember to do a comparison and share it on here.

 

[mrFinpgh]

Thought I could share this here and put some more information into the forum. 

I did a little experiment this afternoon while waiting for some glue to dry.  I sanded a piece of ash to 150 and raised the grain w/ distilled water.  After it was dry, I scuffed half the piece with 150g mirka abranet and left the other half with raised grain.

View attachment 1

Then I applied the Osmo with a piece of a red buffer pad

View attachment 2

At this point, the main thing I noticed is that the side w/o scuff sanding (the right side) seemed to be a little more 3d looking.  But then, you can see some variation in colors on the unscuffed piece, too.  So many just an outcome of the wood.

Left Side (raised grain, scuffed)

View attachment 3

View attachment 5

Right Side (raised grain, no scuff)

View attachment 4

View attachment 6

There might be a minor difference in the depth of color between the scuffed/non-scuffed side, but it could just as easily be a consequence of the change in grain direction.  What was particularly worthwhile to notice was that both sides were about the same in terms of how they felt to the touch after being buffed w/ the red pad.  I was wondering whether the pad would cut the raised grain effectively enough, and it certainly did.

I need to take some photos of it, but I did another test last week where I planed a piece of Ash with a recently sharpened jack plane and sanded another piece to 150.  These have slightly different outcomes in terms of touch and reflecting light, but still relatively subtle. I will try to remember to get some pictures before the weekend is up.

 

[jhood]

Very interesting thread...  and I have never used Osmo but have been thinking of using it on an entry table that I am building out of Sapele...  but I want a darker finish on the sapele, like Schwarz used on his campaign chairs, which was black wax rubbed into the sapele and buffed off...  but I don't think that a wax finish on an entry table would be durable enough...  I don't want to stain, but a lot of you seem to use Osmo, and is there any way to get a similar finish using Osmo...?  basically just a darkening of the grain...  sort of a black translucent finish...?

JH

 

[ChuckM]

Sapele darkens over time, going to a rich brown with much less red in it than mahogany.

I used wipe-on poly on a sapele table, but I have a table cloth on the top to keep it from over darkening.

 

[ear3]

[member=71177]jhood[/member] Osmo now makes a color oil line. Haven't used it myself, so can't comment.

Very interesting thread...  and I have never used Osmo but have been thinking of using it on an entry table that I am building out of Sapele...  but I want a darker finish on the sapele, like Schwarz used on his campaign chairs, which was black wax rubbed into the sapele and buffed off...  but I don't think that a wax finish on an entry table would be durable enough...  I don't want to stain, but a lot of you seem to use Osmo, and is there any way to get a similar finish using Osmo...?  basically just a darkening of the grain...  sort of a black translucent finish...?

JH