TS55 REQ Plus - blade not straight

[ram]

This is an issue that has always been a problem with me.

The bevels of my cuts are never at a perfectly straight 90°. Yes, I've read the supplemental manual.

I've spent hours upon hours trying to tweak the blade tilt with the little screw at the front after loosening the front and back angle stops to get it perfectly at 0°. But still it's always slightly off. I'm not even cutting very thick wood. Just 18mm ply.

I think it's the rail that slightly bends along the horizontal axis when putting pressure to have the saw plunge down.
And the saw itself has a little play as well, which introduces an extra error.

How close to 90° do you people get your bevels? Am I expecting too much?

 

[peter halle]

I found that in a similar situation it helped to place the saw on the rail and then adjust the blade to perpendicular to the workpiece.  If the saw usually runs on the rail than that should be part of the adjusting process.

Just a suggestion.

Peter

 

[Michael Kellough]

The rail has foam strips underneath so it can rock a little if your saw guiding pressure shifts from side to side. Keep it consistently concentrated over the stiff rubber splinter guard.

If the saw rocks on the guide rail when the rail is on a flat surface then you have to trouble shoot.

Maybe the bevel adjustment screws have been over adjusted? Tilt the base just enough away from 90* that the screws are not touching and carefully tighten the bevel clamp screws. (I hold the saw in the air with one hand by the handle and gently press the plate against the trunnions while moving the other side to the screws -should touch both simultaneously- then tighten each clamp knob just a little one after the other until both are tight. Before adjusting the knobs are loosened just enough that the plate can move with hanging.) Then see if the saw rocks on the rail. If it does the base plate is twisted. You might be able twist it back. Most metals “want” to go back to the original state (assuming the plate was once flat). If you can’t get it flat you’ll have to replace it or semi-permanently add a shim to the corner that sits above the rail. If the saw rocks on the rail you’ll never get consistent 90* cuts.

When you’ve adjusted the saw and your technique so that the cuts have a consistent bevel the whole length of the cut then you can focus on getting the bevel to the exact angle you want. For this you’ll need a sturdy flat surface you can conveniently clamp the saw base plate to and a digital inclinometer (assuming you’re picky).

Now you have to measure the angle of the just cut bevel to see how much and which way the saw has to be adjusted to correct the cut. Clamp the saw to the reference surface. Now I’ll add a tip I haven’t seen mentioned before to shift the center of gravity to be over the trunnions so that slack in the trunnions is compressed. I put a 12” Quick-Grip clamp on the top of the saw housing with the bar cantilevered out to the the right (point of view above saw as in normal operation) and then use a spring clamp to add a weight to neutralize the way the saw wants to lean over the trunnions. Loosen the knobs and then re-tighten. This counter balancing trick will probably change the bevel setting a little so I make a fresh cut with the clamp and weight (using my left hand to add just enough weight to keep the saw from wobbling) and then put the saw back on the reference surface and clamp then measure the actual cut angle. Then I can loosen the knobs and adjust the screws. I don’t remember the pitch of the screws but factoring the pitch and the way that length can be divided by the lobes of the Torx you can determine how much the screws need to be turned to correct the bevel. Tighten the knobs and cut again.

I can get within a tenth of a degree this way. If I’m close (a tenth off) I can often get the rest of the way there by just altering the pressure applied to the saw while cutting.

 

[DeformedTree]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

I have a non-F,  it is extremely frustrating.  I bought it thru the re-con as that was the only way to get a metric ones, but had forgot that the non-F's have this issue.  [mad]

 

[ram]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

I have a non-F,  it is extremely frustrating.  I bought it thru the re-con as that was the only way to get a metric ones, but had forgot that the non-F's have this issue.  [mad]

I have the non F model. I didn't know the non F models had a defective design.
It's so frustrating that even after hours of tweaking the saw will not give me consistent cuts.
The little set screw in the front is a really crummy way to set the 0° angle.

 

[ram]

thank you for the thorough explanation. after testing, the soleplate was just slightly rocking. placing some masking tape on one corner resolved that.
however most of the rocking of the saw is related to the horizontal twisting of the rail when cutting (especially on cross cuts of smaller pieces).
When placing different supports around and under the rail, I get a more acceptable result. How do you prevent the twisting of the rail?

The rail has foam strips underneath so it can rock a little if your saw guiding pressure shifts from side to side. Keep it consistently concentrated over the stiff rubber splinter guard.

If the saw rocks on the guide rail when the rail is on a flat surface then you have to trouble shoot.
...

 

[nms]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

I have a non-F,  it is extremely frustrating.  I bought it thru the re-con as that was the only way to get a metric ones, but had forgot that the non-F's have this issue.  [mad]

Do you have a link on this? I imagine there must be a well documented thread here somewhere.

 

[Michael Kellough]

[member=67840]ram[/member]  The rail is flexible and will vaguely conform to whatever it’s sitting on. If it’s placed on a twisted board it will twist too.

When cutting short stuff you still need to support the majority of the rail, and the stock needs to be sitting on a flat support surface. MFT is great for this. Use more of the same thickness stock to support the rail on both sides of the stock. You should support the rail the length of the saw base on both sides of the workpiece. It might help to tape pieces together.

 

[DeformedTree]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

I have a non-F,  it is extremely frustrating.  I bought it thru the re-con as that was the only way to get a metric ones, but had forgot that the non-F's have this issue.  [mad]

Do you have a link on this? I imagine there must be a well documented thread here somewhere.

Link 1

Link 2

Try these 2 threads, gives you an idea what to search for, for more info

 

[ram]

In this thread at reply number 23 they are talking about loosening 2 torx screw at the back pivot. link

has anyone tried this? he's then talking about adjusting it with a flat screwdriver, but I'm not sure how that works, anyone have an idea?

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

I have a non-F,  it is extremely frustrating.  I bought it thru the re-con as that was the only way to get a metric ones, but had forgot that the non-F's have this issue.  [mad]

Do you have a link on this? I imagine there must be a well documented thread here somewhere.

Link 1

Link 2

Try these 2 threads, gives you an idea what to search for, for more info

 

[nms]

Try these 2 threads, gives you an idea what to search for, for more info

Oh that. I fine adjusted my bevel stop to square up ages ago. That's not defective. That's just something to adjust when needed and really something they should have covered in the manual. That was not the best way to design the saw though of course.

has anyone tried this? he's then talking about adjusting it with a flat screwdriver, but I'm not sure how that works, anyone have an idea?

Yes. Do it if needed. He's just saying loosen the screws only enough that you can use a flat screwdriver to move the plate by twisting in the spot indicated. Just a way of making a tiny incremental adjustment as opposed to loosening the plate completely.

 

[nms]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

Where did you read that the F models have any change to the bevel stop? The threads you linked were from before the F model was released, and [member=48572]Shane Holland[/member] said the only difference with the REQ F Plus is the imperial scale:https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/ask-festool/ts-55-req-f-model-changes/

 

[Shane Holland]

Is your saw a -F model or non-F.  The non F's models were defective in their design (which was fixed with the -F model).

Where did you read that the F models have any change to the bevel stop? The threads you linked were from before the F model was released, and [member=48572]Shane Holland[/member] said the only difference with the REQ F Plus is the imperial scale:https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/ask-festool/ts-55-req-f-model-changes/

I didn't say it was the only change, but that's the most significant difference between the two. Festool doesn't always state ALL of the changes from model to model and sometimes there are rolling changes without a product number change. This was the case with 561566 (the now discontinued version of the TS 55). You can read my announcement about the change to the bevel stop in the thread below:
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/festool-sales-dealer-area/ts-55-req-update/msg401151/#msg401151

 

[ram]

Small update. I've reset the zero position by loosening the 2 torx screws in the back and the results are definitely better/acceptable.

Mitre cuts are a complete disaster though...I simply can't get a nice 45° cut.
Even when removing the blade guard and using a Wixey digital readout to set the angle at 45° the cut is still off by a degree or so after the cut.
It's too difficult to hold machine perfectly still and at the same angle while cutting. The cut is very uneven because there is too much play in the machine.

It's so frustrating because I'm spending more time (re)calibrating the saw than actually cutting. I'm beginning to think I should just get a table
saw and use the TS55 to rip panels to manageable sizes. Because I'm not getting the precision I desire and I keep wasting time and wood.

 

[Gregor]

Mitre cuts are a complete disaster though...I simply can't get a nice 45° cut.
Even when removing the blade guard and using a Wixey digital readout to set the angle at 45° the cut is still off by a degree or so after the cut.
It's too difficult to hold machine perfectly still and at the same angle while cutting.

Use the left hand to push the baseplate down (on the side opposing the blade) onto the material/rail on angle cuts.

The cut is very uneven because there is too much play in the machine.

Is the play in the machine itself or is it the machine tilting from the material/rail from the head moving the center of gravity outside of the area of the baseplate?

It's so frustrating because I'm spending more time (re)calibrating the saw than actually cutting. I'm beginning to think I should just get a table
saw and use the TS55 to rip panels to manageable sizes. Because I'm not getting the precision I desire and I keep wasting time and wood.

There's always the option of Festool service.

Maybe take a cheap piece of MDF, make some videos on the problem (including the full process, so they can see what and how you're doing it) to send them and ask for help? Possibly it's a stupidly simple thing that we all here overlooked when trying to help you, which would get visible when actually seeing the process?

 

[ram]

Is the play in the machine itself or is it the machine tilting from the material/rail from the head moving the center of gravity outside of the area of the baseplate?

kinda both actually. The machine itself has a little play in it. not much but enough to throw the angle off. And the rail itself also does flex a bit.
And the fact that it's difficult to hold the machine still. all these little errors add up.

Maybe take a cheap piece of MDF, make some videos on the problem (including the full process, so they can see what and how you're doing it) to send them and ask for help? Possibly it's a stupidly simple thing that we all here overlooked when trying to help you, which would get visible when actually seeing the process?

I'll give that a go this weekend.

 

[Gregor]

The machine itself has a little play in it. not much but enough to throw the angle off.

In case the play is between the blade and the machine: tighten the arbor correctly, it's spring loaded.
In case the play is between the base and 'the machine': send it to service.

And the rail itself also does flex a bit.

Mine only does that when I don't support the parts that are hanging over the workpiece.

And the fact that it's difficult to hold the machine still.

Holding down the plate on miter cuts solved that part for me.

Maybe take a cheap piece of MDF, make some videos on the problem (including the full process, so they can see what and how you're doing it) to send them and ask for help? Possibly it's a stupidly simple thing that we all here overlooked when trying to help you, which would get visible when actually seeing the process?

I'll give that a go this weekend.

Maybe upload the videos so we can take a look?